Sigma stops K-Mount support

**BigMackCam** · 09-11-2019, 09:26 PM

Originally posted by reh321

Perhaps Sigma counts sales in each mount each year. Even your great purchasing effort cannot make up for the fact that there are only so many of us.

That's it in a nutshell... There aren't that many of us Pentax users to begin with - at least, not compared to the really big brands. A significant number of us won't have bought a single new Sigma lens. Some, like me, will have bought a small few over a number of years... and then, a very small number will be committed Sigma lens purchasers. Sadly, it's all down to the numbers...

**clackers** · 09-11-2019, 09:47 PM

Yep, if they won't make lenses for Fuji because it's uneconomical (quote from their CEO: "I really wish we could make a lens for the X mount system but right now, just because our resources are limited, we don’t have such a plan") they certainly won't for Pentax!

They're such a small company - 100 million yen capitalization - one business mistake and the family business is up in smoke!

bladerunner6 · 09-11-2019, 10:07 PM

Originally posted by BigMackCam

That's it in a nutshell... There aren't that many of us Pentax users to begin with - at least, not compared to the really big brands. A significant number of us won't have bought a single new Sigma lens. Some, like me, will have bought a small few over a number of years... and then, a very small number will be committed Sigma lens purchasers. Sadly, it's all down to the numbers...

Yes, it is down to numbers. So no Fuji, no Pentax, no Sony A and not very many MFT.

I realized I bought into a niche brand and I am fine with it.

Did I buy a new Tamron and Sigma to help support their efforts and because I like the lenses-yes.

But that didn’t help and I am okay with that.

From now on I will support the K mount by buying new from Pentax-yes.

We still have a vastly better lineup than Fuji and Ricoh cares about our future versus Sony with the A mount.

And we are seeing growth versus Olympus.

**luftfluss** · 09-11-2019, 10:08 PM - **2 Likes**

Poor @clackers has to copy & paste his thoughts into 2 concurrent threads that discuss the same topic...

JPT · 09-12-2019, 12:58 AM - **11 Likes**

Originally posted by clackers

Yep, if they won't make lenses for Fuji because it's uneconomical (quote from their CEO: "I really wish we could make a lens for the X mount system but right now, just because our resources are limited, we don’t have such a plan") they certainly won't for Pentax!

They're such a small company - 100 million yen capitalization - one business mistake and the family business is up in smoke!

You’ll find that a huge number of Japanese companies state their capitalization at exactly 100,000,000 yen. One yen more and they’ll trigger a higher rate of tax on a portion of their income. So Sigma is way bigger than that 1m dollar figure would indicate.

They can afford to make loss making products and live to tell the tale. Pretty much their whole camera and sensor business is testament to that. But I don’t think they have much sentimental attachment to Pentax, so there’s no reason to persist with loss making products in K-mount.

However, I don’t see why this attracting so much attention at this moment. It has been pretty obvious what is happening for years now. Pentax was never the best choice of mount if you wanted to use Sigma anyway.

Despite all the predictions that Pentax is dying, K-mount is the only DSLR mount that looks fully alive. SA mount is officially finished. A-mount was effectively done some time ago. Nikon and Canon DSLR are being superseded by mirrorless mounts targeting the same users and price points. I think you’d have to be naive to think they’ll keep making DSLRs any longer than they have to.

K-mount on the other hand has a future roadmap and public plans for at least one new high end camera. They’ve made statements about their commitment to DSLRs. The company itself is not in financial difficulty.

**BigMackCam** · 09-12-2019, 01:43 AM - **5 Likes**

Originally posted by JPT

Despite all the predictions that Pentax is dying, K-mount is the only DSLR mount that looks fully alive.

...

K-mount on the other hand has a future roadmap and public plans for at least one new high end camera. They’ve made statements about their commitment to DSLRs. The company itself is not in financial difficulty.

After the apparent glut of doom and gloom posts I've been wading through of late, this is a breath of fresh air (and I agree wholeheartedly)...

reh321 · 09-12-2019, 05:28 AM

Originally posted by luftfluss

Poor @clackers has to copy & paste his thoughts into 2 concurrent threads that discuss the same topic...

