D FA 21 Limited is one of the three.

normhead · 05-16-2020, 07:56 AM - **3 Likes**

Originally posted by bertwert

Oh yeah, of course lots of uses, I'm not quite sure what I meant in my post there anyways... I'm thinking of picking up a 15 Ltd - which would be pretty similar to the 21 on FF. I have to say that I'm glad I don't have a K-1, as this new lens would be hard to avoid, even though it'll be well above my sensible budget...

Maybe I'm just thinking as an everyday situation lens, as 21 (or the 31 on FF) seems quite nice for that...

(Just another photo for those saying 21 isn't a great APS-C focal length...)

The cool thing for us, is, we chose between the 21 ltd. and 15 and basically decided 21 would be a more useful focal length. But we've had many times we thought we should have bought the 15.

This gives us 21 on APS-c and an equivalent to the 15 on FF. Both lenses we wanted in the same lens. Like getting a bonus lens.

The house appropriations committee has already approved the purchase.

**Digitalis** · 05-16-2020, 08:00 AM - **2 Likes**

Originally posted by normhead

The house appropriations committee has already approved the purchase.

That must always be a fun consultation.

timautin · 05-16-2020, 08:05 AM

YES! Count me in for the 21

. Seems the perfect landscape lens for the best landscape camera!

bertwert · 05-16-2020, 08:05 AM

Originally posted by normhead

The cool thing for us, is, we chose between the 21 ltd. and 15 and basically decided 21 would be a more useful focal length. But we've had many times we thought we should have bought the 15.

That's the same as me - I've considered switching the 10-17 to as I've never really warmed up to the fisheye, but I may just need more shooting with it - anyways I would probably find the 15 isn't for me anyways...

Originally posted by normhead

This gives us 21 on APS-c and an equivalent to the 15 on FF. Both lenses we wanted in the same lens. Like getting a bonus lens.

The house appropriations committee has already approved the purchase.

Good way of looking at it, are you planning on selling your DA then?

phoebus · 05-16-2020, 08:05 AM

Originally posted by Digitalis

That must always be a fun consultation.

Same here - easy discussion: I buy, we use...

normhead · 05-16-2020, 08:07 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Digitalis

That must always be a fun consultation.

It helps if it's lens she thinks she might use herself.
She now calls both my DA 55-300 PLM and my DFA 28-105 her lenses. She believe anything I buy for myself will be hers if she likes it enough. Getting a lens approved is a mixed blessing. I may only get partial use of the lens.

When we get to a scene for which it is suited, I may have to beg for it... again (and again and again.)

**Serkevan** · 05-16-2020, 08:09 AM

Originally posted by Digitalis

The Nikkor 20mm f/1.8G is about 355g and the shell of that is poly-carbonate and engineering plastic - so add the aluminum construction of the Limited and 500g seems to be a reasonable estimate.

Even the modern Z20/1.8 is supposed to weigh 505 g, and it's substantially larger (85 x 109 mm) than the DSLR version. Okay, it's a mirrorless design, but it's still got a 77mm filter thread, 14 elements and metal construction.

normhead · 05-16-2020, 08:11 AM

Originally posted by bertwert

That's the same as me - I've considered switching the 10-17 to as I've never really warmed up to the fisheye, but I may just need more shooting with it - anyways I would probably find the 15 isn't for me anyways...

Good way of looking at it, are you planning on selling your DA then?

Wash your mouth out with soap young man.

But seriously, it depends on the size of the new lens. The biggest advantage to the 21 is on a long canoe trip where I depend on 4:1 and larger zooms, the 21 can packed as an afterthought. It has tremendous, "the best lens for the job is the one you have with you" value. The new 21 looks to be a tad bigger. I already have the DA*55 1.4 filling the "tad bigger" slot in the lineup.

There's only so much room in the pelican case. DA 55-300 PLM, 100 macro, DA*55 1.4 and the 28-105 or 18-135 depending on whether or not I take the K-1 or K-3. The DA 21 fits in the spot where I keep my batteries. It doesn't look like the new one will.

The reason I still have any gear at all is because I religiously keep gear in the case, away from heat and humidity. When we get it, I'll be sitting there with the case trying to work out a plan.

Mistral75 · 05-16-2020, 08:16 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by northcoastgreg

(...)

If you look at some of the older FF roadmaps, it did appear as if Pentax wanted the third DFA* lens to be around 24mm. But that seemed to change in later roadmaps. (...)

