HD Pentax DA * 16-50mm F2.8ED PLM AW is the second one.

Jonathan Mac · 02-26-2021, 06:56 AM - **1 Like**

This is the first lens that Pentax have put out in ages that I'd really like to have and might even be prepared to sell significant gear (that would be missed) in order to fund. Maybe I shouldn't have just blown €700 on a couple of new lenses for my Fujifilm system....

**Larrymc** · 02-26-2021, 07:16 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Jonathan Mac

This is the first lens that Pentax have put out in ages that I'd really like to have and might even be prepared to sell significant gear (that would be missed) in order to fund. Maybe I shouldn't have just blown €700 on a couple of new lenses for my Fujifilm system....

C'est la vie

reh321 · 02-26-2021, 07:51 AM - **7 Likes**

Originally posted by Jonathan Mac

This is the first lens that Pentax have put out in ages that I'd really like to have and might even be prepared to sell significant gear (that would be missed) in order to fund. Maybe I shouldn't have just blown €700 on a couple of new lenses for my Fujifilm system....

You could start by selling the Fujifilm lenses.

bladerunner6 · 02-26-2021, 07:53 AM

Is this definitely a new optical formula?

Thanks.

Kunzite · 02-26-2021, 08:02 AM - **2 Likes**

Originally posted by bladerunner6

Is this definitely a new optical formula?

Thanks.

Definitely.
The old one couldn't use PLM autofocus; nor would it meet Pentax' current standards.

bladerunner6 · 02-26-2021, 08:04 AM - **2 Likes**

Originally posted by Kunzite

Definitely.
The old one couldn't use PLM autofocus; nor would it meet Pentax' current standards.

Thanks so much!

**TwoUptons** · 02-26-2021, 05:57 PM

Originally posted by thibs

The only thing annoying me with this lens (but it won't bother me since I won't buy it, my K5 would not run it properly anyway) is the absence of any distance scale on the barrel.
AFAIK this is because of PLM. I understand that but still a pity for a DA* lens (I would not care a dime of it was a consumer class lens).

Won't bother me at night the slightest though.

I hadn't noticed the lack of a distance scale... that's a little weird...

It's just one of those things I'm used to seeing, and the old DA* 16-50 has one.
The DFA 28-105 doesn't have one, either, so it isn't just a PLM thing.

-Eric

**pres589** · 02-26-2021, 06:02 PM

A lot of Pentax zooms lost distance scales over the years. Some of them also lack hard stops at either end of the focusing range which is really awful. One of the few things I really don't like about my 18-135.

JPT · 02-26-2021, 07:47 PM - **6 Likes**

This lens was featured right at the end of the session yesterday evening for the FA Limited lens talk. They did not give much concrete information, but explained a little about the creation of the lens.

The person in charge of development, Tetsuya Iwasaki, explained that this lens contains their latest technology. It was designed from the start to have the best AF performance possible and that is what the PLM motor was selected. PLM motors cannot drive heavy elements so they needed to create a completely new optical design for it. I think this explains why Ricoh cannot just reissue their lenses with a motor replacing screw drive. It is not that simple. Also, It makes me think that a remake of the 50-135mm star lens seems inevitable, but it is unlikely to use the same optical design.

The other speaker, Kazuo Ikenaga, had used the lens for a while and gave his impressions.
- The AF is practically instantaneous and accurate. This is from his use on a K-3 (not the Mark III).
- The close focusing ability is really impressive. It can focus as close as 30 cm. He showed a close-up photo of a blossom to illustrate this.
- It is quite a substantial lens - Big and weighty. Of course, the philosophy of the start lenses is completely different from the Limiteds, and it was an interesting contrast to see them in the same video.

There were a few samples shown. They said it was a prototype but, lens showed no signs of being rough. It looked like a finished item. The release is planned for 2021. They mentioned a couple of times how it is the ideal match for the K-3 Mark III, so with the delay to that camera I think there is a good chance they will be launched at the same time.

