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10-28-2020, 02:53 AM   #256
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It's a little annoying that they seem to have dropped internal GPS. Might be because it was difficult to combine with the new pentaprism, though. Could also be just an omission in the preliminary specs, but they seem complete otherwise.

10-28-2020, 02:55 AM   #257
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QuoteOriginally posted by someasiancameraguy Quote
Also is there anyone else aside from me worried about the price of the new K-3?

Plenty of forum members have stated their desire for a flippy screen and better video specs, and the Fuji X-S10 has both of these with the same sensor as the K-new in a body half the price. It even has some typical Pentax advantages (huge grip, DSLR like menus/buttons, IBIS). Unless someone really likes weather sealing or specifically looks at the viewfinder experience to see the difference between 1.05x to 0.62x magnification it's hard to see how an outsider looking to upgrade will choose Pentax.
Some old pentaxists like I am have already made the jump. I still have a K5IIS but I much prefer to use my Fuji X-T20 and I will not look back. To me, the mirror and OVF technology is a thing of the past and the combination of lightweight and IQ is a priority. With appropriate PP and use of the Fuji film presets, I get a better output out of the Fuji camera. The manual focusing is even easier. I believe Pentax has missed the turn. They would have had a great success by making a compact MX/ME-sized camera with an EVF. Besides, I notice the IQ improvement brought by the new sensors has been marginal since 2010 and the 16 mp sensor of the K5 (look at photons to photos data for illustration). I see no point in upgrading, especially for a 26 mp sensor which has proved very similar to the previous generation 24 mp sensor that I have in my X-T20. I don't even consider my K5IIS as outdated.
10-28-2020, 03:05 AM   #258
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QuoteOriginally posted by VSTAR Quote
If my calculations are correct...
200000 yen is approximately 1900 Us ($2500) CDN. The full frame KII is only a few hundred more....hopefully when released North American price is not a straight currency conversion.
200000 yen !? pity I only got 2 cents...
10-28-2020, 03:06 AM - 1 Like   #259
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QuoteOriginally posted by surfar Quote

True for some people but many others appreciate having a high level of both.
Pentax is addressing a different user group. I am sure they want to make the Ąmany othersď happy as well, but you have to concentrate one set of key features. Sorry if yours are not covered. If you feel under appreciated, it just means that Pentax values the Ąsome peopleď group higher. Only Pentax has real insights on their users and demands, the loudest voice in forums are from the some that feel left out. Often not the same group that actually buys the stuff. Pentax did never offer a serious mlc camera or perfect video why should they join this train now? Who is running away because of features never really covered? No gnss, no flippy screen - are these really key features Pentax is known for? Get a K1 if you really need flippy screen or gnss features. Get a generic mlc if you like digital finders and want video.
K3iii looks superb stand alone and even better in combination with K1 - nothing cheap about it. The best TC and speed booster ever. A 21 Ltd is coming fairly soon. Thank you Pentax.

Btw, some rumors mention another apsc in the pipeline with better video capabilities.

10-28-2020, 03:09 AM - 13 Likes   #260
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Many of the folks complaining the most about this camera were unlikely to buy it from the get-go. I have said before, but there are several things that could draw folks to Pentax.

(1) Optical Viewfinder -- this is a big deal to some people and while Nikon and Canon have not given up their OVF cameras, it seems pretty clear that their days are numbered and going forward the majority of releases are going to be cameras with EVFs. Pentax has not only continued to release OVF cameras, they have made specific effort to make the viewfinder better on the K-3 III.

(2) The K mount. For all of the negativity about the horrible sound of screw driven lenses, they tend to focus very quickly, are quite small, and depending on the lens have excellent optics. Pentax is not releasing new screw driven lenses at this point (I think the last one was a tweak of the FA 35 f2), but they do continue to support it in all of their cameras, even the entry level ones. This backward compatibility is appreciated by those who shoot with Pentax and can make filling out a lens line up much cheaper. I know that MILCs allow for mounting all kinds of lenses via adapters, but certainly the majority of them don't support total auto focus of lenses that don't have in lens motors.

(3) Still Image Quality. While all camera brands pay lip service to improving still image quality, from my perspective, their actual focus seems to be improving video. Pentax has made a real effort to improve still image quality and over time they have consistently gotten better performance out of the sensors they have used than some of their competitors.

