[Serkevan]

Ricoh was very firm about the KP not being a replacement for the K3 right from the outset. It is only purveyors of misinformation who have said otherwise.
Ricoh’s only mistake in the matter was discontinuing the K3 before the replacement was ready. If they had had a better stock level at the time there MIGHT have been less angst and the accompanying whinging and misinformation.

Wait, so top level executives of Ricoh are purveyors of misinformation? Can't trust no one...

[reh321]

Ricoh was very firm about the KP not being a replacement for the K3 right from the outset. It is only purveyors of misinformation who have said otherwise.
Ricoh’s only mistake in the matter was discontinuing the K3 before the replacement was ready. If they had had a better stock level at the time there MIGHT have been less angst and the accompanying whinging and misinformation.

To my ears, Pentax was never so consistently clear in their thinking; I also do not believe they are as inept as that implies - leaving a major vacancy in their line for as long as been since the last K-3ii left their warehouses. I believe their executives originally planned to make the K-1 the 'flagship', with the KP filling in the line for those who preferred a little less, but the K-1 is too slow in "FF" mode and too small in "APS-C" mode, and the KP has all the shortcomings people have repeatedly recited over the past couple of years.

Looking at their output, at least one body per year, then a big gap, is also strange. Perhaps all of Ricoh's resources were concentrated on the GR-3 for a period of time, but I don't feel that it explains it either. Listening to what they have said in their meetings with Adam, I believe that either something totally unexpected happened, or they changed course at least once.

In any case, I am perfectly happy with my KP, and I hope that K-7/5/3 shooters will be equally happy in the next few months.

[Kunzite]

Wait, so top level executives of Ricoh are purveyors of misinformation? Can't trust no one...

The information that the KP was not a K-3II replacement, but in a separate line comes directly from "top level executives of Ricoh" - particularly, from Mr. Takashi Arai.

[Serkevan]

The information that the KP was not a K-3II replacement, but in a separate line comes directly from "top level executives of Ricoh" - particularly, from Mr. Takashi Arai.

It is a separate line but it was intended as the "top" level APS-C camera. In any case, this discussion has happened numerous times and what Ricoh thought or didn't think when they discontinued the K-3ii is irrelevant - The K-New is coming and those who didn't see the K-1 as the upgrade they wanted to the K-7/5/3 series will have the camera they want. Can't use the K-1 name anymore, though

[Kunzite]

To my ears, Pentax was never so consistently clear in their thinking; I also do not believe they are as inept as that implies - leaving a major vacancy in their line for as long as been since the last K-3ii left their warehouses. I believe their executives originally planned to make the K-1 the 'flagship', with the KP filling in the line for those who preferred a little less, but the K-1 is too slow in "FF" mode and too small in "APS-C" mode, and the KP has all the shortcomings people have repeatedly recited over the past couple of years.

Looking at their output, at least one body per year, then a big gap, is also strange. Perhaps all of Ricoh's resources were concentrated on the GR-3 for a period of time, but I don't feel that it explains it either. Listening to what they have said in their meetings with Adam, I believe that either something totally unexpected happened, or they changed course at least once.

In any case, I am perfectly happy with my KP, and I hope that K-7/5/3 shooters will be equally happy in the next few months.

There's so much we don't know.
Was continuing to produce the K-3 even an option? (think: component availability) Would a new batch be economically feasible?
What's the actual cause of the so-called major vacancy? (I suppose, developing the new generation of cameras)
How many cameras can they work on in parallel?

[Kunzite]

It is a separate line but it was intended as the "top" level APS-C camera. In any case, this discussion has happened numerous times and what Ricoh thought or didn't think when they discontinued the K-3ii is irrelevant - The K-New is coming and those who didn't see the K-1 as the upgrade they wanted to the K-7/5/3 series will have the camera they want. Can't use the K-1 name anymore, though

Let's look at the little facts we know: since 2017, Ricoh Imaging was actively working on a new pentaprism for a significantly improved APS-C viewfinder.
I don't know how long for the new electronics and AF system, but those seems a bit more complex...

So, did they really intended to have the KP as the "top" level APS-C camera, or their intention was to have a true APS-C flagship all along?

[Serkevan]

Let's look at the little facts we know: since 2017, Ricoh Imaging was actively working on a new pentaprism for a significantly improved APS-C viewfinder.
I don't know how long for the new electronics and AF system, but those seems a bit more complex...

So, did they really intended to have the KP as the "top" level APS-C camera, or their intention was to have a true APS-C flagship all along?

We cannot know, honestly - they might have intended it for the K-1iii, for the KPii or they had, all along, the plan for a K-3ii successor. There's also the fact that companies can and will try to give the impression that they have a plan perfectly put in place that has never been upset or miscalculated .

