D FA 21 Limited is one of the three.

texandrews · 05-18-2020, 06:49 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by bertwert

I thought grain is what they made flour from...

And so, when you do your developing in the kitchen....

**clackers** · 05-18-2020, 06:59 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Coiseam

I've heard Zeiss Loxia 21 to be a really exceptional lens, though it's tiny (52mm filter thread). But it's mirrorless.

It has gigantic vignetting, Coiseam, so it's not big enough to cover a FF sensor. 2.5eV or 2.8eV dropoff, depending on who's doing the measurement.

Barrel distortion with an ugly moustache contribution, according to one review, too, and they charge $1500!

There is no such thing as magic, lenses have to obey physics, sadly.

alamo5000 · 05-18-2020, 07:39 PM

I have a non technical question--- I have not been following the recent developments for the past year-ish. So when can we expect (or hope) to see this lens available for sale?

Did they give any indication at the announcement?

bertwert · 05-18-2020, 07:41 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by alamo5000

Did they give any indication at the announcement?

2021 is my understanding.

alamo5000 · 05-18-2020, 08:17 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by bertwert

2021 is my understanding.

Just needing to know when to have my bank account ready.

**carlb** · 05-18-2020, 08:47 PM - **3 Likes**

Originally posted by Serkevan

I'm pretty sure that the first thing on anyone's mind when they look at Don McCullin's Vietnam photos is "man, those corners are not as sharp as they could be".

This is probably the most relevant comment in the whole thread.

Kunzite · 05-18-2020, 11:18 PM

Originally posted by MJKoski

Well it better have quantitative pixel dust. 8K monitor on the wall in 100" size is the future of displaying large photos. 8K is pretty ruthless here - it is K-1's native resolution and lenses must draw corner to corner to be usable. Pixel-Shift is preferred. S1R 160MP or A7R4's 240MP (competitive superresolution cameras) is the new norm from which the 8K material is to be downsampled from.

No, not images. Test charts. The 8K monitors will be used to display test charts, and Pentax better be prepared for that.

repaap · 05-19-2020, 12:15 AM - **1 Like**

Hah! Mjkoski nyt vaa vähä ampuu yli. 8K is coming, yes. Mainstream? I suppose 4K is mainstream now. Some are doing 8K but there is no reason why even 8K has to be from edge to EDGE sharp. And proper PP is going to be the key for that. 8K is just curiosity, as 4K was when it arrived, how long a go.

gazonk · 05-19-2020, 12:48 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by repaap

Some are doing 8K but there is no reason why even 8K has to be from edge to EDGE sharp.

What are people going to show on their 8K monitors? Probably size-reduced (by Google Photos) images from their mobile phones, with filters for vignetting, OOF corners, saturation and sharpness all applied to max

**iheiramo** · 05-19-2020, 12:52 AM

Originally posted by gazonk

What are people going to show on their 8K monitors? Probably size-reduced (by Google Photos) images from their mobile phones, with filters for vignetting, OOF corners, saturation and sharpness all applied to max

Monitors??? How old fashined. They'll use 8K on their pads and mobile phones.

**Serkevan** · 05-19-2020, 12:58 AM

Originally posted by iheiramo

Monitors??? How old fashined. They'll use 8K on their pads and mobile phones.

Bingo! If the present isn't 60-inch, 4K monitors (in most cases), the future will hardly be in wall-sized screens. And sure, some people have TVs that size but good luck with colour reproduction in those

repaap · 05-19-2020, 01:10 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by gazonk

What are people going to show on their 8K monitors? Probably size-reduced (by Google Photos) images from their mobile phones, with filters for vignetting, OOF corners, saturation and sharpness all applied to max

(Explaining) but that sakea man said that I could shoot 8K with my phone and then watch it from my new TV. No one said how good the quality was going to be. Atleast files will be bigger...

house · 05-19-2020, 01:26 AM

Originally posted by texandrews

British Museum, the Louvre, the National Gallery of Art, MOMA, & etc are in the first tier. Yes, we use monitors to display photography....sometimes, and when the artist suggests it.

