D FA 21 Limited is one of the three.

**mlt** · 11-17-2020, 10:33 PM

But then there is no complaining about the lens being too slow or why didn’t they make it smaller with a smaller aperture. If it is a Limited series lens, then we should expect both an outstanding and a unique lens.

ZombieArmy · 11-17-2020, 10:54 PM - **3 Likes**

If this doesn't have an aperture ring and a max aperture of .95 pentax is absolutely doomed.

thibs · 11-18-2020, 02:30 AM

LOL
It is doomed anyway.

someasiancameraguy · 11-18-2020, 03:39 AM

Considering that the FA 24 isn't that big and has a 2.0 max aperture I think the new Ltd should be faster than 2.8 for sure. It just doesn't seem to make sense to talk about bokeh and smooth out of focus roll-off otherwise

**TwoUptons** · 11-18-2020, 04:04 AM

Originally posted by someasiancameraguy

Considering that the FA 24 isn't that big and has a 2.0 max aperture I think the new Ltd should be faster than 2.8 for sure. It just doesn't seem to make sense to talk about bokeh and smooth out of focus roll-off otherwise

I don’t think that works like it used to...
The FA 50mm f1.4 has a 49mm filter and is compact.
The DFA 50mm f1.4 has a 77mm filter and is somewhat less compact, inline with modern trends.

I’d expect a Limited to run a bit contrary to convention, and smooth bokeh is about more than shallow depth of field.
But I don’t think they are going to make something small and fast because it won’t be good enough.
I expect they’ll take a hit on maximum aperture to keep the results awesome.

-Eric

**Rondec** · 11-18-2020, 04:19 AM - **2 Likes**

I would guess something in the f2.4 to f2.8 range.

Honestly, I think it is fine to have a little slower aperture. I am hoping this will be a DA 15 limited for full frame and will end up being more for landscapes with excellent contrast, good flare resistance, and tight construction. The DA 15 is not great, even at f4 and I shoot mine mainly at f8. This lens should be better than that, but I don't need an f2 aperture on this sort of a wide angle.

**Pål Jensen** · 11-18-2020, 04:25 AM

Originally posted by Rondec

I would guess something in the f2.4 to f2.8 range.

Honestly, I think it is fine to have a little slower aperture. I am hoping this will be a DA 15 limited for full frame and will end up being more for landscapes with excellent contrast, good flare resistance, and tight construction. The DA 15 is not great, even at f4 and I shoot mine mainly at f8. This lens should be better than that, but I don't need an f2 aperture on this sort of a wide angle.

Yes. F:2.4 must be maximum. The closest thing to this we have is the FA 20/2.8; quite large front element. Now this new Limited will be built to modern standards something that does not exactly gives smaller lenses.....

**Serkevan** · 11-18-2020, 04:26 AM

Originally posted by Rondec

I would guess something in the f2.4 to f2.8 range.

Honestly, I think it is fine to have a little slower aperture. I am hoping this will be a DA 15 limited for full frame and will end up being more for landscapes with excellent contrast, good flare resistance, and tight construction. The DA 15 is not great, even at f4 and I shoot mine mainly at f8. This lens should be better than that, but I don't need an f2 aperture on this sort of a wide angle.

My personal guess is also around f/2.4 - f/2 is probably not doable with such a relatively small package, and f/2.8 feels too... "normal" for a Limited.

---------- Post added 11-18-20 at 04:28 AM ----------

Originally posted by ZombieArmy

If this doesn't have an aperture ring and a max aperture of .95 pentax is absolutely doomed.

Even Chinese manual focus lenses are f/0.95 by default nowadays. If Zeiss made an f/0.7 lens Carl Zeiss Planar 50mm f/0.7 - Wikipedia then Pentax has to get on with the times and make something on that ballpark. Nothing else, nothing, will do.

---------- Post added 11-18-20 at 04:36 AM ----------

Originally posted by Pål Jensen

Yes. F:2.4 must be maximum. The closest thing to this we have is the FA 20/2.8; quite large front element. Now this new Limited will be built to modern standards something that does not exactly gives smaller lenses.....

From what little we have seen of the lens it doesn't feel to me like the FA has a larger front element. As I replied to Rondec I also don't think the lens is gonna be super fast, but I somehow get the feeling they will try to make it a bit faster than f/2.8 - maybe they are going for a smoother, less-than-sharp rendering wide open that transitions to sharp landscape lens as you close the aperture? Similar to some of those old lenses that are dreamy at maximum aperture.

thibs · 11-18-2020, 05:16 AM

Originally posted by Pål Jensen

Yes. F:2.4 must be maximum. The closest thing to this we have is the FA 20/2.8; quite large front element. Now this new Limited will be built to modern standards something that does not exactly gives smaller lenses.....

