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11-04-2019, 03:00 PM   #3316
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QuoteOriginally posted by Erictator Quote
It depends... on how bad you want to win a KP... and discussion about the size and ergonomics of one might be relevant to hard hard you might try to win one.
Eric
This discussion is relevant to my interests (of winning a KP)

11-04-2019, 03:23 PM   #3317
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QuoteOriginally posted by Mikesul Quote
Exactly! the excessive size of DSLRs was probably the biggest hurdle I had to get past in the early digital era. Almost as big as my 6X7 in some of those early models!
I remember thinking my K10 was a big, chunky thing, but it was't much larger than the PZ-20 I had used for years before that.

I think the jump from autofocus film SLR to DSLR was pretty small, size-wise.
And the jump from full-featured manual-focus film SLR to AF SLR was pretty small, particularly if you included a winder. And a flash...

But I remember when I thought the Nikon F3 was huge. Compared to the K1, it's nothing...

But go to rangefinder land and there is all sorts of tininess... or not...
I have a Petri Color 35 zone-focuser and it is about as small as any camera I'd want to use.
But my wife's Minolta 7 is (like the Yashica mentioned above) about the same size as my K1000
And apart from the faster lens, it doesn't take markedly better photos than the Petri...



Yeah, the Petri's pretty small...

-Eric

Last edited by TwoUptons; 11-05-2019 at 03:28 AM.
11-04-2019, 03:27 PM   #3318
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QuoteOriginally posted by Erictator Quote
My Voigtlander Vito B was smaller than those... but it was a leaf shutter IIRC...
E.
The Yashica did have a leaf shutter - but I always considered it to be "clunky", just as i considered the Practika and the K-1000 to be "clunky". I always did, and still do, admired the cameras which got it all into a small space.
11-04-2019, 04:17 PM - 1 Like   #3319
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Well, winders were not part of the cameras any more than battery grips are part of most modern DSLRs. My point of reference is the gem like MX and range finders earlier. It is true, as Monochrome pointed out the batteries add to the size of DSLRs but film canisters and film took up even more room in film cameras. I am happy with my K-1ii but I still occasionally take our my old MX to enjoy its texture and shape..

11-04-2019, 05:11 PM   #3320
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The Minolta XK motor had the motor drive/winder integrated to the body. The winder is not removable.

Minolta XK Motor by Satosh Oka

QuoteQuote:
The exclusive one-piece motor-drive body enable reliability, efficiency, and ease of use superior to detachable motor units, plus utmost durability in extended heavy-duty use.
11-04-2019, 05:29 PM   #3321
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And in film days, what was saved through miniaturization was often given back with additional functionality.

A S1a is small-ish camera. Add a meter, and a winder, and a flash, and autofocus... can’t do it in 1965-ish...

1995-ish and you have a PZ-1p, with all of that and a date back (fancy). It’s a little bigger, but not giant... not even ten years later and a ZX-£ does almost all of that and it’s tiny again...

2006 and the K10... all of that and a little TV on the back... amazing...



I don't have a PZ-a, but I have the others and a K1...

-Eric

Last edited by TwoUptons; 11-05-2019 at 03:26 AM. Reason: added photo
11-04-2019, 05:48 PM   #3322
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QuoteOriginally posted by Not a Number Quote
The Minolta XK motor had the motor drive/winder integrated to the body. The winder is not removable.
That was true of my Canon Elan also, which caused me to go from Pentax to Canon. They hid it well within a T90-type body, but the overall body was somewhat larger .... which I tolerated in 1995 because of the modern AF lenses.

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11-04-2019, 05:49 PM - 1 Like   #3323
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QuoteOriginally posted by The Squirrel Mafia Quote
I'm probably one of the few that doesn't care whether this camera gets a movable LCD screen or not. It's great if it does & it's great if it doesn't. I can use the camera either way. Been doing it forever with a fixed screen K-50 & a fixed screen Sony a200 before that & a fixed screen Canon EOS before that. Hahaha!

My biggest interest is the AF accuracy, AF performance, & 5-axis IBIS that I hope they put in.
Same here. Would like a flexy/flippy/swively screen but doesn't matter much to me.
11-04-2019, 05:51 PM   #3324
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QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
That was true of my Canon Elan, which caused me to go from Pentax to Canon. They hid it well within a T90-type body, but the overall body was somewhat larger .... which I tolerated in 1995 because of the modern AF lenses.
I almost did the same thing, and I was thinking about the A2... but I got a great deal on a PZ-20 that took all my lenses...

-Eric
11-04-2019, 05:55 PM   #3325
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The thing that displeases me about the appearance of DSLRs is their chunkiness, and the main offender responsible for that is the depth. And it's not only the grip, but the entire area around the lens mount.

W x H x D

K2 144 x 92 x 57

K3 131.5 x 100 x 77.5

K5 130.5 x 96.5 x 72.5

KP 131.5 x 101 x 76

But numbers don't tell the whole story. According to the above, the KP is larger than the K5, in every dimension! Have a look at both of those bodies side by side, and tell us if you agree. Note that the K2 is shorter and significantly thinner than any of the DSLRs, and accordingly looks slender. Give me a DSLR that looks like a Leica M series, and I'd find it hard to resist.

There's no point in giving perfectly valid technical and physical reasons for the cunky appearance of the DSLRs - I understand all that. I'm merely saying that I much prefer the slender look of old.
11-04-2019, 06:27 PM - 2 Likes   #3326
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QuoteOriginally posted by Mikesul Quote
I don't now. I think he said a lot. He doesn't know everything about the camera but he did confirm a few things like the lcd screen. Not what we probably want to hear but he said what he could.
Mike, FWIW, I have no problems either way with the LCD screen. There are much more important things that require updating chief among them is a much improved autofocus and tracking along with better high ISO performance. I firmly believe that we APS-C shooters who have been waiting for this new camera will be pleasantly surprised by the improvement!
11-04-2019, 06:30 PM   #3327
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I not remember. Have they said they will give specs in November or will that only happen in 2020?
11-04-2019, 06:32 PM   #3328
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Built in 500GB SSD plus optional SD UHSII slots for backup...
11-04-2019, 07:34 PM   #3329
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I like this advice. I've seen calmed-down people talk themselves back into a frenzy.

---------- Post added 11-04-19 at 09:43 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
Well, we learned that the fixed LCD seems even more certain than it had.
It looks as if the fixed rear screen is set in stone.
11-04-2019, 08:04 PM   #3330
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QuoteOriginally posted by bobmaxja Quote
This is more than a prototype, too much details here with screw and all. I can almost bet this is the final body except for name and some dial printing.
This is what I said on sept 21, and I believe it's been confirmed today.

Some peoples cannot accept the obvious.
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