Originally posted by texandrews

Don't be holding your breath for museums to be switching over to 8K monitors anytime soon for photography exhibitions---and I mean major ones. Galleries? only the very top ones, names like Gagosian, Hauser and Wirth

I've done work for four of the above (not as the artist) and the money for the screens have never been the issue. It's just that, despite how art has developed, photography is viewed on prints due to tradition. If the work is for screen obviously screens are used but that hasn't really been the case for photography. Commercial galleries are probably more keen on prints because of again tradition and a fair few ultra rich prefer to put prints in storage rather than screens. People like Isaac Julien obviously exist and frequently do screen based work but it hasn't taken off as far as I can tell. It's only suitable for certain aesthetics. Viewing emitting devices is very different from prints.

Lenses have to work with the sensors in the cameras. I think that drives the size of new lenses. If you bought a 36mp camera and use a 24mp lens you're wasting that investment and would have been better off with the 24mp. (of course availability other features etc. change that a bit). A lens with serious "flaws" might be great for some use cases but generally it becomes a specialist lens whereas a perfect lens is more flexible.

noelpolar · 05-19-2020, 01:27 AM - **4 Likes**

Clearly this is going to be a Foodie lens.... probally optimised for Sushi.

One will probally be able to display 1,987 pieces of life size sushi on ones future TV. It will end world hunger.

repaap · 05-19-2020, 01:44 AM - **1 Like**

I’d find it quite strange to go to museum to look at 100” 8K let alone 4K screen, no matter how good the photos would be. And I believe that it would also change the name of photography art to media art. Because it will be perceived through a display? The thing what I personslly like to look at is the prints.

Sure, more resolution is on it’s way and at some parts already here, but then one has to cough up more €€€€€. To get that to be mainstream? Why?

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05-18-2020, 06:49 PM - 1 Like	#286
texandrews Moderator Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: Baltimore Photos: Albums Posts: 3,392	Originally posted by bertwert I thought grain is what they made flour from... And so, when you do your developing in the kitchen....

05-18-2020, 06:59 PM - 1 Like	#287
clackers Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Melbourne Photos: Albums Posts: 16,397	Originally posted by Coiseam I've heard Zeiss Loxia 21 to be a really exceptional lens, though it's tiny (52mm filter thread). But it's mirrorless. It has gigantic vignetting, Coiseam, so it's not big enough to cover a FF sensor. 2.5eV or 2.8eV dropoff, depending on who's doing the measurement. Barrel distortion with an ugly moustache contribution, according to one review, too, and they charge $1500! There is no such thing as magic, lenses have to obey physics, sadly.

05-18-2020, 07:39 PM	#288
alamo5000 Pentaxian Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 2,962	I have a non technical question--- I have not been following the recent developments for the past year-ish. So when can we expect (or hope) to see this lens available for sale? Did they give any indication at the announcement?

05-18-2020, 07:41 PM - 1 Like	#289
bertwert Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2015 Location: Golden, BC Posts: 15,173	Originally posted by alamo5000 Did they give any indication at the announcement? 2021 is my understanding.

05-18-2020, 08:17 PM - 1 Like	#290
alamo5000 Pentaxian Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 2,962	Originally posted by bertwert 2021 is my understanding. Just needing to know when to have my bank account ready.

05-18-2020, 08:47 PM - 3 Likes	#291
carlb Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 1,162	Originally posted by Serkevan I'm pretty sure that the first thing on anyone's mind when they look at Don McCullin's Vietnam photos is "man, those corners are not as sharp as they could be". This is probably the most relevant comment in the whole thread.

05-18-2020, 11:18 PM	#292
Kunzite Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Romania Posts: 15,132	Originally posted by MJKoski Well it better have quantitative pixel dust. 8K monitor on the wall in 100" size is the future of displaying large photos. 8K is pretty ruthless here - it is K-1's native resolution and lenses must draw corner to corner to be usable. Pixel-Shift is preferred. S1R 160MP or A7R4's 240MP (competitive superresolution cameras) is the new norm from which the 8K material is to be downsampled from. No, not images. Test charts. The 8K monitors will be used to display test charts, and Pentax better be prepared for that.