(4) APS-C line ups are excellent. For all of the talk earlier in this thread about their APS-C lens line up, Pentax has the DA * lenses (the DA *16-50 is getting re-done with a PLM motor), the DA 16-85, 18-135, several kit lenses, DA * primes, the DA 55-300 PLM (and several other 55-300 lenses), DA limiteds, and the DA 35/50. These lenses are of differing quality, but it really does feel as though Pentax has a lens that fits most price ranges, many have in lens motors and weather sealing and they have messaged clearly with the release of the DA *11-16 and planned redesign of the 16-50 that they are going to continue to support crop users in a way that Sony/Canon/Nikon haven't.

Is all of this enough to sell (a very expensive) K-3 III? I don't know, but what is clear to me is that Pentax has decided to pursue their own niche and that does feel smart. Trying to be Canon or Nikon or Sony won't work for them. It is much better if they find their own path and build cameras that fit with their ethos and price them as needed to continue making new gear. It won't be for everyone but clearly they have decided that if they build it, we will come.
10-28-2020, 03:29 AM - 1 Like   #261
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I have a little pot of cash saved up for the III thatís been accumulating since the first photos of it hit (its pentaprism is so cutely retro). I would hesitate if GPS was missing, I have to say - but I donít think it will be as it seems to be an ideal use for the Bluetooth implementation in getting the GPS coordinates from your smartphone. Yes I know the argument about being tied to having your phone with you when youíre out shooting - but who doesnít these days?
10-28-2020, 03:29 AM - 1 Like   #262
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
Many of the folks complaining the most about this camera were unlikely to buy it from the get-go. I have said before, but there are several things that could draw folks to Pentax.

(1) Optical Viewfinder -- this is a big deal to some people and while Nikon and Canon have not given up their OVF cameras, it seems pretty clear that their days are numbered and going forward the majority of releases are going to be cameras with EVFs. Pentax has not only continued to release OVF cameras, they have made specific effort to make the viewfinder better on the K-3 III.

(2) The K mount. For all of the negativity about the horrible sound of screw driven lenses, they tend to focus very quickly, are quite small, and depending on the lens have excellent optics. Pentax is not releasing new screw driven lenses at this point (I think the last one was a tweak of the FA 35 f2), but they do continue to support it in all of their cameras, even the entry level ones. This backward compatibility is appreciated by those who shoot with Pentax and can make filling out a lens line up much cheaper. I know that MILCs allow for mounting all kinds of lenses via adapters, but certainly the majority of them don't support total auto focus of lenses that don't have in lens motors.

(3) Still Image Quality. While all camera brands pay lip service to improving still image quality, from my perspective, their actual focus seems to be improving video. Pentax has made a real effort to improve still image quality and over time they have consistently gotten better performance out of the sensors they have used than some of their competitors.

(4) APS-C line ups are excellent. For all of the talk earlier in this thread about their APS-C lens line up, Pentax has the DA * lenses (the DA *16-50 is getting re-done with a PLM motor), the DA 16-85, 18-135, several kit lenses, DA * primes, the DA 55-300 PLM (and several other 55-300 lenses), DA limiteds, and the DA 35/50. These lenses are of differing quality, but it really does feel as though Pentax has a lens that fits most price ranges, many have in lens motors and weather sealing and they have messaged clearly with the release of the DA *11-16 and planned redesign of the 16-50 that they are going to continue to support crop users in a way that Sony/Canon/Nikon haven't.

Is all of this enough to sell (a very expensive) K-3 III? I don't know, but what is clear to me is that Pentax has decided to pursue their own niche and that does feel smart. Trying to be Canon or Nikon or Sony won't work for them. It is much better if they find their own path and build cameras that fit with their ethos and price them as needed to continue making new gear. It won't be for everyone but clearly they have decided that if they build it, we will come.
I agree with much of your post but have to say that the apsc lineup (like the ff one) lacks fast glass which is important to a fair few users.

You can use the DFA or FA 50mm but that's a fairly long 76mm equivalent. Wider than that and the lenses go slow, very slow. This is a pretty serious limitation for many. It's fine by me but I know I'm not everyone. Slower lenses are also under pressure from phones that can achieve similar looking images.
10-28-2020, 03:39 AM - 1 Like   #263
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QuoteOriginally posted by gazonk Quote
It's a little annoying that they seem to have dropped internal GPS. Might be because it was difficult to combine with the new pentaprism, though. Could also be just an omission in the preliminary specs, but they seem complete otherwise.
That would be quite puzzling, I agree. In both the K-3ii and the K-1, on-board flash was sacrificed to make way for GPS. To have neither would be simply odd, especially as GPS is pretty much the norm in cameras, now. Perhaps you're expected to provide your own through a smart phone, as with using one to supplement the immovable rear screen. As you say, perhaps it just an omission from the specs.