Indeed. From CP+ 2016 until CP+ 2017 the 24x36 roadmap included the two following lenses:

Large Aperture Ultra Wide-Angle Single Focus Lens
Wide-Angle Single Focus Lens

From CP+ 2017 until yesterday the 24x36 roadmap included the two following lenses:

Ultra Wide-Angle Single Focus Lens (a D FA in red)
Large Aperture Wide-Angle Single Focus Lens (a D FA★ in orange)

The roadmap published yesterday includes the two following lenses:

HD Pentax-D FA 21 mm Limited
Large Aperture Wide-Angle Single Focus Lens (a D FA★ in orange)

In other words, in February 2017 the ultra-wide prime lens went from large aperture to mere D FA whereas the wide prime lens went from mere D FA to large aperture and ★ designation.

Wheatfield · 05-16-2020, 08:30 AM - **4 Likes**

Originally posted by deus ursus

😂

This post reminds me of a poster on a formula 1 discussion forum I used to frequent some time ago. On a saturday evening he posted a "I love you all, you're my best friends (sob sob)" kind of post. His next post was on sunday afternoon and was more like "I hate you all, you scumbags!" 😁

Alcohol brings out the best in me.

normhead · 05-16-2020, 08:33 AM

Originally posted by bertwert

That's the same as me - I've considered switching the 10-17 to as I've never really warmed up to the fisheye, but I may just need more shooting with it - anyways I would probably find the 15 isn't for me anyways...

I bought the Sigma 8-16 for serious images, as opposed to the not so serious fisheye images, but then, I hardly ever use that either. So I have two lenses I rarely use instead of one.

But when you want them, nothing else will do.

**acoufap** · 05-16-2020, 08:36 AM

Originally posted by Serkevan

Even the modern Z20/1.8 is supposed to weigh 505 g, and it's substantially larger (85 x 109 mm) than the DSLR version. Okay, it's a mirrorless design, but it's still got a 77mm filter thread, 14 elements and metal construction.

Originally posted by angerdan

I'd bet it will weight less than 400g.

Originally posted by Mistral75

I wouldn't expect the HD Pentax-D FA 21mm ED Limited DC WR to weigh less than 400g.

I don't know what a realistic weight could be. But I'm always surprised when I look at my DFA100WR and remember the weight of the DA20-40 Ltd. - both aluminum constructions. They prove that it's possible to construct lightweight using this material.

If the DFA 21 Ltd. weighs more than 500g I simply may think I'll let it pass, use my DA*11-18 @ 18 mm in FF mode and if nessecary crop the captures to 6309 x 4210px (26.5 Megapixel) in post. That gives me the angle of view of the DFA 21mm Ltd. - and 26.5 Megapixels should easily be enough in size.

Exciting times!

Wheatfield · 05-16-2020, 08:40 AM

Originally posted by bertwert

Oh yeah, of course lots of uses, I'm not quite sure what I meant in my post there anyways... I'm thinking of picking up a 15 Ltd - which would be pretty similar to the 21 on FF. I have to say that I'm glad I don't have a K-1, as this new lens would be hard to avoid, even though it'll be well above my sensible budget...

Maybe I'm just thinking as an everyday situation lens, as 21 (or the 31 on FF) seems quite nice for that...

(Just another photo for those saying 21 isn't a great APS-C focal length...)

Any focal length is great if it works for you. Equally, any focal length is bad if it doesn't.

bertwert · 05-16-2020, 08:47 AM

Originally posted by Wheatfield

Any focal length is great if it works for you. Equally, any focal length is bad if it doesn't.

Get out of here with those sensible comments!

angerdan · 05-16-2020, 09:33 AM

Originally posted by Digitalis

The Nikkor 20mm f/1.8G is about 355g and the shell of that is poly-carbonate and engineering plastic - so add the aluminum construction of the Limited and 500g seems to be a reasonable estimate.

Even the heaviest 20mm 2.8 did weight 330g - so it can be sure that the D FA 20mm ED DC WR will weight less than 500g (and less than 400g).

