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04-10-2021, 05:50 AM - 4 Likes   #1276
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QuoteOriginally posted by robbiec Quote
Look at poor Sandy, he has to buy a K3 iii, DA*16-50PLM and the 21 Limited this year and that's on top of the DFA*85 last year ,
. Huh. That's nothing. If I buy the K3III, then I'll have to maintain 3 formats, from medium through FF to apsc. I weep not for Sandy, as I am not a doctor.
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the point I'm making is that Pentax are dropping the new stuff in manageable amounts
Yes, thank the gods for that, or else I'd have to rent a storage unit to hold my gear, while I lived under an overpass....my wife would leave me, but then she'd be better off most likely.

04-10-2021, 05:59 AM - 2 Likes   #1277
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QuoteOriginally posted by TwoUptons Quote
Pentax used to sell a lot of cameras to doctors, but I think they left that part of the brand with Hoya when Ricoh bought the part we use...

I hope they donít go full-on Leica/Zeiss, as even some of us who can call ourselves doctor canít afford that...

-Eric
Not full on but with a clear gap between it and the mass market consumer orientated stuff. They are targeting Zeiss with the DFA*'s and Leica through the Limited series, while accommodating another market segment both don't dare attempt and that is the wild any weather adventure outdoors photography. The vision statement supports this, its as much a sensory and tactile approach to photography moreso than numbers and tests. Leica are the best in selling this philosophy and have done very successfully doing so. Zeiss are still regarded as the pinnacle in optical performance and are a useful datum for Pentax (still an Optical house remember) to compare against. Where Pentax have an advantage is ergonomics, use ability over Leica and the ability to tune a camera system to their optics over Zeiss.

---------- Post added 04-10-21 at 01:25 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by texandrews Quote
. Huh. That's nothing. If I buy the K3III, then I'll have to maintain 3 formats, from medium through FF to apsc. I weep not for Sandy, as I am not a doctor. Yes, thank the gods for that, or else I'd have to rent a storage unit to hold my gear, while I lived under an overpass....my wife would leave me, but then she'd be better off most likely.
But it's a gradual accumulation of optics. Tougher for the recent joiners to the Pentax fold but if you've been dabbling for the last 10yrs or so like me, then you can pick and choose. The 21 fills a gap for me so I'll get it, the K-3iii has also piqued my interest if only that I enjoy using APSC sometimes moreso than FF. I don't have a bottomless money pit to draw from (other hobbies) but I've reached an age where value of enjoyment to me personally with a lifespan measured in years rather than months is preferable to something that has higher numbers, inferior build quality, inferior use ability and is superceded in 18 months. Pentax have basically said, look you'll get a new camera in your preferred format every 3 to 5yrs, your lens collection will be supported and if you look after it will last a generation or more. I like that, makes sense to me.
04-10-2021, 06:27 AM - 2 Likes   #1278
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mmm... and here was I thinking Pentax were targeting retired postal workers... silly me! Should have known better.
04-10-2021, 06:44 AM   #1279
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QuoteOriginally posted by wkraus Quote
While I would welcome f/2 or even f/1.8, f/2.3 would make a nice historical reference. If my research is correct, the Auto-Takumar 35mm f/2.3 (1959) was the first fast SLR 35mm lens (after the pioneering Angenieux 35mm f/2.5 Type R1 Retrofocus from 1950, the first SLR retrofocus lens). As far as f/2 versions are concerned, Konica apparently was the first in 1960 (?), followed by Asahi Optical in 1963, Nikon and Zeiss (Contarex) in 1965, Leica (R) in 1970 and Canon (FD) in 1971.
I do agree. Also Iíd be inclined to think that difference with wide lens like this new 21, with Aperture being f 2 or 2.4 or 2.3 are minimal in image. No matter what difference with f2 or 2.8 are bigger.

