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5 Days Ago - 1 Like   #1456
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QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
"Massive improvement" over what? My KP {plus PLM lens} is already a massive improvement over the K-30 {plus preceding 55-300 lens} that proceeded it.
I'd like to be able to use AF-C as well as something besides single center-point AF. I get pretty good results shooting sports with AF-S, back-button focus, and center point, but things go downhill quickly if I use anything but a single center AF point.


I've never shot with a Nikon or Sony, but it sounds nice to select my kid and have the camera stay focused on him without keeping him in the dead middle of the frame and constantly hitting the back button.

---------- Post added 02-14-20 at 04:33 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
Smart people who don't need fast accurate tracking have Pentaxes. It's almost part of the definition of Pentax users.
I probably represent a small subset of Pentax users, but I bought a K-30 as a general-purpose ILC years ago. As my kids and their interests grew and evolved I found myself both decently invested in the Pentax system, and shooting a lot of sports.

5 Days Ago   #1457
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QuoteOriginally posted by ThorSanchez Quote
I'd like to be able to use AF-C as well as something besides single center-point AF. I get pretty good results shooting sports with AF-S, back-button focus, and center point, but things go downhill quickly if I use anything but a single center AF point.
Why don't you use expanded AF in AF.C so the camera can track across the frame? You can select the expansion from 5, 9, or 11 focus points?
5 Days Ago - 2 Likes   #1458
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QuoteOriginally posted by ThorSanchez Quote
I'd like to be able to use AF-C as well as something besides single center-point AF. I get pretty good results shooting sports with AF-S, back-button focus, and center point, but things go downhill quickly if I use anything but a single center AF point.


I've never shot with a Nikon or Sony, but it sounds nice to select my kid and have the camera stay focused on him without keeping him in the dead middle of the frame and constantly hitting the back button.
I do the same thing with the K-50. I keep beating the crap out of the back button. Hahaha! Forget AF.C. It's absolutely useless on the K-50.

I shoot a Nikon D7200 on occasion. When using 3D tracking, just place the dot on the subject or whatever you're following & hold the back button to initiate tracking. It doesn't matter if you move or the subject moves, the dot will stay on the intended subject. Now this doesn't mean it's 100% accurate either, but I sure do get way more keepers on that camera when using AFC. Mind you that the D7200 is fairly "old" now & its 3D tracking system is very rudimentary.

I'm almost certain that Ricoh will have an AF system better than the D7200. Heck, better than the D7500 too. If it's better than that, I'll be happy. I can imagine the 55-300mm PLM with that kind of AF performance.
5 Days Ago - 1 Like   #1459
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QuoteOriginally posted by ThorSanchez Quote
I'd like to be able to use AF-C as well as something besides single center-point AF. I get pretty good results shooting sports with AF-S, back-button focus, and center point, but things go downhill quickly if I use anything but a single center AF point.


I've never shot with a Nikon or Sony, but it sounds nice to select my kid and have the camera stay focused on him without keeping him in the dead middle of the frame and constantly hitting the back button.
The more points you pick, the longer it takes, of course, but I get focus with more points - I don’t know what you mean by “going downhill”. You certainly will lose focus on someone who wanders away from that point {animals do wander, which is why I use more points}.

5 Days Ago - 1 Like   #1460
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kobie Quote
Why don't you use expanded AF in AF.C so the camera can track across the frame? You can select the expansion from 5, 9, or 11 focus points?
In my experience that doesn't work. Shooting soccer and using AF.C I get focus on the background, other players, parents... but not the player I want very often.

5 Days Ago - 2 Likes   #1461
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All this no-learning-curve AF stuff sounds expensive.
5 Days Ago - 1 Like   #1462
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
At this point Pentax could put out the best tracking system ever invented and not bring in a single new customer. Their lack of fast focusing long lenses would seriously come back to bite them. People who need fast tracking have it (from other brands.) . Even if Pentax were to completely catch up, what would be the incentive to switch? Pentax would have to kick their buts plus come up with new long fast glass in a hurry. Fast AF is a system function. The body is just one of the parts.
That is certainly the problem for Pentax if they wish to appeal to the sports/wildlife shooters.


I only have experience with the DFA 150-450 on a K5IIs which seems reasonably 'snappy' but whether it really is compared to other brands, I can't tell, not having used them.

I do still hope for an AF advance in the K-new, if only to increase the AF coverage area and number of points. I would love a new telephoto prime lens to go along with the new body, even an AF motor update on the DA*300 would do.
5 Days Ago - 1 Like   #1463
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kobie Quote
Why don't you use expanded AF in AF.C so the camera can track across the frame? You can select the expansion from 5, 9, or 11 focus points?
Last time I tried that (shooting kids' football), my camera (K-5IIs) found all sorts of things to focus on but the kid with the ball.

5 Days Ago - 1 Like   #1464
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I don't even wanna try although my daughter doesn't move much by herself right now. But that will change fast.
My GR is still better at that than my K5
5 Days Ago - 2 Likes   #1465
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My experience has been that each new generation of Pentax cameras improves auto focus. So, the K5 wasn't as good as the K3 which isn't as good as the K-1 or K-1 II. The newer lenses are all either DC motor/PLM/ring motor driven and are pretty snappy if the camera body is adequate.