Modern standards, yes.
But this is a limited, not a *. Rendering will come before extreme optical corrections.
I'd say somewhere between modern * lenses and older limited.

**ThorSanchez** · 11-18-2020, 05:16 AM - **7 Likes**

Originally posted by Serkevan

Even Chinese manual focus lenses are f/0.95 by default nowadays. If Zeiss made an f/0.7 lens Carl Zeiss Planar 50mm f/0.7 - Wikipedia then Pentax has to get on with the times and make something on that ballpark. Nothing else, nothing, will do.

I'm expecting them to use the magic brightening glass from the K-3iii's prism to make an f/0 lens. Hopefully a weather-sealed pancake. With a DC motor. In silver. Real silver. $199.

**Serkevan** · 11-18-2020, 05:24 AM - **3 Likes**

Originally posted by ThorSanchez

I'm expecting them to use the magic brightening glass from the K-3iii's prism to make an f/0 lens. Hopefully a weather-sealed pancake. With a DC motor. In silver. Real silver. $199.

F/0? Ah, the good old black hole lens. Incredible light gathering ability!

bvg · 11-18-2020, 06:19 AM

Oh, it's ideal for V-blogging!

bdery · 11-18-2020, 06:51 AM - **2 Likes**

Originally posted by texandrews

I agree that it's indicative of "stupid marketing" not to inform the user base what the aperture range will be at this point.

Pentax has never been known for their stellar marketing. Letting the products speak for themselves and trusting the users isn't quite enough

**ThorSanchez** · 11-18-2020, 08:45 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Serkevan

F/0? Ah, the good old black hole lens. Incredible light gathering ability!

If light can escape from your lens you're not trying hard enough.

reh321 · 11-18-2020, 09:03 AM

Originally posted by ZombieArmy

If this doesn't have an aperture ring and a max aperture of .95 pentax is absolutely doomed.

A modern lens with aperture ring might sell very well simply because of all of us with K-30 or K50 bodies that cannot control the aperture
{I hear another conspiracy theory brewing}.

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11-17-2020, 10:33 PM	#646
mlt Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 1,159	But then there is no complaining about the lens being too slow or why didn’t they make it smaller with a smaller aperture. If it is a Limited series lens, then we should expect both an outstanding and a unique lens.

11-17-2020, 10:54 PM - 3 Likes	#647
ZombieArmy Pentaxian Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: Florida Posts: 3,210	If this doesn't have an aperture ring and a max aperture of .95 pentax is absolutely doomed.

11-18-2020, 02:30 AM	#648
thibs Pentaxian Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Belgium Photos: Albums Posts: 7,001	LOL It is doomed anyway.

11-18-2020, 03:39 AM	#649
someasiancameraguy Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2017 Location: Hong Kong Posts: 419	Considering that the FA 24 isn't that big and has a 2.0 max aperture I think the new Ltd should be faster than 2.8 for sure. It just doesn't seem to make sense to talk about bokeh and smooth out of focus roll-off otherwise

11-18-2020, 04:04 AM	#650
TwoUptons Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2015 Photos: Albums Posts: 4,210	Originally posted by someasiancameraguy Considering that the FA 24 isn't that big and has a 2.0 max aperture I think the new Ltd should be faster than 2.8 for sure. It just doesn't seem to make sense to talk about bokeh and smooth out of focus roll-off otherwise I don’t think that works like it used to... The FA 50mm f1.4 has a 49mm filter and is compact. The DFA 50mm f1.4 has a 77mm filter and is somewhat less compact, inline with modern trends. I’d expect a Limited to run a bit contrary to convention, and smooth bokeh is about more than shallow depth of field. But I don’t think they are going to make something small and fast because it won’t be good enough. I expect they’ll take a hit on maximum aperture to keep the results awesome. -Eric

11-18-2020, 04:19 AM - 2 Likes	#651
Rondec Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Gladys, Virginia Photos: Gallery Posts: 27,650	I would guess something in the f2.4 to f2.8 range. Honestly, I think it is fine to have a little slower aperture. I am hoping this will be a DA 15 limited for full frame and will end up being more for landscapes with excellent contrast, good flare resistance, and tight construction. The DA 15 is not great, even at f4 and I shoot mine mainly at f8. This lens should be better than that, but I don't need an f2 aperture on this sort of a wide angle.

11-18-2020, 04:25 AM	#652
Pål Jensen Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Norway Photos: Albums Posts: 4,371	Originally posted by Rondec I would guess something in the f2.4 to f2.8 range. Honestly, I think it is fine to have a little slower aperture. I am hoping this will be a DA 15 limited for full frame and will end up being more for landscapes with excellent contrast, good flare resistance, and tight construction. The DA 15 is not great, even at f4 and I shoot mine mainly at f8. This lens should be better than that, but I don't need an f2 aperture on this sort of a wide angle. Yes. F:2.4 must be maximum. The closest thing to this we have is the FA 20/2.8; quite large front element. Now this new Limited will be built to modern standards something that does not exactly gives smaller lenses.....