In the end, I still think that the only facts that matter from a consumer perspective are that the K-New is coming, and that Ricoh has stated it will be awesome.

[mbukal]

how much competition in a short time of approx. 16 months of issuing new photo bodies and lenses, how many competitors fail due to poor economic calculations for their products, where Pentax is, it unfortunately lags behind in technological progress since the advent of autofocus, but fortunately did not fail - did not disappear, successfully swims on the surface thanks to the smart economic calculation for its products, I hope that its economic calculation will remain stable and technological progress will be great enough that its overall quality differs from the competition only in approach and method of use and not in some less important for both ordinary and advanced user no essential details for the overall impression of the product, I personally enjoy K1 using it via ovf with the lenses I have, but, I would like the K1 to have a reliable af-c + faster writing to the card / faster emptying the cartridge + greater choice of quick-focus af lenses (kaf4 ) with an aperture of f4 that can satisfy a reliable af-c

[Biro]

It is a separate line but it was intended as the "top" level APS-C camera. In any case, this discussion has happened numerous times and what Ricoh thought or didn't think when they discontinued the K-3ii is irrelevant - The K-New is coming and those who didn't see the K-1 as the upgrade they wanted to the K-7/5/3 series will have the camera they want. Can't use the K-1 name anymore, though

This is quite true. But, just to throw my two-cents worth in, Ricoh said nothing about the KP not being an APS-C flagship when it was introduced. It was only when the Pentax faithful began complaining loudly about the KP that Ricoh rushed out a statement to that effect. And, given that it has taken this long for that flagship to appear, it's perfectly clear that Ricoh had nothing in the works at the time. They had planned to give us the K1 and KP.

[thibs]

This is quite true. But, just to throw my two-cents worth in, Ricoh said nothing about the KP not being an APS-C flagship when it was introduced. It was only when the Pentax faithful began complaining loudly about the KP that Ricoh rushed out a statement to that effect. And, given that it has taken this long for that flagship to appear, it's perfectly clear that Ricoh had nothing in the works at the time. They had planned to give us the K1 and KP.

IMO this was all a language issue: if the KP is (that was indeed the case since the K3-II was retired) is the most advanced aps body you have, it is de facto the top of line (since there's nothing better you're offering). This very strict, down to earth way of seeing/qualifying things is very Japanese IMO.

In Occidental culture: top of the line means high end. It is induced. I'm not quite sure Japanese works the same way.

That being said, they should learn to communicate also for guys out of Japan. 🙄

[Pål Jensen]

It is a separate line but it was intended as the "top" level APS-C camera.

It never was intended as a top of the line APS camera. The K-3 didn't get a replacement before now because it is now that they can make a camera sufficiently upgraded to make it worthwhile. Continuing marketing the K-3 would have kannibalised KP sales....

[Kobie]

IMO this was all a language issue: if the KP is (that was indeed the case since the K3-II was retired) is the most advanced aps body you have, it is de facto the top of line (since there's nothing better you're offering). This very strict, down to earth way of seeing/qualifying things is very Japanese IMO.

In Occidental culture: top of the line means high end. It is induced. I'm not quite sure Japanese works the same way.

That being said, they should learn to communicate also for guys out of Japan. 🙄

Or, at the very least, release a corporate statement and allow the other regional divisions to re-hash that statement in their native language so that everyone is on the same page.
Every market is different, and they should recognize that fact. I won't say more since last time I talked about this, people became ruffled for some reason.

[reh321]

It never was intended as a top of the line APS camera. The K-3 didn't get a replacement before now because it is now that they can make a camera sufficiently upgraded to make it worthwhile. Continuing marketing the K-3 would have kannibalised KP sales....

Barely "cannibalized".

Most members seem to have hung on to their old ones - we have heard over and over about the ways that the KP doesn't live up to what members expect from a "flagship" camera.

[TwoUptons]

It never was intended as a top of the line APS camera. The K-3 didn't get a replacement before now because it is now that they can make a camera sufficiently upgraded to make it worthwhile. Continuing marketing the K-3 would have kannibalised KP sales....

My understanding at the time is that the KP was intended to be the top of the line APS-C camera, but not the flagship.

Comments from Ricoh management at the time indicated they felt people would gravitate to the K1 as the flagship of the K-mount line and that the most demanding customers would have no need for an APS-C camera with "flagship" features.

It was only later they realized some people wanted an APS-C flagship and didn't need a full frame camera...

Frankly, I can understand how they would have believed that, though in retrospect we can all see the shortcomings...

-Eric

[bxf]

"Frankly, my dear, I don't give a damn"