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02-08-2019, 01:03 PM   #121
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QuoteOriginally posted by RonHendriks1966 Quote
Well that is an interesting question.

- FA (Ltd) lenses: 31mm, 43mm, 77mm, 50mm/f1.4
-.
50/1.4 limited?

02-08-2019, 01:32 PM   #122
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QuoteOriginally posted by Chris Mak Quote
But do you yourself expect a good new APS-C body to sell in significant numbers, being realistic I mean? I would expect a new very good FF to sell better. The only sales driving factor with a new APS-C body as far as I can see, would be a very competitive price..
I think there are many, many more people who could or would afford an $800 camera than a $1800 camera no matter the specs. I would like to know how many K-3s they sold compared to K-1s. My (barely) educated guess is that they sold twice as many K-3s.

Now, if the new APS-C model is $1200 or more, that makes its case that much harder. Although you still have to consider lenses. For the cost of a new K-1ii body I bought (some used, some new) a K-3ii, a 15LTD, a 40LTD, a 55-300PLM, a 35mm Plastic Fantastic, and a Rokinon 8mm fisheye.
02-08-2019, 01:37 PM   #123
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QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote
50/1.4 limited?
(Ltd) so the 50 is just an old lens and not Ltd.

---------- Post added 08-02-19 at 21:41 ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by ThorSanchez Quote
I think there are many, many more people who could or would afford an $800 camera than a $1800 camera no matter the specs. I would like to know how many K-3s they sold compared to K-1s. My (barely) educated guess is that they sold twice as many K-3s.

Now, if the new APS-C model is $1200 or more, that makes its case that much harder. Although you still have to consider lenses. For the cost of a new K-1ii body I bought (some used, some new) a K-3ii, a 15LTD, a 40LTD, a 55-300PLM, a 35mm Plastic Fantastic, and a Rokinon 8mm fisheye.
The K-3 was expensive with introduction and not as succesfull as K-5 and the followers to that series. I think K-1 (ii) sold more copies then K-3 (ii) did.

Price in the Netherlands for the K-3. It took a long time to go below 1000 euro.
Pentax K-3 Zwart - Prijzen - Tweakers
02-08-2019, 01:50 PM   #124
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QuoteOriginally posted by Chris Mak Quote
The K1's speed (or lack of it), fps and buffer clearing is not an issue for me, the DA560 is a slow lens anyhow. Accuracy and reliabilty AF wise ís.
Speed, lens wise and body wise, is of course one of the reasons for moving towards Nikon....
If I was shooting action for money, or a dedicated birder I would've had a D850 by now.

As things are, I will upgrade to a higher performance camera, and buy a lens or two in the meanwhile. For airshows, the K-1 does well.

02-08-2019, 01:50 PM   #125
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QuoteOriginally posted by RonHendriks1966 Quote
The K-3 was expensive with introduction and not as succesfull as K-5 and the followers to that series. I think K-1 (ii) sold more copies then K-3 (ii) did.

Price in the Netherlands for the K-3. It took a long time to go below 1000 euro.
Pentax K-3 Zwart - Prijzen - Tweakers
Why would you expect the K-3ii replacement to be priced so cheaply?
Wasn't even the KP priced over your 1000 euro limit for quite some time??
02-08-2019, 01:58 PM   #126
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QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
Why would you expect the K-3ii replacement to be priced so cheaply?
Wasn't even the KP priced over your 1000 euro limit for quite some time??
Time travels the other way around. We had a group purchase for the K-5 in 2010. So we could buy the K-5 at start for 945 euro. So the K-3 was coming from that perspective much more expensive at the time.
02-08-2019, 02:06 PM   #127
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QuoteOriginally posted by RonHendriks1966 Quote
Time travels the other way around. We had a group purchase for the K-5 in 2010. So we could buy the K-5 at start for 945 euro. So the K-3 was coming from that perspective much more expensive at the time.
On U.S. Thanksgiving Day 2018, the KP was priced at $900, which an on-line currency converter says is worth 1019 euro today {I don't know what it was worth then}.
I thought that was a reasonable price for the KP then, and planned to purchase one someday {like Black Friday this year}.
Surely that would have been a reasonable price for a brand new K-3ii replacement.
02-08-2019, 02:33 PM - 1 Like   #128
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QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
On U.S. Thanksgiving Day 2018, the KP was priced at $900, which an on-line currency converter says is worth 1019 euro today {I don't know what it was worth then}.
I thought that was a reasonable price for the KP then, and planned to purchase one someday {like Black Friday this year}.
Surely that would have been a reasonable price for a brand new K-3ii replacement.
$900 = €806


I wrote about this two years ago.