@Adam and @BigMackCam have narrowed it down to this one thread now.

**Pål Jensen** · 09-12-2019, 06:15 AM

Originally posted by JPT

Despite all the predictions that Pentax is dying, K-mount is the only DSLR mount that looks fully alive. SA mount is officially finished. A-mount was effectively done some time ago. Nikon and Canon DSLR are being superseded by mirrorless mounts targeting the same users and price points. I think you’d have to be naive to think they’ll keep making DSLRs any longer than they have to.

I seriously doubt Nikon and Canon will discontinue or stall development in segments where they enjoy a huge marketshare...

biz-engineer · 09-12-2019, 07:29 AM

Originally posted by Pål Jensen

I seriously doubt Nikon and Canon will discontinue or stall development in segments where they enjoy a huge marketshare...

I think, Nikon and Canon want to keep the same market share that they had with DSLR, but they intend to do it with mirrorless product lines. And since Sony was before Canon and Nikon with MILC, Canon and Nikon now have to cross bridge a gap as fast as possible to prevent Sony to become the new Canon. Currently, Canon and Nikon are 100% focused on bringing mirrorless systems that compete with Sony. No DSLR dev. I'm afraid.

bladerunner6 · 09-12-2019, 08:11 AM

Originally posted by BigMackCam

After the apparent glut of doom and gloom posts I've been wading through of late, this is a breath of fresh air (and I agree wholeheartedly)...

I do agree Pentax has a roadmap that they are executing, if slowly and they are absolutely committed to DSLRS.

And in addition to the roadmap they drop in an updated lens now and then unannounced.

Sure, I wish Sigma and Tamron still supported the K-Mount. Some of their lenses are more affordable than their Pentax counterparts, the Sigma 18-300 is definitely the pick of the litter for superzooms and they have some more affordable long telephoto zooms.

But in the end the biggest changes for me are if/when I buys superzoom it will be a Pentax. Right now I am pretty happy with my lens lineup and really am not ready to buy anything new or used.

And what I might want to buy in the future I can see Pentax offering something that fits my bill well enough.

dstar · 09-12-2019, 08:11 AM

What do you think about Canon 90D?

**Serkevan** · 09-12-2019, 08:35 AM

Originally posted by dstar

What do you think about Canon 90D?

Probably has been in development for a while. Seems like their way to consolidate the mid-range DSLRs into a single product line (there will probably be an entry-level and, *maybe*, a 7DMk2 successor bodies coming soon).

Mistral75 · 09-12-2019, 09:30 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by biz-engineer

(...) Currently, Canon and Nikon are 100% focused on bringing mirrorless systems that compete with Sony. No DSLR dev. I'm afraid.

None at all.

Canon officially releases EOS 90D DSLR with 32.5 Megapixels and 4K video: Digital Photography Review

Nikon developing D6 professional DSLR: Digital Photography Review

Nikon working on 120-300mm F2.8E full-frame tele-zoom lens: Digital Photography Review

Kunzite · 09-12-2019, 09:40 AM

Right; they haven't stopped - they just slowed down to Pentax' pace

**Rondec** · 09-12-2019, 09:55 AM

Sigma is releasing 2 full frame L mount cameras with some accompanying lenses. One will have a Foveon sensor and the other is an underspecified, but tiny Bayer sensor. That sort of thing is going to soak up a bunch of resources and I wouldn't expect them to be designing and releasing new lenses for SLR registration distances for quite awhile if ever.

At the same time, this sort of move, with the accompanying dedication of R and D funds, could hurt Sigma quite a bit if these cameras sell in the quantities that SA mount cameras have in the past. If Pentax's market share is 2 percent, I can't imagine how low Sigma's is and I have no idea why either of these cameras would change that.