Obviously there is room for improvement and looks as though Pentax is working on that, but things aren't as dire as some would indicate.

(I do have kids -- 5 of them -- and have no trouble focusing on them with my K-1 and DFA zooms).
5 Days Ago - 1 Like   #1466
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QuoteOriginally posted by deus ursus Quote
Last time I tried that (shooting kids' football), my camera (K-5IIs) found all sorts of things to focus on but the kid with the ball.
Possibly because the K-5IIs doesn't offer that mode at all?

SAFOX 11 and 12 - implemented so far in K-3, K-3II, KP, K-1 and K-1 II - has two AF multi-point modes (besides the obvious spot and select): auto AF area and expanded AF area.
Auto AF area - the camera automatically choose where to focus, from the AF zone selected. This is similar to what the K-5IIs has, and works if there's no distracting background.
Expanded area AF - you're focusing on the subject, and the camera will do its best to follow it's x-y movement in the viewfinder by switching through the AF points from the AF zone selected. Basically, the red square tries to follow the subject.

While expanded area AF has its limitations and easily loses the subject (something I hope they improved in the K-new), your K-5iis doesn't even try.
P.S. I remember the same frustration when I used the K-5IIs... and I was very happy to see Expanded area AF being introduced with the K-3.
5 Days Ago - 1 Like   #1467
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
Possibly because the K-5IIs doesn't offer that mode at all?

SAFOX 11 and 12 - implemented so far in K-3, K-3II, KP, K-1 and K-1 II - has two AF multi-point modes (besides the obvious spot and select): auto AF area and expanded AF area.
Auto AF area - the camera automatically choose where to focus, from the AF zone selected. This is similar to what the K-5IIs has, and works if there's no distracting background.
Expanded area AF - you're focusing on the subject, and the camera will do its best to follow it's x-y movement in the viewfinder by switching through the AF points from the AF zone selected. Basically, the red square tries to follow the subject.

While expanded area AF has its limitations and easily loses the subject (something I hope they improved in the K-new), your K-5iis doesn't even try.
P.S. I remember the same frustration when I used the K-5IIs... and I was very happy to see Expanded area AF being introduced with the K-3.
This was one area where Hoya really dropped development. There were minor improvements from the K10 to the K5 with regard to auto focus, but they were tiny to say the least. And as far as I can remember, the K5 II only added a little improvement with focusing in tungsten lighting situations.

People complained constantly prior to the K3 about the size of the auto focus points (they were pretty big), the inability to track, and the wonkiness in certain lighting situations. And SDM lenses were hopeless when it came to tracking anything.

I would just say that Pentax is usable now with the right lenses and I expect continued improvements.
5 Days Ago - 2 Likes   #1468
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My biggest frustration with the current AF-C implementation is the (apparent) total lack of z motion compensation. To me, it appears that AF-C is just an auto-refresh version of AF-S. If the subject is moving towards the camera with the focus point confirmed and you fully press shutter release, it seems to wait to get another focus confirmation - fixes the focus of the lens, mirror moves, shutter moves, subjects moved...

It also appears to take longer to get focus confirmation, compared with AF-S.

There are work-arounds; pre-focus and wait, or use a small aperture and gains some depth of field to hide the problem. Neither is great for wild-life or the 'really-must-get' bride walking towards camera shots.

Because I find AF-S very accurate, even with the F1.4, pupil only in focus shot, I don't think Pentax have a problem with the focus sensing accuracy. What has been missing is the ability to process that information quickly enough to follow focus trend/subject motion.

The KNEW that was displayed last year visually appeared to have a different, larger, PDAF module. There is no way to visually determine changes to the processing capability on the inside, but it not unreasonable to expect that progress with the GRiii platform change to an Android based OS will have opened up many more options for processing hardware for the KNEW. All this (probable) new hardware is nothing without the appropriate software. I suspect that this is the main reason for the long delay between showing an apparently finished camera (hardware) and having something to sell (complete hardware/software solution).

I expect we will all (well most of us) be impressed with the end result, when it arrives.
5 Days Ago - 2 Likes   #1469
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
This was one area where Hoya really dropped development. There were minor improvements from the K10 to the K5 with regard to auto focus, but they were tiny to say the least. And as far as I can remember, the K5 II only added a little improvement with focusing in tungsten lighting situations.

People complained constantly prior to the K3 about the size of the auto focus points (they were pretty big), the inability to track, and the wonkiness in certain lighting situations. And SDM lenses were hopeless when it came to tracking anything.

I would just say that Pentax is usable now with the right lenses and I expect continued improvements.
The K-5 II was, for a while, the best in low light sensitivity - with its -3EV limit.
But you're right; what was needed was a new AF module, and new lenses (here Pentax was harmed the most)... And lots of other things.
4 Days Ago - 2 Likes   #1470
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QuoteOriginally posted by deus ursus Quote
Last time I tried that (shooting kids' football), my camera (K-5IIs) found all sorts of things to focus on but the kid with the ball.
I never had a problem shooting football, softball or cycling with my K-5 and I don't have a problem shooting sports with my K-1II. Weird. I must be lucky.
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