**caliscouser** · 02-26-2021, 10:59 PM

Originally posted by JPT

t was designed from the start to have the best AF performance possible and that is what the PLM motor was selected. PLM motors cannot drive heavy elements so they needed to create a completely new optical design for it.

I prefer the idea of designing the motor around the optics than designing the optics around the motor.

Originally posted by JPT

Also, It makes me think that a remake of the 50-135mm star lens seems inevitable, but it is unlikely to use the same optical design

noooooooooo...don't change the optics. It's perfect. Just stick a beefy Canon style ring drive on it and call it good

Oh well, I welcome the new 16-50, can't wait to see how it performs.

Sandy Hancock · 02-27-2021, 12:33 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by caliscouser

I prefer the idea of designing the motor around the optics than designing the optics around the motor.

I agree. But....

....the old 16-50 had significant optical flaws, so a complete re-design was thoroughly justified.

The 50-135 is optically pretty darn good already, so a beefed up DC ring motor might be all that is needed. If it can be made to work with the current optical formula.

repaap · 02-27-2021, 01:02 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by caliscouser

I prefer the idea of designing the motor around the optics than designing the optics around the motor.

noooooooooo...don't change the optics. It's perfect. Just stick a beefy Canon style ring drive on it and call it good

Oh well, I welcome the new 16-50, can't wait to see how it performs.

I echo what Sandy said about 16-50, even if it is nice lens it is not free from problems.

about lens design all in all, I'm not expert. I think that I like the idea of doing it like this and propably engineers do know even better. Everyone knows that 50-135 is pretty good, but it could be that they can do that still even better. In terms of rendering but also especially terms of AF speed.

**Pål Jensen** · 02-27-2021, 03:59 AM - **2 Likes**

The old 16-50 is the one star lens that don't deserve the star designation. It has star quality stopped down but wide open, particularly at the wide setting edge sharpness suffers and it can show lots of fringing. The lens also flares a lot for a Pentax lens. Not to mention the SDM problems....

**Rondec** · 02-27-2021, 04:48 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Sandy Hancock

I agree. But....

....the old 16-50 had significant optical flaws, so a complete re-design was thoroughly justified.

The 50-135 is optically pretty darn good already, so a beefed up DC ring motor might be all that is needed. If it can be made to work with the current optical formula.

Exactly. This is the sort of lens that could bring me back to APS-C a bit. The 24-70 isn't that great and if this cleans up some of the flaws of the old DA *16-50 (slow SDM, tendency to flare, distortion at 16mm, etc) it would be a really awesome lens to shoot.

I am sure we need to temper expectations -- odds are that there will still be quite a bit of distortion at 16mm and odds are good as well that the lens will flare (that much glass just ends up having more flare issues than a prime), but certainly faster auto focus and little improvement in optics would give a very nice package.

As you say, the 50-135 is already very nice and if they took out the screw drive mechanism and installed a faster motor, that would probably good enough for most folks.

**Pål Jensen** · 02-27-2021, 05:13 AM

Originally posted by Rondec

I am sure we need to temper expectations -- odds are that there will still be quite a bit of distortion at 16mm and odds are good as well that the lens will flare (that much glass just ends up having more flare issues than a prime), but certainly faster auto focus and little improvement in optics would give a very nice package..

The DA* 11-18 is very resistant to flare by any standards. For a superwide zoom it is unheard of. So there is hope for the new 16-50....

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02-26-2021, 06:56 AM - 1 Like	#241
Jonathan Mac Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Madrid, Spain Posts: 10,894	This is the first lens that Pentax have put out in ages that I'd really like to have and might even be prepared to sell significant gear (that would be missed) in order to fund. Maybe I shouldn't have just blown €700 on a couple of new lenses for my Fujifilm system....