09-11-2019, 10:07 PM	#93
bladerunner6 Pentaxian Join Date: Nov 2014 Photos: Albums Posts: 2,080	Originally posted by BigMackCam That's it in a nutshell... There aren't that many of us Pentax users to begin with - at least, not compared to the really big brands. A significant number of us won't have bought a single new Sigma lens. Some, like me, will have bought a small few over a number of years... and then, a very small number will be committed Sigma lens purchasers. Sadly, it's all down to the numbers... Yes, it is down to numbers. So no Fuji, no Pentax, no Sony A and not very many MFT. I realized I bought into a niche brand and I am fine with it. Did I buy a new Tamron and Sigma to help support their efforts and because I like the lenses-yes. But that didn’t help and I am okay with that. From now on I will support the K mount by buying new from Pentax-yes. We still have a vastly better lineup than Fuji and Ricoh cares about our future versus Sony with the A mount. And we are seeing growth versus Olympus. Last edited by bladerunner6; 09-11-2019 at 11:21 PM.

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09-11-2019, 09:26 PM	#91
BigMackCam Digitiser of Film Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: North East of England Posts: 20,674	Originally posted by reh321 Perhaps Sigma counts sales in each mount each year. Even your great purchasing effort cannot make up for the fact that there are only so many of us. That's it in a nutshell... There aren't that many of us Pentax users to begin with - at least, not compared to the really big brands. A significant number of us won't have bought a single new Sigma lens. Some, like me, will have bought a small few over a number of years... and then, a very small number will be committed Sigma lens purchasers. Sadly, it's all down to the numbers...

09-11-2019, 09:47 PM	#92
clackers Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Melbourne Photos: Albums Posts: 16,397	Yep, if they won't make lenses for Fuji because it's uneconomical (quote from their CEO: "I really wish we could make a lens for the X mount system but right now, just because our resources are limited, we don’t have such a plan") they certainly won't for Pentax! They're such a small company - 100 million yen capitalization - one business mistake and the family business is up in smoke!

09-11-2019, 10:08 PM - 2 Likes	#94
luftfluss Site Supporter Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: NJ Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 11,619	Poor @clackers has to copy & paste his thoughts into 2 concurrent threads that discuss the same topic...

09-12-2019, 12:58 AM - 11 Likes	#95
JPT Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Tokyo Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,821	Originally posted by clackers Yep, if they won't make lenses for Fuji because it's uneconomical (quote from their CEO: "I really wish we could make a lens for the X mount system but right now, just because our resources are limited, we don’t have such a plan") they certainly won't for Pentax! They're such a small company - 100 million yen capitalization - one business mistake and the family business is up in smoke! You’ll find that a huge number of Japanese companies state their capitalization at exactly 100,000,000 yen. One yen more and they’ll trigger a higher rate of tax on a portion of their income. So Sigma is way bigger than that 1m dollar figure would indicate. They can afford to make loss making products and live to tell the tale. Pretty much their whole camera and sensor business is testament to that. But I don’t think they have much sentimental attachment to Pentax, so there’s no reason to persist with loss making products in K-mount. However, I don’t see why this attracting so much attention at this moment. It has been pretty obvious what is happening for years now. Pentax was never the best choice of mount if you wanted to use Sigma anyway. Despite all the predictions that Pentax is dying, K-mount is the only DSLR mount that looks fully alive. SA mount is officially finished. A-mount was effectively done some time ago. Nikon and Canon DSLR are being superseded by mirrorless mounts targeting the same users and price points. I think you’d have to be naive to think they’ll keep making DSLRs any longer than they have to. K-mount on the other hand has a future roadmap and public plans for at least one new high end camera. They’ve made statements about their commitment to DSLRs. The company itself is not in financial difficulty.

09-12-2019, 01:43 AM - 5 Likes	#96
BigMackCam Digitiser of Film Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: North East of England Posts: 20,674	Originally posted by JPT Despite all the predictions that Pentax is dying, K-mount is the only DSLR mount that looks fully alive. ... K-mount on the other hand has a future roadmap and public plans for at least one new high end camera. They’ve made statements about their commitment to DSLRs. The company itself is not in financial difficulty. After the apparent glut of doom and gloom posts I've been wading through of late, this is a breath of fresh air (and I agree wholeheartedly)...

09-12-2019, 05:28 AM	#97
reh321 Pentaxian Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: South Bend, IN, USA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 23,180	Originally posted by luftfluss Poor @clackers has to copy & paste his thoughts into 2 concurrent threads that discuss the same topic... @Adam and @BigMackCam have narrowed it down to this one thread now.

