[cmohr]

Quality used to come from Japan. Do not think that Ricoh is doing the right thing: They do not give you what you want, but the customer gives Ricoh what they want, money. "When I was young" Pentax was the camera that was more affordable than any other brand. Ricoh/Pentax is not that affordable anymore, although I can afford it now. It seems that I have to use up the equipment I now have and either look elsewhere or just find another pastime with or without good company.

Sorry... In Australia, Pentax has always been more expensive than any other brand, in 1983, buying a Pentax was far more expensive than a Canon or Nikon.. Ect ect... In 1996 my FA*200/2.8 was twice the price of a Nikkor 200/2.8, not to mention how much more the FA*85/1.4 was, and you couldn't afford a 20-35mm lens from the others, yet, I could buy the stunning FA 20-35/f4.

I have lots of friends with all the offerings from Canikion, all, look at all my lenses, both past and present with a bit of awe. None put them under theirs in both quality or value for money.

[repaap]

There is no lens for which everyone waits.

If I look at my own polling, I'd guess 65% of Pentax shooters won't even prefer the images to the FA* 85 1.4 or 77 1.8. Appreciation of these types of lenses really require that you know what to look for (out of focus areas and transitions) with not so much attention payed to subkject resolution. The vast majority of shooters think subject sharpness is all that matters. It's possible even my 18-135 will match this lens for subject sharpness, once you get into CA control, transitions and the smoothness of the out of focus areas, you will see difference. But, many do not look at those things.

When the DFA* 50 came out I bought an on sale DA*55 1.4. I could see the difference, it wasn't important to me. But I don't shoot portraits and rarely shoot under ƒ5.6. SO for me the extra money for the 50 was a no go. And there are lots of lenses for people like me. What is with all these people who think every new lens released should be for them?

There are a lot of people who just don't seem to understand, their shooting style doesn't require premium lenses. That's not slight or anything, it's just an observation.

This is a professional portrait lens. Not a professional portrait photographer of studio product photographer? Then it's probably overkill for what you shoot. And there's nothing wrong with that.

I know couple 'Pro' shooters shoot what they can get away with wether it is 2.8 zoom or just 24-105 or then something like 28-105. Once you stop it down to f 8 and use flashes, ect, it does create exellent result. I actually bought my DFA 28-105 to do exactly that and landscapes(have been using it for lot of things, why not). I use DFA*70-200 for 2.8-5,6 shooting, mostly 3,2 actually. But sometimes it is too narrow Dof. This new 85/1.4 will be in use from 1.4 till 5,6 too. Really looking for that wide open performance they do proise. But if that is not what one is looking for, why to bother. perhaps this DFA*85 could replace my DFA* 70-200, but it's remarkable lovely Bokeh from 100-200 @ 2,8 would hount me. Going to buy 1,4 extender for it too(would buy 2x if it was there) to get it close 300mm. Yea, but t is nonsense to pay the premium, if there is no need for it or you don't get thrilled by that kind of photography.

[normhead]

I know couple 'Pro' shooters shoot what they can get away with wether it is 2.8 zoom or just 24-105 or then something like 28-105. Once you stop it down to f 8 and use flashes, ect, it does create exellent result. I actually bought my DFA 28-105 to do exactly that and landscapes(have been using it for lot of things, why not). I use DFA*70-200 for 2.8-5,6 shooting, mostly 3,2 actually. But sometimes it is too narrow Dof. This new 85/1.4 will be in use from 1.4 till 5,6 too. Really looking for that wide open performance they do proise. But if that is not what one is looking for, why to bother. perhaps this DFA*85 could replace my DFA* 70-200, but it's remarkable lovely Bokeh from 100-200 @ 2,8 would hount me. Going to buy 1,4 extender for it too(would buy 2x if it was there) to get it close 300mm. Yea, but t is nonsense to pay the premium, if there is no need for it or you don't get thrilled by that kind of photography.

Ya, I have my DA*55 1.4, that's enough thrills for me.

But before I had my 55, I could shoot 200mm 2.8 if I wanted a smooth background. It's not like I was living in image poverty.

[repaap]

Ya, I have my DA*55 1.4, that's enough thrills for me.

But before I had my 55, I could shoot 200mm 2.8 if I wanted a smooth background. It's not like I was living in image poverty.

Yes, several ways to smoothen BG.

[Wheatfield]

Hey people, let's remember that in a world where we can be anything we want, be kind. Bruce has his opinion. He's entitled to intelligent rebuttal.