Bang for the buck! - PentaxForums.com

Camera gear is expensive and we start to see those prices as normal.

---------- Post added 08-02-19 at 22:40 ----------

The K-70 is now 699 euro overhere while the K-50 went down to 379 euro after a year. That is what the camera industrie is doing at the time. Squeeze as much money out of the left over customers as possible.

02-09-2019, 04:51 AM - 1 Like   #129
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QuoteOriginally posted by RonHendriks1966 Quote
Time travels the other way around. We had a group purchase for the K-5 in 2010. So we could buy the K-5 at start for 945 euro. So the K-3 was coming from that perspective much more expensive at the time.
If we compare apples to oranges, no wonder the results feels deceiving.
02-09-2019, 05:01 AM   #130
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QuoteOriginally posted by thibs Quote
If we compare apples to oranges, no wonder the results feels deceiving.
You don't think that price development has an influence on potential customers?
02-09-2019, 05:27 AM - 1 Like   #131
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
If I was shooting action for money, or a dedicated birder I would've had a D850 by now.
That's not what die hard Pentaxians do.
02-09-2019, 07:27 AM   #132
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QuoteOriginally posted by RonHendriks1966 Quote
You don't think that price development has an influence on potential customers?
Of course it does - but camera companies are not charities ... they need to charge enough to stay in business, and customers will spend what they can. That is why I went from a 35mm Canon EOS Elan to a Canon Digital Rebel. In the age of film, the APS Rebel line was 'beneath' my aspirations, but in digital, so-called "Full Frame" was more than I was willing to spend.
02-09-2019, 08:35 AM - 1 Like   #133
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QuoteOriginally posted by RonHendriks1966 Quote
$900 = €806


I wrote about this two years ago.

Bang for the buck! - PentaxForums.com

Camera gear is expensive and we start to see those prices as normal.


The K-70 is now 699 euro overhere while the K-50 went down to 379 euro after a year. That is what the camera industrie is doing at the time. Squeeze as much money out of the left over customers as possible.
How are you determining what you consider 'reasonable' prices to be?
Do you have more insight into the cost of manufacturing cameras than anyone else here has?

I note that the Nikon D7500 is priced over $1000 and the Nikon D500 is priced over the Pentax K-1ii at B&H.
02-09-2019, 08:46 AM   #134
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QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
I note that the Nikon D7500 is priced over $1000 and the Nikon D500 is priced over the Pentax K-1ii at B&H.
Thom Hogan wrote that the D500 isn't selling anymore. So no matter what the price is, it is not moving anymore.

About that bang for the buck. The price of the set I mentioned went up 77 % while inflation in that period was only 20 %. The inflation is a good messurement of what salary where growing over time. So equipment just went more expensive over time. That makes them feel more expensive. I know manufacturers have to make a profit, but that doesn't make my income or your pension any higher.
02-09-2019, 08:59 AM   #135
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QuoteOriginally posted by RonHendriks1966 Quote
Thom Hogan wrote that the D500 isn't selling anymore. So no matter what the price is, it is not moving anymore.
When the D850 {currently still priced over $3K} first came out, Nikon users started asking whether the D500 still had a place, since crop mode of a D850 is a D500. If people can say that a $3K camera replaces a $1K camera, then perhaps you are over-stating the situation. The fact remains that companies will charge what they need, and the customers will respond based on their needs and resources. As I said earlier, when I moved from film to digital, I chose to move from "FF" to "APS" because of my needs and resources.
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