02-26-2021, 07:16 AM - 1 Like	#242
Larrymc Site Supporter Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: Mississippi, USA Posts: 5,251	Originally posted by Jonathan Mac This is the first lens that Pentax have put out in ages that I'd really like to have and might even be prepared to sell significant gear (that would be missed) in order to fund. Maybe I shouldn't have just blown €700 on a couple of new lenses for my Fujifilm system.... C'est la vie

02-26-2021, 07:51 AM - 7 Likes	#243
reh321 Pentaxian Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: South Bend, IN, USA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 23,177	Originally posted by Jonathan Mac This is the first lens that Pentax have put out in ages that I'd really like to have and might even be prepared to sell significant gear (that would be missed) in order to fund. Maybe I shouldn't have just blown €700 on a couple of new lenses for my Fujifilm system.... You could start by selling the Fujifilm lenses.

02-26-2021, 07:53 AM	#244
bladerunner6 Pentaxian Join Date: Nov 2014 Photos: Albums Posts: 2,080	Is this definitely a new optical formula? Thanks.

02-26-2021, 08:02 AM - 2 Likes	#245
Kunzite Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Romania Posts: 15,132	Originally posted by bladerunner6 Is this definitely a new optical formula? Thanks. Definitely. The old one couldn't use PLM autofocus; nor would it meet Pentax' current standards.

02-26-2021, 08:04 AM - 2 Likes	#246
bladerunner6 Pentaxian Join Date: Nov 2014 Photos: Albums Posts: 2,080	Originally posted by Kunzite Definitely. The old one couldn't use PLM autofocus; nor would it meet Pentax' current standards. Thanks so much!

02-26-2021, 05:57 PM	#247
TwoUptons Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2015 Photos: Albums Posts: 4,213	Originally posted by thibs The only thing annoying me with this lens (but it won't bother me since I won't buy it, my K5 would not run it properly anyway) is the absence of any distance scale on the barrel. AFAIK this is because of PLM. I understand that but still a pity for a DA* lens (I would not care a dime of it was a consumer class lens). Won't bother me at night the slightest though. I hadn't noticed the lack of a distance scale... that's a little weird... It's just one of those things I'm used to seeing, and the old DA* 16-50 has one. The DFA 28-105 doesn't have one, either, so it isn't just a PLM thing. -Eric

02-26-2021, 06:02 PM	#248
pres589 Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Wichita, KS Photos: Albums Posts: 4,529	A lot of Pentax zooms lost distance scales over the years. Some of them also lack hard stops at either end of the focusing range which is really awful. One of the few things I really don't like about my 18-135.

02-26-2021, 07:47 PM - 6 Likes	#249
JPT Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Tokyo Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,821	This lens was featured right at the end of the session yesterday evening for the FA Limited lens talk. They did not give much concrete information, but explained a little about the creation of the lens. The person in charge of development, Tetsuya Iwasaki, explained that this lens contains their latest technology. It was designed from the start to have the best AF performance possible and that is what the PLM motor was selected. PLM motors cannot drive heavy elements so they needed to create a completely new optical design for it. I think this explains why Ricoh cannot just reissue their lenses with a motor replacing screw drive. It is not that simple. Also, It makes me think that a remake of the 50-135mm star lens seems inevitable, but it is unlikely to use the same optical design. The other speaker, Kazuo Ikenaga, had used the lens for a while and gave his impressions. - The AF is practically instantaneous and accurate. This is from his use on a K-3 (not the Mark III). - The close focusing ability is really impressive. It can focus as close as 30 cm. He showed a close-up photo of a blossom to illustrate this. - It is quite a substantial lens - Big and weighty. Of course, the philosophy of the start lenses is completely different from the Limiteds, and it was an interesting contrast to see them in the same video. There were a few samples shown. They said it was a prototype but, lens showed no signs of being rough. It looked like a finished item. The release is planned for 2021. They mentioned a couple of times how it is the ideal match for the K-3 Mark III, so with the delay to that camera I think there is a good chance they will be launched at the same time.

