Win a Pentax Limited Lens: Raffle Now Live!

**Pål Jensen** · 10-25-2008, 04:41 AM

Originally posted by falconeye

Yeah. It looks like minimizing the focus screen image on entry to pentaprism and magnifying back on exit to the ocular (eye piece). Making smaller the whole pentaprism box. Isn't this exactly the kind of stuff Pentax ... is called Pentax?

I'm glad to see that somebody cares about the size of digital MF cameras. Not that I expect to be able to afford one. But... Those digital MF cameras in the field (Hasselblad, Leica S2 etc.) are true size monsters! They really don't belong into the 21th century...

Somebody should be able to do a smarter MF camera. Why not Pentax?

But isn't this what Pentax did back in 1984 with the first 645? I suspect it is just a small update on the old finder system on the Pentax 645's, which indeed are very compact for its type of camera.....

ftpaddict · 10-25-2008, 04:46 AM

None of the earlier prototypes featured a removable back.

vinzer · 10-25-2008, 04:55 AM

Originally posted by k100d

have you seen this ad here? looks like no AF motor ... but who knows really :S
Nikon “Big” Ad Photography Bay | Digital Camera Reviews, News and Resources

Yup, I saw that on one of the gadget blogs I frequent (I believe I saw it first on Gizmodo). On the Nikon rumors site, they're kinda hoping it'll be an MF system, but the safe bet would put it on a D3x model. I just don't see Nikon suddenly releasing an MF camera, given how they're possibly maxed out with building the new FF cameras and the D90 (plus lens runs for the 16-105), not to mention their inexperience with the MF format.

I could be wrong, though. In any case, should Nikon enter the MF wars, it'd be interesting to see what Pentax does.

That lack of an AF motor may probably be just an ad agency rendering oversight, and not really the model itself. I don't really know, too.

**Pål Jensen** · 10-25-2008, 05:19 AM

Originally posted by ftpaddict

None of the earlier prototypes featured a removable back.

The Pentax 645's had removable film inserts; not backs. The 645D is built around the same chassis. The sensor compartment is hinged so that cleaning of the sensor is easy. Theres no reason to assume user replaceable digital backs. However, this design makes it easy for Pentax to upgrade the camera with new sensors and image processing pipeline.

Attached Images

Last edited by Pål Jensen; 10-25-2008 at 05:24 AM.

**Pål Jensen** · 10-25-2008, 07:09 AM

This shows the film inserts. And the camera stripped!

**Douglas_of_Sweden** · 10-25-2008, 10:04 AM

Originally posted by Pål Jensen

The Pentax 645's had removable film inserts; not backs. The 645D is built around the same chassis. The sensor compartment is hinged so that cleaning of the sensor is easy. Theres no reason to assume user replaceable digital backs. However, this design makes it easy for Pentax to upgrade the camera with new sensors and image processing pipeline.

Sounds like a very clever construction. Is that sensor fully 6x4.5? Or will it be a sort of cropped MF?

**Pål Jensen** · 10-25-2008, 10:10 AM

Originally posted by Douglas_of_Sweden

Sounds like a very clever construction. Is that sensor fully 6x4.5? Or will it be a sort of cropped MF?

Pentax says they will make the sensor as "big" as possible something I interpret to mean both size (6X4,5) and MP. They suggest 50mp....

clawhammer · 10-25-2008, 08:35 PM

IIRC, most MF chips are 36x48mm, which isn't true 6x4.5 (which in reality wasn't true 60x45, but yeah). Even though I will probably never be able to afford one, I eagerly await a digital 645.

**Rorschach** · 10-26-2008, 01:24 AM

Good news. I'll be ready for digital MF...about 5-10 years after launch when the used market prices are within my reach

I have a couple of Pentax 6x7 lenses and the 6x7 to 645 adapter so it's merely a waiting game for me. Meanwhile I'll start using Rollei ATP (i.e. Kodak Tech Pan) for my landscapes.

Best regards,
Boucicaut

alohadave · 10-29-2008, 06:07 PM

Originally posted by Pål Jensen

This shows the film inserts. And the camera stripped!

That's very cool to see how much electronics is crammed in that case.