05-16-2020, 08:11 AM	#203
normhead Pentaxian Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Near Algonquin Park Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 40,451	Originally posted by bertwert That's the same as me - I've considered switching the 10-17 to as I've never really warmed up to the fisheye, but I may just need more shooting with it - anyways I would probably find the 15 isn't for me anyways... Good way of looking at it, are you planning on selling your DA then? Wash your mouth out with soap young man. But seriously, it depends on the size of the new lens. The biggest advantage to the 21 is on a long canoe trip where I depend on 4:1 and larger zooms, the 21 can packed as an afterthought. It has tremendous, "the best lens for the job is the one you have with you" value. The new 21 looks to be a tad bigger. I already have the DA55 1.4 filling the "tad bigger" slot in the lineup. There's only so much room in the pelican case. DA 55-300 PLM, 100 macro, DA55 1.4 and the 28-105 or 18-135 depending on whether or not I take the K-1 or K-3. The DA 21 fits in the spot where I keep my batteries. It doesn't look like the new one will. The reason I still have any gear at all is because I religiously keep gear in the case, away from heat and humidity. When we get it, I'll be sitting there with the case trying to work out a plan. Last edited by normhead; 05-16-2020 at 08:19 AM.

05-16-2020, 08:16 AM - 1 Like	#204
Mistral75 Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Paris, France Posts: 7,527	Originally posted by northcoastgreg (...) If you look at some of the older FF roadmaps, it did appear as if Pentax wanted the third DFA* lens to be around 24mm. But that seemed to change in later roadmaps. (...) Indeed. From CP+ 2016 until CP+ 2017 the 24x36 roadmap included the two following lenses: Large Aperture Ultra Wide-Angle Single Focus Lens Wide-Angle Single Focus Lens From CP+ 2017 until yesterday the 24x36 roadmap included the two following lenses: Ultra Wide-Angle Single Focus Lens (a D FA in red) Large Aperture Wide-Angle Single Focus Lens (a D FA★ in orange) The roadmap published yesterday includes the two following lenses: HD Pentax-D FA 21 mm Limited Large Aperture Wide-Angle Single Focus Lens (a D FA★ in orange) In other words, in February 2017 the ultra-wide prime lens went from large aperture to mere D FA whereas the wide prime lens went from mere D FA to large aperture and ★ designation.

05-16-2020, 08:36 AM	#207
acoufap Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Munich, Germany Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 4,190	Originally posted by Serkevan Even the modern Z20/1.8 is supposed to weigh 505 g, and it's substantially larger (85 x 109 mm) than the DSLR version. Okay, it's a mirrorless design, but it's still got a 77mm filter thread, 14 elements and metal construction. Originally posted by angerdan I'd bet it will weight less than 400g. Originally posted by Mistral75 I wouldn't expect the HD Pentax-D FA 21mm ED Limited DC WR to weigh less than 400g. I don't know what a realistic weight could be. But I'm always surprised when I look at my DFA100WR and remember the weight of the DA20-40 Ltd. - both aluminum constructions. They prove that it's possible to construct lightweight using this material. If the DFA 21 Ltd. weighs more than 500g I simply may think I'll let it pass, use my DA11-18 @ 18 mm in FF mode and if nessecary crop the captures to 6309 x 4210px (26.5 Megapixel) in post. That gives me the angle of view of the DFA 21mm Ltd. - and 26.5 Megapixels should easily be enough in size. Exciting times! Last edited by acoufap; 05-16-2020 at 08:47 AM.*

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05-16-2020, 07:56 AM - 3 Likes	#196
normhead Pentaxian Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Near Algonquin Park Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 40,451	Originally posted by bertwert Oh yeah, of course lots of uses, I'm not quite sure what I meant in my post there anyways... I'm thinking of picking up a 15 Ltd - which would be pretty similar to the 21 on FF. I have to say that I'm glad I don't have a K-1, as this new lens would be hard to avoid, even though it'll be well above my sensible budget... Maybe I'm just thinking as an everyday situation lens, as 21 (or the 31 on FF) seems quite nice for that... (Just another photo for those saying 21 isn't a great APS-C focal length...) The cool thing for us, is, we chose between the 21 ltd. and 15 and basically decided 21 would be a more useful focal length. But we've had many times we thought we should have bought the 15. This gives us 21 on APS-c and an equivalent to the 15 on FF. Both lenses we wanted in the same lens. Like getting a bonus lens. The house appropriations committee has already approved the purchase.

05-16-2020, 08:00 AM - 2 Likes	#197
Digitalis Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Melbourne, Victoria Photos: Gallery Posts: 11,694	Originally posted by normhead The house appropriations committee has already approved the purchase. That must always be a fun consultation.

05-16-2020, 08:05 AM	#198
timautin Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2015 Posts: 346	YES! Count me in for the 21 . Seems the perfect landscape lens for the best landscape camera!