04-10-2021, 07:01 AM   #1280
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QuoteOriginally posted by texandrews Quote
. Huh. That's nothing. If I buy the K3III, then I'll have to maintain 3 formats, from medium through FF to apsc.
I don't see that you would have much to "maintain".
You have lenses now - any more 'FF' lenses could be used on either body,
04-10-2021, 07:02 AM - 4 Likes   #1281
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I have often seen Leica associated with Dentists for whatever reason and we have a Doctor in Sandy who just likes new Pentax stuff. It was a tongue in cheek comment I'm not a doctor, I'm an engineer in IT - by in large technology interests me but the automation I'm seeing in mirrorless looks to be taking away too much in the way of applying the human element to photography, in other words its dumbing down photography. Part of the process of photography is seeing the subject, framing, deciding where to position the focus point, what DOF do you want to capture, capturing the moment - with Pentax you can still do that completely manually if you wish or it can automate some of the elements. What I'm seeing and what the milc fans are raving about is increased automation over and above that, point the camera at a general location and it will ID the subject, AF on the pupil and take the shot based (exaggerating a little but not far off) on limited intelligence and algorithms created by training these models on what has been done before. Photography is an art form, sometimes less automation is needed, not more.
04-10-2021, 07:12 AM   #1282
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QuoteOriginally posted by robbiec Quote
Photography is an art form, sometimes less automation is needed, not more.
Photography can be an art form.
You may be an artist - I have never claimed to be one.
Most photographers hired to record crime scenes are not thinking as artists, and many hired to cover sports or other news are not either.

04-10-2021, 07:21 AM - 3 Likes   #1283
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QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
Photography can be an art form.
You may be an artist - I have never claimed to be one.
Most photographers hired to record crime scenes are not thinking as artists, and many hired to cover sports or other news are not either.
Most photographers working in a SOCO role don't have a choice of camera to use, it comes with the job. Same with non freelance photo journalists. Looking at the Pentax videos for the K-3iii and it comes across as weighed more towards artform than recording an event. That's my opinion and reading of it. I could well be wrong.
04-10-2021, 07:34 AM   #1284
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QuoteOriginally posted by TwoUptons Quote
Pentax used to sell a lot of cameras to doctors, but I think they left that part of the brand with Hoya when Ricoh bought the part we use...

I hope they donít go full-on Leica/Zeiss, as even some of us who can call ourselves doctor canít afford that...

-Eric
I don't think they'd do that.
Premium maybe but not Leica-like either.
04-10-2021, 07:48 AM - 2 Likes   #1285
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QuoteOriginally posted by robbiec Quote

But it's a gradual accumulation of optics. Tougher for the recent joiners to the Pentax fold but if you've been dabbling for the last 10yrs or so like me, then you can pick and choose. The 21 fills a gap for me so I'll get it, the K-3iii has also piqued my interest if only that I enjoy using APSC sometimes moreso than FF. I don't have a bottomless money pit to draw from (other hobbies) but I've reached an age where value of enjoyment to me personally with a lifespan measured in years rather than months is preferable to something that has higher numbers, inferior build quality, inferior use ability and is superceded in 18 months. Pentax have basically said, look you'll get a new camera in your preferred format every 3 to 5yrs, your lens collection will be supported and if you look after it will last a generation or more. I like that, makes sense to me.
I've been on this hobby for two and a half years and being willing to hunt down some classics on the used market, with judicious application of good third party lenses, lets you get a very well filled lineup with relatively little money...

For example, even without accounting for the FA Limiteds and other stuff, I got a DFA 28-105 for 300Ä, a Tokina 70-210/4.5 for 50Ä, the M20/4 for 200Ä and the F50/1.7 for another 50Ä.

That's plenty for most people, I think. And you could do with an older F35-70 or so for 50Ä as well if you don't need the modern niceties of the 28-105 (which has less character than the primes, but boy is it a dependable lens... if I don't know what I'm in for, on she goes on the K-1...). Sure, those lenses are old, not as amazing optically as new cool stuff, and have screwdrive AF, but hey. If you can't get good prints out of them, it's on the photographer 90% of the time or more .