09-12-2019, 06:15 AM	#98
Pål Jensen Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Norway Photos: Albums Posts: 4,371	Originally posted by JPT Despite all the predictions that Pentax is dying, K-mount is the only DSLR mount that looks fully alive. SA mount is officially finished. A-mount was effectively done some time ago. Nikon and Canon DSLR are being superseded by mirrorless mounts targeting the same users and price points. I think you’d have to be naive to think they’ll keep making DSLRs any longer than they have to. I seriously doubt Nikon and Canon will discontinue or stall development in segments where they enjoy a huge marketshare...

09-12-2019, 07:29 AM	#99
biz-engineer Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2015 Photos: Gallery Posts: 12,232	Originally posted by Pål Jensen I seriously doubt Nikon and Canon will discontinue or stall development in segments where they enjoy a huge marketshare... I think, Nikon and Canon want to keep the same market share that they had with DSLR, but they intend to do it with mirrorless product lines. And since Sony was before Canon and Nikon with MILC, Canon and Nikon now have to cross bridge a gap as fast as possible to prevent Sony to become the new Canon. Currently, Canon and Nikon are 100% focused on bringing mirrorless systems that compete with Sony. No DSLR dev. I'm afraid.

09-12-2019, 08:11 AM	#100
bladerunner6 Pentaxian Join Date: Nov 2014 Photos: Albums Posts: 2,080	Originally posted by BigMackCam After the apparent glut of doom and gloom posts I've been wading through of late, this is a breath of fresh air (and I agree wholeheartedly)... I do agree Pentax has a roadmap that they are executing, if slowly and they are absolutely committed to DSLRS. And in addition to the roadmap they drop in an updated lens now and then unannounced. Sure, I wish Sigma and Tamron still supported the K-Mount. Some of their lenses are more affordable than their Pentax counterparts, the Sigma 18-300 is definitely the pick of the litter for superzooms and they have some more affordable long telephoto zooms. But in the end the biggest changes for me are if/when I buys superzoom it will be a Pentax. Right now I am pretty happy with my lens lineup and really am not ready to buy anything new or used. And what I might want to buy in the future I can see Pentax offering something that fits my bill well enough.

09-12-2019, 08:11 AM	#101
dstar Pentaxian Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Albuquerque NM Photos: Albums Posts: 475	What do you think about Canon 90D?

09-12-2019, 08:35 AM	#102
Serkevan Site Supporter Join Date: May 2019 Photos: Albums Posts: 5,976	Originally posted by dstar What do you think about Canon 90D? Probably has been in development for a while. Seems like their way to consolidate the mid-range DSLRs into a single product line (there will probably be an entry-level and, maybe, a 7DMk2 successor bodies coming soon).

09-12-2019, 09:30 AM - 1 Like	#103
Mistral75 Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Paris, France Posts: 7,527	Originally posted by biz-engineer (...) Currently, Canon and Nikon are 100% focused on bringing mirrorless systems that compete with Sony. No DSLR dev. I'm afraid. None at all. Canon officially releases EOS 90D DSLR with 32.5 Megapixels and 4K video: Digital Photography Review Nikon developing D6 professional DSLR: Digital Photography Review Nikon working on 120-300mm F2.8E full-frame tele-zoom lens: Digital Photography Review

09-12-2019, 09:40 AM	#104
Kunzite Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Romania Posts: 15,132	Right; they haven't stopped - they just slowed down to Pentax' pace

09-12-2019, 09:55 AM	#105
Rondec Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Gladys, Virginia Photos: Gallery Posts: 27,653	Sigma is releasing 2 full frame L mount cameras with some accompanying lenses. One will have a Foveon sensor and the other is an underspecified, but tiny Bayer sensor. That sort of thing is going to soak up a bunch of resources and I wouldn't expect them to be designing and releasing new lenses for SLR registration distances for quite awhile if ever. At the same time, this sort of move, with the accompanying dedication of R and D funds, could hurt Sigma quite a bit if these cameras sell in the quantities that SA mount cameras have in the past. If Pentax's market share is 2 percent, I can't imagine how low Sigma's is and I have no idea why either of these cameras would change that.