[zapp]

Pentax is a serious camera maker, nothing cheap about Pentax. For some applications Pentax offered product features you could not find anywhere else at the same price - specially in cameras: weather sealing, decent finders, great sensors... lenses als had special attributes, but were never cheap. For comparative products, Pentax has to ask more money since they sell less units or sell for longer time than others. They still sold decent gear at low price. The high price, high feature lines were not updated in recent times. DFA* and FF have changed this. The quality of 50 and 85 is top notch to modern standards. The FF ltds have aged but still render very nicely. Price wise these ltds are costly, but apparently they sell. The DA limited line is also unique and complete up to 70mm. Pentax’ portfolio and competence is growing and older gear is upgraded at the same time. The future is bright, feature loaded, classic and nice to see shaping up.

[bedisaab]

I don't care about the price even though it might squeeze me for few weeks but I am going to buy it by Christmas. I am going to buy this beautiful D*FA 85mm F1.4 primarily to shoot my son till he graduates from the college. And he is 21 months old right now. // Yes K-1, D*FA 50mm, & D*FA85mm will make my old age worth looking back.

[robbiec]

Poor Pentax, the amount of opprobrium they have generated because they delivered a lens that their user base specifically asked for, is astonishing for me personally and must be utterly confusing for Pentax Japan. We have seen here and elsewhere complaints about price, weight, size, too much resolution, etc, etc. All we need now is to anoint this lens as the harbringer of the long expected doom of Pentax.

: We asked for it, we've got it, celebrate it

: Ricoh is shifting Pentax from a more mass market consumer offering to a more informed higher end photographic experience whilst keeping the optical viewfinder and mirror.

:Pentax will not be offering professional services now or in the foreseeable future, if you need this, perhaps you should reevaluate your choice of system.

:Physics and the advent of Internet lens testing led by popular sites such as Dxomark, Photozone, Lenstip and others has led resolution or sharpness to be the fashion on those sites. It used to be that you could have a sharp lens but the corners would not match till f/8, then the fashion was for less sharpness in the centre but more uniform across the frame and now it is sharp across the frame at relatively wide apertures. The 3rd party vendors have jumped on this bandwagon and now some are observing that images are becoming more uniform and lacking that something they have seen in the past.
That is where the Limited's come in. They have the older rendition style that some gravitate to but with better coatings and resolution. The *s are right, let's see if we can combine the two and push what is possible with technology as it stands for a reasonable price point for some not for others.

Everyone here has a choice, like, dislike, buy or not buy. But don't whinge about it and don't annoy me with but but but, I want this and nobody listens to me.. Grow up. If you think it is too big, heavy, too sharp, too whatever don't buy it. If it is out of reach for budget reasons, OK, fair enough, wait for a while, there is always some idiot with more money than sense who will buy first and offload for 50c on the dollar because it will be too much for their talent. On the upside, there will be a load of Limited 77S, A*85s or FA*85s coming up on the marketplace in the near future, they all can create fantastic images, you just have to figure out how.

[normhead]

The back stories on the web site are incredible, never seen anything like it. They started out looking at competitors designs, and were determined to do better. Based their first design on the FA* 85 and couldn't make it work. Decided to go to the concave element but couldn't make it work with the old design. Then completely redesigned the lens from scratch, after they'd already been working on it for sounds like months. Then they threw out their weight and size restrictions for the redesign and just went for top quality.

I suspect when folks get this lens, they'll understand immediately why it took so long. Thank god they weren't listening to the whiners and just pushed something inferior out the door, just to please the unwashed masses, who want everything yesterday.

I'm not planning to buy this lens, although I love the tree flower images taken with it. But it's the kind of lens that if you're a serious camera company, you should sell one, and it's the kind of lens portrait pros will buy into Pentax for.

Seriously, with the DFA*50 1.4 and DFA* 85 1.4, its time to start asking when the other companies are going to get back into the game. Time has passed them by.

I feel like Pentax has entered the modern world.

[Serkevan]

The back stories on the web site are incredible, never seen anything like it. They started started out looking at competitors designs, and were determined to do better. Based their first design on the FA* 85 and couldn't make it work. Decided to go to the concave element but couldn't make it work with the old design. Then completely redesigned the lens from scratch, after they'd already been working on it for sounds like months. Then they though out heir weight and size restrictions for the redesign and just went for top quality.

I suspect when folks get this lens, they'll understand immediately why it took so long. That god they weren't listening to the whiners and just pushed something inferior out the door, just to please the unwashed masses.

I'm not planning to buy this lens, although I love the tree flower images taken with it. But i's the kind of lens that if you're a serious camera company, you should sell one, and it's the kind of lens portrait pros will buy into Pentax for.

Seriously, with the DFA*50 1.4 and DFA* 85 1.4, its time to start asking when the other companies are going to get back into the game. Time has passed them by.

I feel like Pentax has entered the modern world.

And by "competitors" they mean the 5K Otus from Zeiss*, who themselves are no slouches when they want to go big and make great lenses. Pentax glass doesn't have to excuse itself or feel jealous of anyone else.