05-19-2020, 12:15 AM - 1 Like	#293
repaap Pentaxian Join Date: Oct 2010 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 6,242	Hah! Mjkoski nyt vaa vähä ampuu yli. 8K is coming, yes. Mainstream? I suppose 4K is mainstream now. Some are doing 8K but there is no reason why even 8K has to be from edge to EDGE sharp. And proper PP is going to be the key for that. 8K is just curiosity, as 4K was when it arrived, how long a go.

05-19-2020, 12:48 AM - 1 Like	#294
gazonk Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Oslo area, Norway Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,746	Originally posted by repaap Some are doing 8K but there is no reason why even 8K has to be from edge to EDGE sharp. What are people going to show on their 8K monitors? Probably size-reduced (by Google Photos) images from their mobile phones, with filters for vignetting, OOF corners, saturation and sharpness all applied to max

05-19-2020, 12:52 AM	#295
iheiramo Unoriginal Poster Join Date: Nov 2016 Location: Espoo Photos: Albums Posts: 3,182	Originally posted by gazonk What are people going to show on their 8K monitors? Probably size-reduced (by Google Photos) images from their mobile phones, with filters for vignetting, OOF corners, saturation and sharpness all applied to max Monitors??? How old fashined. They'll use 8K on their pads and mobile phones.

05-19-2020, 12:58 AM	#296
Serkevan Site Supporter Join Date: May 2019 Photos: Albums Posts: 5,976	Originally posted by iheiramo Monitors??? How old fashined. They'll use 8K on their pads and mobile phones. Bingo! If the present isn't 60-inch, 4K monitors (in most cases), the future will hardly be in wall-sized screens. And sure, some people have TVs that size but good luck with colour reproduction in those

05-19-2020, 01:10 AM - 1 Like	#297
repaap Pentaxian Join Date: Oct 2010 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 6,242	Originally posted by gazonk What are people going to show on their 8K monitors? Probably size-reduced (by Google Photos) images from their mobile phones, with filters for vignetting, OOF corners, saturation and sharpness all applied to max (Explaining) but that sakea man said that I could shoot 8K with my phone and then watch it from my new TV. No one said how good the quality was going to be. Atleast files will be bigger...

05-19-2020, 01:26 AM	#298
house Pentaxian Join Date: May 2015 Photos: Albums Posts: 3,306	Originally posted by texandrews British Museum, the Louvre, the National Gallery of Art, MOMA, & etc are in the first tier. Yes, we use monitors to display photography....sometimes, and when the artist suggests it. Originally posted by texandrews Don't be holding your breath for museums to be switching over to 8K monitors anytime soon for photography exhibitions---and I mean major ones. Galleries? only the very top ones, names like Gagosian, Hauser and Wirth I've done work for four of the above (not as the artist) and the money for the screens have never been the issue. It's just that, despite how art has developed, photography is viewed on prints due to tradition. If the work is for screen obviously screens are used but that hasn't really been the case for photography. Commercial galleries are probably more keen on prints because of again tradition and a fair few ultra rich prefer to put prints in storage rather than screens. People like Isaac Julien obviously exist and frequently do screen based work but it hasn't taken off as far as I can tell. It's only suitable for certain aesthetics. Viewing emitting devices is very different from prints. Lenses have to work with the sensors in the cameras. I think that drives the size of new lenses. If you bought a 36mp camera and use a 24mp lens you're wasting that investment and would have been better off with the 24mp. (of course availability other features etc. change that a bit). A lens with serious "flaws" might be great for some use cases but generally it becomes a specialist lens whereas a perfect lens is more flexible.

05-19-2020, 01:27 AM - 4 Likes	#299
noelpolar Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: Goolwa, SA Photos: Gallery Posts: 4,310	Clearly this is going to be a Foodie lens.... probally optimised for Sushi. One will probally be able to display 1,987 pieces of life size sushi on ones future TV. It will end world hunger.

05-19-2020, 01:44 AM - 1 Like	#300
repaap Pentaxian Join Date: Oct 2010 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 6,242	I’d find it quite strange to go to museum to look at 100” 8K let alone 4K screen, no matter how good the photos would be. And I believe that it would also change the name of photography art to media art. Because it will be perceived through a display? The thing what I personslly like to look at is the prints. Sure, more resolution is on it’s way and at some parts already here, but then one has to cough up more €€€€€. To get that to be mainstream? Why?