[deejjjaaaa]

that is the most likely possibility.

if they will upgrade K20D to K30D that should be hell of ugrade to leave any space for K300D between K30D and Km... I 'd rather "upgrade" K20D to K300D and K20D to APS-H sensor... I guess it is easier to get APS-H sensor in than make APS-C K30D w/ better (keep Nikon D300 as a mark) AF/shutter/metering/frames-per-second.

[séamuis]

if they will upgrade K20D to K30D that should be hell of ugrade to leave any space for K300D between K30D and Km... I 'd rather "upgrade" K20D to K300D and K20D to APS-H sensor... I guess it is easier to get APS-H sensor in than make APS-C K30D w/ better (keep Nikon D300 as a mark) AF/shutter/metering/frames-per-second.

agreed. I would also like to see this as the path, as it seems the most sensible. time will tell I guess.

[Supernaut]

Of course. Rumor.
But I think that APS-H is not bad idea as I thought before...
APS-H can offer low noise, close to FF. If Pentax can offer such camera for USD1300-1500 it could be very cool.

That price will of course make people want it But with an aps-h, the talk will always be more like "pentax tried to do what others do, but failed". A sophisticated apc-c camera is my guess.

[séamuis]

That price will of course make people want it But with an aps-h, the talk will always be more like "pentax tried to do what others do, but failed". A sophisticated apc-c camera is my guess.

people have been talking like that about Pentax sense the 90's. nothing new there. but I don't agree. I think an APS-H sensor will be welcomed with open arms and I don't think it will take too much battering outside of canikon fanboys. the same fanboys who will pay a far higher price for the same quality. that and if its a samsung sensor withthe same quality as the one in the K20D I think its more likely to be praised as a camera delivering near full frame quality. the k20D is already seen this way by a number of people so I can only imagine such a sensor just blowing people away in IQ. especially with an FA limited lens.

[deejjjaaaa]

But with an aps-h, the talk will always be more like "pentax tried to do what others do, but failed". A sophisticated apc-c camera is my guess.

but w/o it the talk will be "Pentax can't even dare to do anything to challenge anybody" ... what does Pentax have in camera dept (let us keep lenses alone for a while)... Panasonic has m4/3 and Oly at least has (was forced to) m4/3 camera in the work... C & N & S are in FF w/ various flavors of it (from low MP to high MP per FF sensor and prices from under $2K to you name it)... Sigma can claim Foveon... Fuji can claim SuperCCD or whatever it is... and Pentax ?

[blende8]

The K30D will have the same sensor as the K20D, I have been told by someone "in the know".

[séamuis]

The K30D will have the same sensor as the K20D, I have been told by someone "in the know".

and this in the know person would be a Pentax employee? a Japanese employee?

[séamuis]

Sigma can claim Foveon... Fuji can claim SuperCCD or whatever it is... and Pentax ?

I wouldnt consider either of those much of a claim considering there sales and market share.

[deejjjaaaa]

and this in the know person would be a Pentax employee? a Japanese employee?

who is our local champ in terms of leaks ? Codiac2600 no less.

[Ratmagiclady]

but w/o it the talk will be "Pentax can't even dare to do anything to challenge anybody" ... what does Pentax have in camera dept (let us keep lenses alone for a while)... Panasonic has m4/3 and Oly at least has (was forced to) m4/3 camera in the work... C & N & S are in FF w/ various flavors of it (from low MP to high MP per FF sensor and prices from under $2K to you name it)... Sigma can claim Foveon... Fuji can claim SuperCCD or whatever it is... and Pentax ?

Challenge? Claim? How bout less testosterone, more results.

Pentax shouldn't let Canon and Nikon and certainly not Four-Thirds get inside their decision curve. Do what you can do, and do it the best you can, then put it in my hands, that's what I'd say.

If Canon had been willing to think a bit more like Pentax, they'd have had me back by now. And have had an advantage that their focusing rings go the right direction. They may have bigger sensors *available,* Canon, but not that I can have. In fact most of their line has more of a crop factor, if that's a bone of contention of itself.

I *shot* Canon FD back in the day, and it was pretty much the Nikon snobs who would be the bullies about gear. It's not Pentax's fault if a lot of 'new Canon' people have tuned to geekery about numbers.

Of course the numbers mean things, but ..yeah, this is geekery. Sports fans do it, photogs do it, motorheads do it, kids with game consoles do it. Substituting some figures for some kind of ego thing. It's not like it was once, but yeah, *geekery* will allow a lot of males feeling a bit inadequate find a way to express how they feel about a *girl* waving a camera or whatever object.