10-28-2020, 03:43 AM   #264
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QuoteOriginally posted by gatorguy Quote
Rebuilding my (excellent!) lens collection for a new platform would make it a non-starter for me.
I see. Actually, I am planning myself Sigma fp and three lenses: Canon EF 16-35/f4, Panasonic 24-105/f4 macro and Sigma 100-400/f5-6.3. And I will keep K-5 for IQ and DR .
10-28-2020, 04:24 AM   #265
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QuoteOriginally posted by RobA_Oz Quote
That would be quite puzzling, I agree. In both the K-3ii and the K-1, on-board flash was sacrificed to make way for GPS. To have neither would be simply odd, especially as GPS is pretty much the norm in cameras, now. Perhaps you're expected to provide your own through a smart phone, as with using one to supplement the immovable rear screen. As you say, perhaps it just an omission from the specs.
The new pentaprism is likely to take up more space. GPS can as you say be tethered from your phone. It used to be buggy complicated and unreliable but perhaps this has improved.

Is the GPS really the norm? I can't think of any recent cameras with GPS but perhaps I've overlooked that spec.
10-28-2020, 04:24 AM   #266
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QuoteOriginally posted by microlight Quote
I have a little pot of cash saved up for the III thatís been accumulating since the first photos of it hit (its pentaprism is so cutely retro). I would hesitate if GPS was missing, I have to say - but I donít think it will be as it seems to be an ideal use for the Bluetooth implementation in getting the GPS coordinates from your smartphone. Yes I know the argument about being tied to having your phone with you when youíre out shooting - but who doesnít these days?
I have hundreds of pictures from our family farm in rural Virginia where there's no cell coverage due to the mountains. The first month I had the K-3ii I used the GPS to track a hike we did up a nearby mountain, plotted each photo on a map. I was immediately sold on the convenience and utility of GPS.


The Bluetooth connection to the phone is a decent work-around, but it's not quite the same when you're in a remote place with your rugged, weather-sealed Pentax.

---------- Post added 10-28-20 at 07:31 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by RobA_Oz Quote
That would be quite puzzling, I agree. In both the K-3ii and the K-1, on-board flash was sacrificed to make way for GPS. To have neither would be simply odd, especially as GPS is pretty much the norm in cameras, now. Perhaps you're expected to provide your own through a smart phone, as with using one to supplement the immovable rear screen. As you say, perhaps it just an omission from the specs.
It's plausible that they sacrificed the flippy screen and GPS, expecting everyone to have a smartphone all the time and to use that as a work-around while keeping the body as small and light as possible. I wonder, does anywhere in Japan not have cell coverage? I'd guess not too many places, as even in the US coverage is probably 80-90% of the lower 48, with most of the gaps being in the mountains of the west.
10-28-2020, 04:35 AM   #267
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QuoteOriginally posted by gazonk Quote
It's a little annoying that they seem to have dropped internal GPS. Might be because it was difficult to combine with the new pentaprism, though. Could also be just an omission in the preliminary specs, but they seem complete otherwise.
There were all kinds of complaints when GPS replaced On-Board Flash on the K-3ii. If there is is a difficulty, it is probably with including both GPS and OBF, and I would not bet that GPS has more supporters.
10-28-2020, 04:59 AM   #268
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Well well, sensor could be ~same as in Fuji X-T3 and newer models but is it still a PDAF-variant? Because, in Fuji cameras the sensor has PDAF-array.
10-28-2020, 05:04 AM   #269
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QuoteOriginally posted by house Quote
I agree with much of your post but have to say that the apsc lineup (like the ff one) lacks fast glass which is important to a fair few users.
There are two reasons for having "fast glass"
1. bokeh
2. low ISO

Pentax seems to be eliminating reason (2), and there may be only so many who favor (1).
Pentax may believe that those in the (1) category can get along with older lenses until they get around to releasing new 'fast' lenses,
10-28-2020, 05:13 AM - 2 Likes   #270
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QuoteOriginally posted by ThorSanchez Quote
The Bluetooth connection to the phone is a decent work-around, but it's not quite the same when you're in a remote place with your rugged, weather-sealed Pentax.
Perhaps a small point of clarification. I believe that my iPhone has a dedicated GPS receiver, so position location is possible even when there is no cellular coverage in remote locations. However, plotting the position on a map for navigation might not be possible if the 'map app' requires an internet connection.

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