For APS-C it's even easier... get a body with a kit lens, throw in the 55-300 PLM and a DA 50/1.8, and you're kinda set for many uses as well.
04-10-2021, 08:15 AM - 2 Likes   #1286
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QuoteOriginally posted by Serkevan Quote
I've been on this hobby for two and a half years ...
That's it? You must be a quick study. But that would make perfect sense, since as a relative newbie you bucked all the trends and chose Pentax. A sign of exemplary judgement and discernment, and above average intelligence.
04-10-2021, 08:23 AM - 2 Likes   #1287
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QuoteOriginally posted by texandrews Quote
That's it? You must be a quick study. But that would make perfect sense, since as a relative newbie you bucked all the trends and chose Pentax. A sign of exemplary judgement and discernment, and above average intelligence.
Hah, I'm flattered, but I don't think I'm anywhere near the level of so many people on this very forum...

I did have a lot of motivation (and help) to get the basics down quickly; I got into the hobby through my ex (who has much better eye for composition than I do) and other friends, so I was focused on getting "to their level" as fast as possible, and I could always get a deluge of tips, tricks and critiques.

About choosing Pentax... eh, working in science, I did a lot of research with camera brands and models. Pentax won out in value for money by kind of a lot. And after starting down the hole of Limiteds, I have no regrets whatsoever on the choice .
04-10-2021, 08:42 AM - 2 Likes   #1288
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QuoteOriginally posted by robbiec Quote
Most photographers working in a SOCO role don't have a choice of camera to use, it comes with the job. Same with non freelance photo journalists. Looking at the Pentax videos for the K-3iii and it comes across as weighed more towards artform than recording an event. That's my opinion and reading of it. I could well be wrong.
Christmas 1966 - my sophomore year at Purdue University - I and a friend were wandering around downtown Lafayette IN when we saw a snazzy looking "CB&Q" locomotive in a hobby store window.
The conversation for the next several blocks was something like {over and over again}

me: "I never saw a prototype locomotive like that"
him: "Tyco wouldn't just make it up" {Tyco was the model manufacturer}

A few months later, Jim Boyd {who supplied many of the photos used for covers of magazines devoted to railroads back then} showed some of his slides at Purdue, and I came to realize that photos were more reliable than my memory was - so I began taking photos of what I saw. This began as just photos of railroads, but that next summer I went to Chicago, and discovered that the CB&Q was replacing their 1st generation diesel freight locomotives and re-painting all of them {see photo below - the near model has the freight paint scheme I remember while the back one uses the one they had switched to}

Over time, I noticed that my whole world was changing, so I began to "record the world as I see it, before tomorrow comes and everything changes" - one hobby had led to another.
In the Age of Film I used mostly Kodachrome 25 - now I use JPEG and choose to follow the same standards used by those who cover the Olympics {I "level", crop, and change brightness / contrast, but nothing substantial}.

Around ten years ago I posted a photo on a web site devoted to a particular railroad - now a tourist line - of a depot I had photographed in 1971.
At the top of a telegraph pole next to the station was an ugly box, which an artist might have 'removed' when he scanned the old slide.
Promptly, another member posted, asking me to post a photo of just the box - he was head of a "Friends" team that was trying to re-create the telegraph system in appearance {not in function},
and he had never seen that box; the website limited the size of posted images, so he wanted to get a better view of just the box. On September 30, 2017, I posted an image at another site of
the last passenger train into Lafayette - this was the 50th anniversary of the event - and another member suggested that the local historical society might like a copy .... and they were thrilled to get it.

Incidentally, I eventually realized that Tyco had combined two paint schemes for that model - the silver paint from the CB&Q passenger units that normally went with understated lettering and the lettering from the CB&Q freight units that normally went with white / light gray paint.

added: and I have had fun for over fifty years taking these photos - isn't that Pentax's ultimate goal?




Last edited by reh321; 04-10-2021 at 08:52 AM.
04-10-2021, 08:46 AM   #1289
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I think I have the same red Burlington engine

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04-10-2021, 12:38 PM   #1290
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QuoteOriginally posted by texandrews Quote
. Huh. That's nothing. If I buy the K3III, then I'll have to maintain 3 formats, from medium through FF to apsc. I weep not for Sandy, as I am not a doctor.
ROTFL! Oh geez, true.
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