Graydon · 11-07-2008, 08:34 PM

Originally posted by Pål Jensen

Pentax says they will make the sensor as "big" as possible something I interpret to mean both size (6X4,5) and MP. They suggest 50mp....

My take on that is "the biggest sensor we can get into the thing and still hit the price point at which we think we'll have enough sales"; that price point was probably around 5 kUSD when they started (I base this on some translated interview comments about why they didn't release it), but there's no telling what the 24MP full frame cameras did to the calculation.

30MP and better sensitivity -- candlelight portraiture levels -- or seriously better colour depth -- really 16 bits per channel, say -- would probably sell entirely fine at a 5 kUSD price point.

soccerjoe5 · 11-08-2008, 03:08 AM

My uncle will love this. He's a portrait pro for 35 years already and uses mostly his 6x7 and 645. He's now gonna lend me and his son his extra Pentax or Mamiya 645 to play around with hehe.

Samsungian · 11-08-2008, 08:14 AM

I remember seeing Pentax USA president talking about launch price for 645D and dug it up for you all and the reply is from 19 months ago:

"Ned Bunnell , Apr 02, 2007; 11:50 a.m.

Thomas,

Sorry, can't help you with 645D pricing. It has not been set. I can offer that we'll likely be quite competitive in price vs the 31 mp Hassey, but no where near the $3-5k I've seen a few folks speculate on as the likely pricing on some photo forums. If one does a little research, you can find that the Kodak 31 mp sensor is not an inexpensive component.

Ned"

Originally posted by Graydon

My take on that is "the biggest sensor we can get into the thing and still hit the price point at which we think we'll have enough sales"; that price point was probably around 5 kUSD when they started (I base this on some translated interview comments about why they didn't release it), but there's no telling what the 24MP full frame cameras did to the calculation.

30MP and better sensitivity -- candlelight portraiture levels -- or seriously better colour depth -- really 16 bits per channel, say -- would probably sell entirely fine at a 5 kUSD price point.

Samsungian · 11-08-2008, 09:44 AM

I don't know if this link will work. Its a 31mp hassy with a lens for a little less than $18,000.

Hasselblad | H3DII-31 SLR Digital Camera Kit with | 70380550

Originally posted by Samsungian

I remember seeing Pentax USA president talking about launch price for 645D and dug it up for you all and the reply is from 19 months ago:

"Ned Bunnell , Apr 02, 2007; 11:50 a.m.

Thomas,

Sorry, can't help you with 645D pricing. It has not been set. I can offer that we'll likely be quite competitive in price vs the 31 mp Hassey, but no where near the $3-5k I've seen a few folks speculate on as the likely pricing on some photo forums. If one does a little research, you can find that the Kodak 31 mp sensor is not an inexpensive component.

Ned"

Graydon · 11-08-2008, 10:56 AM

Originally posted by Samsungian

I remember seeing Pentax USA president talking about launch price for 645D and dug it up for you all and the reply is from 19 months ago:

"Ned Bunnell , Apr 02, 2007; 11:50 a.m.
(Ned says "no where near 5 kUSD")

Assuming the Kodak 31 MP sensor, yes, it's not going to make 5 kUSD as a price point.

I think this is a big part of why they haven't released it.

Despite considerable rummaging, I'm not finding the translation of the interview with the Pentax guys where they talk about price point for the 645, so I could be totally out to lunch in remembering somewhere around there as the target price.

On the plus side, sensors are going to trend strongly down in price, even at that size.

10-25-2008, 07:09 AM	#20
Pål Jensen Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Norway Photos: Albums Posts: 4,371	This shows the film inserts. And the camera stripped! Attached Images

11-08-2008, 08:14 AM	#28
Samsungian Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Colorado USA Posts: 1,337	645D Launch price is MUCH HIGHER than 5K I remember seeing Pentax USA president talking about launch price for 645D and dug it up for you all and the reply is from 19 months ago: "Ned Bunnell , Apr 02, 2007; 11:50 a.m. Thomas, Sorry, can't help you with 645D pricing. It has not been set. I can offer that we'll likely be quite competitive in price vs the 31 mp Hassey, but no where near the $3-5k I've seen a few folks speculate on as the likely pricing on some photo forums. If one does a little research, you can find that the Kodak 31 mp sensor is not an inexpensive component. Ned" Originally posted by Graydon My take on that is "the biggest sensor we can get into the thing and still hit the price point at which we think we'll have enough sales"; that price point was probably around 5 kUSD when they started (I base this on some translated interview comments about why they didn't release it), but there's no telling what the 24MP full frame cameras did to the calculation. 30MP and better sensitivity -- candlelight portraiture levels -- or seriously better colour depth -- really 16 bits per channel, say -- would probably sell entirely fine at a 5 kUSD price point.