02-26-2021, 10:59 PM	#250
caliscouser Site Supporter Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: SF Bay Area, CA Photos: Albums Posts: 1,037	Originally posted by JPT t was designed from the start to have the best AF performance possible and that is what the PLM motor was selected. PLM motors cannot drive heavy elements so they needed to create a completely new optical design for it. I prefer the idea of designing the motor around the optics than designing the optics around the motor. Originally posted by JPT Also, It makes me think that a remake of the 50-135mm star lens seems inevitable, but it is unlikely to use the same optical design noooooooooo...don't change the optics. It's perfect. Just stick a beefy Canon style ring drive on it and call it good Oh well, I welcome the new 16-50, can't wait to see how it performs.

02-27-2021, 12:33 AM - 1 Like	#251
Sandy Hancock Moderator Site Supporter Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Adelaide Hills, South Australia Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 11,272	Originally posted by caliscouser I prefer the idea of designing the motor around the optics than designing the optics around the motor. I agree. But.... ....the old 16-50 had significant optical flaws, so a complete re-design was thoroughly justified. The 50-135 is optically pretty darn good already, so a beefed up DC ring motor might be all that is needed. If it can be made to work with the current optical formula.

02-27-2021, 01:02 AM - 1 Like	#252
repaap Pentaxian Join Date: Oct 2010 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 6,242	Originally posted by caliscouser I prefer the idea of designing the motor around the optics than designing the optics around the motor. noooooooooo...don't change the optics. It's perfect. Just stick a beefy Canon style ring drive on it and call it good Oh well, I welcome the new 16-50, can't wait to see how it performs. I echo what Sandy said about 16-50, even if it is nice lens it is not free from problems. about lens design all in all, I'm not expert. I think that I like the idea of doing it like this and propably engineers do know even better. Everyone knows that 50-135 is pretty good, but it could be that they can do that still even better. In terms of rendering but also especially terms of AF speed.

02-27-2021, 03:59 AM - 2 Likes	#253
Pål Jensen Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Norway Photos: Albums Posts: 4,371	The old 16-50 is the one star lens that don't deserve the star designation. It has star quality stopped down but wide open, particularly at the wide setting edge sharpness suffers and it can show lots of fringing. The lens also flares a lot for a Pentax lens. Not to mention the SDM problems....

02-27-2021, 04:48 AM - 1 Like	#254
Rondec Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Gladys, Virginia Photos: Gallery Posts: 27,652	Originally posted by Sandy Hancock I agree. But.... ....the old 16-50 had significant optical flaws, so a complete re-design was thoroughly justified. The 50-135 is optically pretty darn good already, so a beefed up DC ring motor might be all that is needed. If it can be made to work with the current optical formula. Exactly. This is the sort of lens that could bring me back to APS-C a bit. The 24-70 isn't that great and if this cleans up some of the flaws of the old DA *16-50 (slow SDM, tendency to flare, distortion at 16mm, etc) it would be a really awesome lens to shoot. I am sure we need to temper expectations -- odds are that there will still be quite a bit of distortion at 16mm and odds are good as well that the lens will flare (that much glass just ends up having more flare issues than a prime), but certainly faster auto focus and little improvement in optics would give a very nice package. As you say, the 50-135 is already very nice and if they took out the screw drive mechanism and installed a faster motor, that would probably good enough for most folks.

02-27-2021, 05:13 AM	#255
Pål Jensen Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Norway Photos: Albums Posts: 4,371	Originally posted by Rondec I am sure we need to temper expectations -- odds are that there will still be quite a bit of distortion at 16mm and odds are good as well that the lens will flare (that much glass just ends up having more flare issues than a prime), but certainly faster auto focus and little improvement in optics would give a very nice package.. The DA* 11-18 is very resistant to flare by any standards. For a superwide zoom it is unheard of. So there is hope for the new 16-50....