I also love the tree flower images, the background looks hand-painted. Now I want to visit Japan more than I did before, and that's no easy feat .


*The optical diagram is almost the same (both lenses have two main element blocks; the rear block is identical or very very similar, while the front block with the concave element has one additional element in the DFA 85. That they managed to add a heavy AF motor in (roughly) the same weight is also great.

[Larrymc]

Pentax has always made top quality lenses. And they still make affordable lenses. You can buy an 18-50 and 50-200 for almost peanuts.

Your statements leave me incredulous.


Because you own every piece of Pentax gear you'd like to shoot with and now can only turn to newly released product to fulfill your needs?

Some of us are happy using the equipment we have now. And the DFA 21 is pretty much all I'm waiting for. Because we are interested in taking images, more than owning lenses as a goal in itself.

For APS_c I have 8mm to 600mm covered.
For FF I have 14mm to 600mm covered.

I have 2.8 lenses 1.4 lenses 1.8 lenses ƒ4 lenses and variable aperture lenses.

I am unclear as to why your need for cheap lenses would be put ahead of those seeking modern premium lenses. Do you really think there isn't enough legacy glass for all but the most niche purposes? The catalogue is full of glass that can be purchased new, but that's not good enough for some.

Oh right, what you want is a lens like the 85 for not much money. Because Pentax is the company that produces premium quality product at bargain basement prices?.. Never was, never will be, nothing has changed.

If I sell my FAJ 18-35, FA 35-80 and F 70-210 someone could cover the whole 18-210 range in FF for $300, all AF lenses and they would all benefit from shake reduction. What kind of bargains are you looking for? What other company offers that?

Some people just want to sit around and bitch to feel relevant..........that's the only reason for his post! me I chose to get out and shoot when I can.........it sure beats sitting around and bitching all the time!

[Kunzite]

Seriously, with the DFA*50 1.4 and DFA* 85 1.4, its time to start asking when the other companies are going to get back into the game. Time has passed them by.

I feel like Pentax has entered the modern world.

This is why I so adamantly argue about/for the modern high-end lenses. They're something else.

[monochrome]

To be fair machined metal is substantially more expensive (and better quality). "All metal" can also be applied to 0.50€ cat food cans...


The optics are cheaper at least to some degree, and the AF motor is certainly going to be cheaper than the high-torque unit needed for the D FA* 50 and 85 - focusing group will be lighter so much less of an engineering problem to solve.

Pricing the D FA 21 Limited as the D FA* 85 would be frankly preposterous.

The 21 Limited will cost 1/2 what the *85 costs.

[monochrome]

You are spot on here.

• There are distinct lens lines with specific design briefs.
• Limiteds are not interchangeable with *’s.
• I will move (financial) mountains to buy the *85.
• Whining about the price is just . . . whining.

Poor Pentax, the amount of opprobrium they have generated because they delivered a lens that their user base specifically asked for, is astonishing for me personally and must be utterly confusing for Pentax Japan. We have seen here and elsewhere complaints about price, weight, size, too much resolution, etc, etc. All we need now is to anoint this lens as the harbringer of the long expected doom of Pentax.

: We asked for it, we've got it, celebrate it

: Ricoh is shifting Pentax from a more mass market consumer offering to a more informed higher end photographic experience whilst keeping the optical viewfinder and mirror.

:Pentax will not be offering professional services now or in the foreseeable future, if you need this, perhaps you should reevaluate your choice of system.

:Physics and the advent of Internet lens testing led by popular sites such as Dxomark, Photozone, Lenstip and others has led resolution or sharpness to be the fashion on those sites. It used to be that you could have a sharp lens but the corners would not match till f/8, then the fashion was for less sharpness in the centre but more uniform across the frame and now it is sharp across the frame at relatively wide apertures. The 3rd party vendors have jumped on this bandwagon and now some are observing that images are becoming more uniform and lacking that something they have seen in the past.
That is where the Limited's come in. They have the older rendition style that some gravitate to but with better coatings and resolution. The *s are right, let's see if we can combine the two and push what is possible with technology as it stands for a reasonable price point for some not for others.

Everyone here has a choice, like, dislike, buy or not buy. But don't whinge about it and don't annoy me with but but but, I want this and nobody listens to me.. Grow up. If you think it is too big, heavy, too sharp, too whatever don't buy it. If it is out of reach for budget reasons, OK, fair enough, wait for a while, there is always some idiot with more money than sense who will buy first and offload for 50c on the dollar because it will be too much for their talent. On the upside, there will be a load of Limited 77S, A*85s or FA*85s coming up on the marketplace in the near future, they all can create fantastic images, you just have to figure out how.

[Serkevan]

The 21 Limited will cost 1/2 what the *85 costs.

Probably more than half - I don't see it at 999 €/$. I also don't see it over 1500, though.