Now, I'm hardly a 'competetive' photographer in any sense, but when I get a good image and someone says 'What's that from, a 5d? Nikon?' ...Always a smirk when out comes the old brass&glass. Yaknow, I mean, people whine about slow AF, like that makes them hard-core or something, but I *still* think AF is a crutch. (And pardon my limping . Sometimes it *is* really handy, ..and better is always better, but why the whining from all these *awesomely-* skilled photographers? Can't you focus? )

It'll do. I fully-expect to be further grudgingly-impressed in the future. In my world, the best thing they could do fo AF is make it ever-easier to *override* with all lenses, with finders to match, ...and if my camera says, 'OK, I got it, boss,' I want to be able to make book on that.

That's the news from 1990, folks, where all the finders are big, all the serious lenses are primes, and all the synch speeds are above average.

who is our local champ in terms of leaks ? Codiac2600 no less.

Of course you're the undisputed champ of rudeness

Radu

[séamuis]

Challenge? Claim? How bout less testosterone, more results.

Pentax shouldn't let Canon and Nikon and certainly not Four-Thirds get inside their decision curve. Do what you can do, and do it the best you can, then put it in my hands, that's what I'd say.

If Canon had been willing to think a bit more like Pentax, they'd have had me back by now. And have had an advantage that their focusing rings go the right direction. They may have bigger sensors *available,* Canon, but not that I can have. In fact most of their line has more of a crop factor, if that's a bone of contention of itself.

I *shot* Canon FD back in the day, and it was pretty much the Nikon snobs who would be the bullies about gear. It's not Pentax's fault if a lot of 'new Canon' people have tuned to geekery about numbers.

Of course the numbers mean things, but ..yeah, this is geekery. Sports fans do it, photogs do it, motorheads do it, kids with game consoles do it. Substituting some figures for some kind of ego thing. It's not like it was once, but yeah, *geekery* will allow a lot of males feeling a bit inadequate find a way to express how they feel about a *girl* waving a camera or whatever object.

Now, I'm hardly a 'competetive' photographer in any sense, but when I get a good image and someone says 'What's that from, a 5d? Nikon?' ...Always a smirk when out comes the old brass&glass. Yaknow, I mean, people whine about slow AF, like that makes them hard-core or something, but I *still* think AF is a crutch. (And pardon my limping . Sometimes it *is* really handy, ..and better is always better, but why the whining from all these *awesomely-* skilled photographers? Can't you focus? )

It'll do. I fully-expect to be further grudgingly-impressed in the future. In my world, the best thing they could do fo AF is make it ever-easier to *override* with all lenses, with finders to match, ...and if my camera says, 'OK, I got it, boss,' I want to be able to make book on that.

That's the news from 1990, folks, where all the finders are big, all the serious lenses are primes, and all the synch speeds are above average.

I think im in love...

[Blue]

. . .
That's the news from 1990, folks, where all the finders are big, all the serious lenses are primes, and all the synch speeds are above average.

Your last name wouldn't be Keillor by chance?

The way I see it Samsung is at least on par with Sony as a silicon foundry and this is a huge advantage for Pentax. So instead of obeying standards that are as natural as a 2 dollar bill (APS-C) they should make the largest yet still significantly cheaper than FF sensor possible. With C 50D new on market and N 400D still dependant on Sony's sensor they could get a window of opportunity in which Pentax will be pretty clearly separated in the semi-pro class forcing C, N and S to lower BOTH their APS-C semi-pro and entry level FF to compete. In the mean time Pentax could rebuild their FF lens range with new models like they did on APS-C and after a year or two they could launch a FF camera under they own terms and incorporating mass produced components like image pipeline, AF, shutter just like the others do.
If they don't follow this and they reuse the same sensor (with improvements but same size and pixel count) on the K30D then they either buy the 12Mp from Sony (stupid) and make a new 12Mp with Samsung (even more stupider). They will still follow instead of leading and still confronting head to head the other 3 companies instead of outflanking them.
A K300D with a slightly revised 14,6Mp sensor and a strong heritage of K20D will put immense pressure on mid range cameras from the competition especially if it would have:

- decent LV;
- movie mode even in a crude state like D90;
- LiIon battery;
- more than 3.5 fps - existent in K-m's new shutter;
- unlimited jpeg buffer instead of the paltry 4 frames in K200D;
- 3" LCD maybe something like 460K;
- next gen SR;
- better iq than K20 and not by far - .5 stops better noise control and DR are enough;
- weather sealed kit lenses (both wide and tele) + a longer zoom - preferably SDM-ed too - and this is IMO the reason they made DA L series because this will remain the only non sealed, non SDM kit lenses soon (at least I hope);
- a bit smaller than K200D, a bit rounder;
- maybe pentaprism, maybe top LCD - but this will be determined by marketing studies made on the targeted consumer, not people like us ...


My bet is still on a K300D on 14.6 MP and a K30D with larger sensor and over 20 Mp.

Radu

[deejjjaaaa]

If Canon had been willing to think a bit more like Pentax, they'd have had me back by now.

I guess they did prefer to have market share instead of you... can't blame them