11-08-2008, 09:44 AM	#29
Samsungian Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Colorado USA Posts: 1,337	31mp Hassy is $18,000 with a lens from B&H. I don't know if this link will work. Its a 31mp hassy with a lens for a little less than $18,000. Hasselblad \| H3DII-31 SLR Digital Camera Kit with \| 70380550 Originally posted by Samsungian I remember seeing Pentax USA president talking about launch price for 645D and dug it up for you all and the reply is from 19 months ago: "Ned Bunnell , Apr 02, 2007; 11:50 a.m. Thomas, Sorry, can't help you with 645D pricing. It has not been set. I can offer that we'll likely be quite competitive in price vs the 31 mp Hassey, but no where near the $3-5k I've seen a few folks speculate on as the likely pricing on some photo forums. If one does a little research, you can find that the Kodak 31 mp sensor is not an inexpensive component. Ned" Last edited by Samsungian; 11-08-2008 at 09:45 AM. Reason: from changed to for

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
About the Pentax Medium Format Forum	Adam	Pentax Medium Format	10	09-15-2011 03:53 AM
If i was going to get into Medium format - tell me why Pentax (or other)?	JayR	Pentax Medium Format	32	09-04-2010 05:59 PM
Pentax medium format lenses on a DSLR?	Rorschach	Pentax SLR Lens Discussion	9	12-18-2007 06:30 PM
Suggestions for Pentax 35mm AND medium format	macdaddy	Pentax Medium Format	21	06-06-2007 06:34 PM

10-25-2008, 04:41 AM	#16
Pål Jensen Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Norway Photos: Albums Posts: 4,371	Originally posted by falconeye Yeah. It looks like minimizing the focus screen image on entry to pentaprism and magnifying back on exit to the ocular (eye piece). Making smaller the whole pentaprism box. Isn't this exactly the kind of stuff Pentax ... is called Pentax? I'm glad to see that somebody cares about the size of digital MF cameras. Not that I expect to be able to afford one. But... Those digital MF cameras in the field (Hasselblad, Leica S2 etc.) are true size monsters! They really don't belong into the 21th century... Somebody should be able to do a smarter MF camera. Why not Pentax? But isn't this what Pentax did back in 1984 with the first 645? I suspect it is just a small update on the old finder system on the Pentax 645's, which indeed are very compact for its type of camera.....

10-25-2008, 04:46 AM	#17
ftpaddict Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Yurp Photos: Gallery Posts: 4,666	None of the earlier prototypes featured a removable back.

10-25-2008, 04:55 AM	#18
vinzer Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Philippines Posts: 1,399	Originally posted by k100d have you seen this ad here? looks like no AF motor ... but who knows really :S Nikon “Big” Ad Photography Bay \| Digital Camera Reviews, News and Resources Yup, I saw that on one of the gadget blogs I frequent (I believe I saw it first on Gizmodo). On the Nikon rumors site, they're kinda hoping it'll be an MF system, but the safe bet would put it on a D3x model. I just don't see Nikon suddenly releasing an MF camera, given how they're possibly maxed out with building the new FF cameras and the D90 (plus lens runs for the 16-105), not to mention their inexperience with the MF format. I could be wrong, though. In any case, should Nikon enter the MF wars, it'd be interesting to see what Pentax does. That lack of an AF motor may probably be just an ad agency rendering oversight, and not really the model itself. I don't really know, too.