11-18-2020, 04:26 AM	#653
Serkevan Site Supporter Join Date: May 2019 Photos: Albums Posts: 5,976	Originally posted by Rondec I would guess something in the f2.4 to f2.8 range. Honestly, I think it is fine to have a little slower aperture. I am hoping this will be a DA 15 limited for full frame and will end up being more for landscapes with excellent contrast, good flare resistance, and tight construction. The DA 15 is not great, even at f4 and I shoot mine mainly at f8. This lens should be better than that, but I don't need an f2 aperture on this sort of a wide angle. My personal guess is also around f/2.4 - f/2 is probably not doable with such a relatively small package, and f/2.8 feels too... "normal" for a Limited. ---------- Post added 11-18-20 at 04:28 AM ---------- Originally posted by ZombieArmy If this doesn't have an aperture ring and a max aperture of .95 pentax is absolutely doomed. Even Chinese manual focus lenses are f/0.95 by default nowadays. If Zeiss made an f/0.7 lens Carl Zeiss Planar 50mm f/0.7 - Wikipedia then Pentax has to get on with the times and make something on that ballpark. Nothing else, nothing, will do. ---------- Post added 11-18-20 at 04:36 AM ---------- Originally posted by Pål Jensen Yes. F:2.4 must be maximum. The closest thing to this we have is the FA 20/2.8; quite large front element. Now this new Limited will be built to modern standards something that does not exactly gives smaller lenses..... From what little we have seen of the lens it doesn't feel to me like the FA has a larger front element. As I replied to Rondec I also don't think the lens is gonna be super fast, but I somehow get the feeling they will try to make it a bit faster than f/2.8 - maybe they are going for a smoother, less-than-sharp rendering wide open that transitions to sharp landscape lens as you close the aperture? Similar to some of those old lenses that are dreamy at maximum aperture.

11-18-2020, 05:16 AM	#654
thibs Pentaxian Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Belgium Photos: Albums Posts: 7,001	Originally posted by Pål Jensen Yes. F:2.4 must be maximum. The closest thing to this we have is the FA 20/2.8; quite large front element. Now this new Limited will be built to modern standards something that does not exactly gives smaller lenses..... Modern standards, yes. But this is a limited, not a . Rendering will come before extreme optical corrections. I'd say somewhere between modern lenses and older limited.

11-18-2020, 05:16 AM - 7 Likes	#655
ThorSanchez Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2012 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,805	Originally posted by Serkevan Even Chinese manual focus lenses are f/0.95 by default nowadays. If Zeiss made an f/0.7 lens Carl Zeiss Planar 50mm f/0.7 - Wikipedia then Pentax has to get on with the times and make something on that ballpark. Nothing else, nothing, will do. I'm expecting them to use the magic brightening glass from the K-3iii's prism to make an f/0 lens. Hopefully a weather-sealed pancake. With a DC motor. In silver. Real silver. $199.

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11-18-2020, 05:24 AM - 3 Likes	#656
Serkevan Site Supporter Join Date: May 2019 Photos: Albums Posts: 5,976	Originally posted by ThorSanchez I'm expecting them to use the magic brightening glass from the K-3iii's prism to make an f/0 lens. Hopefully a weather-sealed pancake. With a DC motor. In silver. Real silver. $199. F/0? Ah, the good old black hole lens. Incredible light gathering ability!

11-18-2020, 06:19 AM	#657
bvg Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Queensland, Australia Photos: Albums Posts: 340	Oh, it's ideal for V-blogging!

11-18-2020, 06:51 AM - 2 Likes	#658
bdery Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Quebec city, Canada Photos: Gallery Posts: 9,357	Originally posted by texandrews I agree that it's indicative of "stupid marketing" not to inform the user base what the aperture range will be at this point. Pentax has never been known for their stellar marketing. Letting the products speak for themselves and trusting the users isn't quite enough

11-18-2020, 08:45 AM - 1 Like	#659
ThorSanchez Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2012 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,805	Originally posted by Serkevan F/0? Ah, the good old black hole lens. Incredible light gathering ability! If light can escape from your lens you're not trying hard enough.

11-18-2020, 09:03 AM	#660
reh321 Pentaxian Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: South Bend, IN, USA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 23,177	Originally posted by ZombieArmy If this doesn't have an aperture ring and a max aperture of .95 pentax is absolutely doomed. A modern lens with aperture ring might sell very well simply because of all of us with K-30 or K50 bodies that cannot control the aperture {I hear another conspiracy theory brewing}.