05-16-2020, 08:05 AM	#199
bertwert Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2015 Location: Golden, BC Posts: 15,172	Originally posted by normhead The cool thing for us, is, we chose between the 21 ltd. and 15 and basically decided 21 would be a more useful focal length. But we've had many times we thought we should have bought the 15. That's the same as me - I've considered switching the 10-17 to as I've never really warmed up to the fisheye, but I may just need more shooting with it - anyways I would probably find the 15 isn't for me anyways... Originally posted by normhead This gives us 21 on APS-c and an equivalent to the 15 on FF. Both lenses we wanted in the same lens. Like getting a bonus lens. The house appropriations committee has already approved the purchase. Good way of looking at it, are you planning on selling your DA then?

05-16-2020, 08:05 AM	#200
phoebus Pentaxian Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Buckinghamshire (UK) / Morbihan (FR) Photos: Gallery Posts: 470	Originally posted by Digitalis That must always be a fun consultation. Same here - easy discussion: I buy, we use...

05-16-2020, 08:07 AM - 1 Like	#201
normhead Pentaxian Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Near Algonquin Park Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 40,451	Originally posted by Digitalis That must always be a fun consultation. It helps if it's lens she thinks she might use herself. She now calls both my DA 55-300 PLM and my DFA 28-105 her lenses. She believe anything I buy for myself will be hers if she likes it enough. Getting a lens approved is a mixed blessing. I may only get partial use of the lens. When we get to a scene for which it is suited, I may have to beg for it... again (and again and again.)

05-16-2020, 08:09 AM	#202
Serkevan Site Supporter Join Date: May 2019 Photos: Albums Posts: 5,976	Originally posted by Digitalis The Nikkor 20mm f/1.8G is about 355g and the shell of that is poly-carbonate and engineering plastic - so add the aluminum construction of the Limited and 500g seems to be a reasonable estimate. Even the modern Z20/1.8 is supposed to weigh 505 g, and it's substantially larger (85 x 109 mm) than the DSLR version. Okay, it's a mirrorless design, but it's still got a 77mm filter thread, 14 elements and metal construction.

05-16-2020, 08:30 AM - 4 Likes	#205
Wheatfield Moderator Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: The wheatfields of Canada Posts: 15,986	Originally posted by deus ursus 😂 This post reminds me of a poster on a formula 1 discussion forum I used to frequent some time ago. On a saturday evening he posted a "I love you all, you're my best friends (sob sob)" kind of post. His next post was on sunday afternoon and was more like "I hate you all, you scumbags!" 😁 Alcohol brings out the best in me.

05-16-2020, 08:33 AM	#206
normhead Pentaxian Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Near Algonquin Park Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 40,451	Originally posted by bertwert That's the same as me - I've considered switching the 10-17 to as I've never really warmed up to the fisheye, but I may just need more shooting with it - anyways I would probably find the 15 isn't for me anyways... I bought the Sigma 8-16 for serious images, as opposed to the not so serious fisheye images, but then, I hardly ever use that either. So I have two lenses I rarely use instead of one. But when you want them, nothing else will do.

05-16-2020, 08:40 AM	#208
Wheatfield Moderator Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: The wheatfields of Canada Posts: 15,986	Originally posted by bertwert Oh yeah, of course lots of uses, I'm not quite sure what I meant in my post there anyways... I'm thinking of picking up a 15 Ltd - which would be pretty similar to the 21 on FF. I have to say that I'm glad I don't have a K-1, as this new lens would be hard to avoid, even though it'll be well above my sensible budget... Maybe I'm just thinking as an everyday situation lens, as 21 (or the 31 on FF) seems quite nice for that... (Just another photo for those saying 21 isn't a great APS-C focal length...) Any focal length is great if it works for you. Equally, any focal length is bad if it doesn't.

05-16-2020, 08:47 AM	#209
bertwert Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2015 Location: Golden, BC Posts: 15,172	Originally posted by Wheatfield Any focal length is great if it works for you. Equally, any focal length is bad if it doesn't. Get out of here with those sensible comments!

05-16-2020, 09:33 AM	#210
angerdan Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2015 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,642	Originally posted by Digitalis The Nikkor 20mm f/1.8G is about 355g and the shell of that is poly-carbonate and engineering plastic - so add the aluminum construction of the Limited and 500g seems to be a reasonable estimate. Even the heaviest 20mm 2.8 did weight 330g - so it can be sure that the D FA 20mm ED DC WR will weight less than 500g (and less than 400g).