10-25-2008, 05:19 AM	#19
Pål Jensen Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Norway Photos: Albums Posts: 4,371	Originally posted by ftpaddict None of the earlier prototypes featured a removable back. The Pentax 645's had removable film inserts; not backs. The 645D is built around the same chassis. The sensor compartment is hinged so that cleaning of the sensor is easy. Theres no reason to assume user replaceable digital backs. However, this design makes it easy for Pentax to upgrade the camera with new sensors and image processing pipeline. Attached Images Last edited by Pål Jensen; 10-25-2008 at 05:24 AM.

10-25-2008, 10:04 AM	#21
Douglas_of_Sweden Site Supporter Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Stockholm Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,374	Originally posted by Pål Jensen The Pentax 645's had removable film inserts; not backs. The 645D is built around the same chassis. The sensor compartment is hinged so that cleaning of the sensor is easy. Theres no reason to assume user replaceable digital backs. However, this design makes it easy for Pentax to upgrade the camera with new sensors and image processing pipeline. Sounds like a very clever construction. Is that sensor fully 6x4.5? Or will it be a sort of cropped MF?

10-25-2008, 10:10 AM	#22
Pål Jensen Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Norway Photos: Albums Posts: 4,371	Originally posted by Douglas_of_Sweden Sounds like a very clever construction. Is that sensor fully 6x4.5? Or will it be a sort of cropped MF? Pentax says they will make the sensor as "big" as possible something I interpret to mean both size (6X4,5) and MP. They suggest 50mp....

10-25-2008, 08:35 PM	#23
clawhammer Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Logan, Utah Photos: Gallery Posts: 971	IIRC, most MF chips are 36x48mm, which isn't true 6x4.5 (which in reality wasn't true 60x45, but yeah). Even though I will probably never be able to afford one, I eagerly await a digital 645.

10-26-2008, 01:24 AM	#24
Rorschach Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Kuusamo, Finland Photos: Gallery Posts: 652	Good news. I'll be ready for digital MF...about 5-10 years after launch when the used market prices are within my reach I have a couple of Pentax 6x7 lenses and the 6x7 to 645 adapter so it's merely a waiting game for me. Meanwhile I'll start using Rollei ATP (i.e. Kodak Tech Pan) for my landscapes. Best regards, Boucicaut

10-29-2008, 06:07 PM	#25
alohadave Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Quincy, MA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,024	Originally posted by Pål Jensen This shows the film inserts. And the camera stripped! That's very cool to see how much electronics is crammed in that case.

11-07-2008, 08:34 PM	#26
Graydon Inactive Account Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Toronto Photos: Gallery Posts: 30	Originally posted by Pål Jensen Pentax says they will make the sensor as "big" as possible something I interpret to mean both size (6X4,5) and MP. They suggest 50mp.... My take on that is "the biggest sensor we can get into the thing and still hit the price point at which we think we'll have enough sales"; that price point was probably around 5 kUSD when they started (I base this on some translated interview comments about why they didn't release it), but there's no telling what the 24MP full frame cameras did to the calculation. 30MP and better sensitivity -- candlelight portraiture levels -- or seriously better colour depth -- really 16 bits per channel, say -- would probably sell entirely fine at a 5 kUSD price point.

11-08-2008, 03:08 AM	#27
soccerjoe5 Veteran Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Philippines Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,343	My uncle will love this. He's a portrait pro for 35 years already and uses mostly his 6x7 and 645. He's now gonna lend me and his son his extra Pentax or Mamiya 645 to play around with hehe.

11-08-2008, 10:56 AM	#30
Graydon Inactive Account Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Toronto Photos: Gallery Posts: 30	Originally posted by Samsungian I remember seeing Pentax USA president talking about launch price for 645D and dug it up for you all and the reply is from 19 months ago: "Ned Bunnell , Apr 02, 2007; 11:50 a.m. (Ned says "no where near 5 kUSD") Assuming the Kodak 31 MP sensor, yes, it's not going to make 5 kUSD as a price point. I think this is a big part of why they haven't released it. Despite considerable rummaging, I'm not finding the translation of the interview with the Pentax guys where they talk about price point for the 645, so I could be totally out to lunch in remembering somewhere around there as the target price. On the plus side, sensors are going to trend strongly down in price, even at that size.

Pentax Medium Format Patent

Win a Pentax Limited Lens: Raffle Now Live!