[RobA_Oz]

Why use the Super Bowl ads, that is using the highest cost ads as an example. Those ads are once a year and nothing says the advertisement must be the highest cost. Simple product placement in a show or movie would be minimal cost. Advertisements during prime time would be more expensive than product placement, but certainly not $5 million for 30 seconds. A company could quite easily get a 30 to 60 second commercial in prime time for less than half a million. That could get them maybe ten (or more) different commercials for the $5 million. Those ads would probably get to more people than the Super Bowl ads.

Anything that broke up those annoying high-rotation KFC ads would be welcome.

[Kunzite]

Why use the Super Bowl ads, that is using the highest cost ads as an example. Those ads are once a year and nothing says the advertisement must be the highest cost. Simple product placement in a show or movie would be minimal cost. Advertisements during prime time would be more expensive than product placement, but certainly not $5 million for 30 seconds. A company could quite easily get a 30 to 60 second commercial in prime time for less than half a million. That could get them maybe ten (or more) different commercials for the $5 million. Those ads would probably get to more people than the Super Bowl ads.

That is still big money advertising (if you want to get noticed, not invisible to anyone but the most attentive Pentaxians) - with minimal effect, I'd say.
Can they sell - say - 2 more cameras for each time an ad runs? One to cover the cost, another to make it worthwhile?

By the way, we have a thread about Pentax in movies: Pentax in the Movies - Page 20 - PentaxForums.com

[Kobie]

Advertising per se isn't the issue in my opinion. Some habits die hard while others find creative ways to get the word out.
Lets' look at some examples within the automotive industry.

GM, FORD, FCA spend an enormous amount of money on advertising.
Then there's Tesla, Rivian, Koenigssegg, McLaren, Rolls Royce who spend practically nothing on advertising.
Tesla has shaken up the automotive industry, even with shoddy build quality and lots of bumps, scrapes and hurdles to overcome within their products, they still sell like hot cakes and coffeee.
Rivian has already become a threat to Tesla, no advertising used. Just a few press releases and some teaser videos. Then GM introduces the electric Hummer. No advertising, just press releases and teaser videos. The HUmmer EV sold out completely in 10 minutes of its official launch (at a cost of $100,000+ for each vehicle).
Koenigsegg hyper cars sell out EVERY time they're released. They have a YouTube channel that does some behind the scenes elements and teaser videos.
McLaren, well, they don't advertise but do give vehicles to reviewers and based on that, they sell well.
Range Rover, they don't really advertise either, and yet, somehow, lots of people still buy them.

So, it's not just about advertising in general or lack of it, it's about how you go about spreading the word about your product.
We're in an age where traditional advertising just isn't really enough anymore and can actually be counter productive.
It's across all industries at this point. How many of us have seen videos of products that don't even exist, so much hype get's built up, Kickstarter campaigns go way over the initial ask but they haven't even made a prototype yet?
Sony, Canon, Nikon, FujiFilm all provide cameras to various reviewers and even with those cameras flaws, they still sell without issue.
We are living in strange times, however, a company needs to keep with the times to remain viable. And they can do that without spending a massive budget on ad-space. If they want to.

[Photos-by-Chas]

Advertising per se isn't the issue in my opinion. Some habits die hard while others find creative ways to get the word out.
Lets' look at some examples within the automotive industry.

GM, FORD, FCA spend an enormous amount of money on advertising.
Then there's Tesla, Rivian, Koenigssegg, McLaren, Rolls Royce who spend practically nothing on advertising.
Tesla has shaken up the automotive industry, even with shoddy build quality and lots of bumps, scrapes and hurdles to overcome within their products, they still sell like hot cakes and coffeee.
Rivian has already become a threat to Tesla, no advertising used. Just a few press releases and some teaser videos. Then GM introduces the electric Hummer. No advertising, just press releases and teaser videos. The HUmmer EV sold out completely in 10 minutes of its official launch (at a cost of $100,000+ for each vehicle).
Koenigsegg hyper cars sell out EVERY time they're released. They have a YouTube channel that does some behind the scenes elements and teaser videos.
McLaren, well, they don't advertise but do give vehicles to reviewers and based on that, they sell well.
Range Rover, they don't really advertise either, and yet, somehow, lots of people still buy them.

So, it's not just about advertising in general or lack of it, it's about how you go about spreading the word about your product.
We're in an age where traditional advertising just isn't really enough anymore and can actually be counter productive.
It's across all industries at this point. How many of us have seen videos of products that don't even exist, so much hype get's built up, Kickstarter campaigns go way over the initial ask but they haven't even made a prototype yet?
Sony, Canon, Nikon, FujiFilm all provide cameras to various reviewers and even with those cameras flaws, they still sell without issue.
We are living in strange times, however, a company needs to keep with the times to remain viable. And they can do that without spending a massive budget on ad-space. If they want to.

Valid points, but maybe the final thought or idea here is, what has Ricoh/Pentax been doing about getting the name out and to increase sales?

[Kobie]

Valid points, but maybe the final thought or idea here is, what has Ricoh/Pentax been doing about getting the name out and to increase sales?

And that is the issue. From all angles, outside of the Pentax Product Stories series, they've seemingly done nothing. At least in North America. Europe and Japan seem to fare better though.

[ecostigny]

And that is the issue. From all angles, outside of the Pentax Product Stories series, they've seemingly done nothing. At least in North America. Europe and Japan seem to fare better though.

They probably concentrate on the markets where they think they will get the best return on their marketing investment. Maybe somebody at Ricoh has decided that North America isn't as lucrative a market as it may have been in the past.

[Breakfastographer]

Valid points, but maybe the final thought or idea here is, what has Ricoh/Pentax been doing about getting the name out and to increase sales?

And that is the issue. From all angles, outside of the Pentax Product Stories series, they've seemingly done nothing.

So, having ruled out advertising, what do you think they should be doing?

I personally would prefer that they spend their money on engineering, tooling, volume management, that sort of thing.

And I also feel personally heartened by the ways in which genuine reviews of Pentax products keep springing up spontaneously in spite of some of the bigger names seemingly having a somewhat set opinion of the brand. Social media = democratisation of marketing.

[RobA_Oz]

So, having ruled out advertising, what do you think they should be doing?

I personally would prefer that they spend their money on engineering, tooling, volume management, that sort of thing.

And I also feel personally heartened by the ways in which genuine reviews of Pentax products keep springing up spontaneously in spite of some of the bigger names seemingly having a somewhat set opinion of the brand. Social media = democratisation of marketing.

Personally, I think the sponsorship of a few key professionals as brand ambassadors is the most effective way they could spend what would be very little money in the scheme of things. Matt Bishop’s dedicated work with Pentax gear was recently rewarded this way. I doubt that having celebrity faces behind the brand would have anything like the credibility with the main Pentax target markets.

[Cerebum]

I think there has recently been a change in media tone to the Pentax brand. They seem to have dropped the "Pentax is dead" idea and are now showing a degree of respect. Since the launch of the pentax direction, there have been positive articles. Amateur photographer even apologised for not including Pentax in a comparison, stating the only reason for the oversight was that there was nothing in the range that fitted the category they were comparing. They also replied to a letter stating how much they like Pentax cameras. Maybe we are edging from pointless to niche in the minds of the media. If this were to happen I think we would find Pentax in a similar position to the companies in Kobie's post. One thing not really highlighted, Pentax shifted 40,000 units with zero advertising. While i know it isnt sony/canon numbers, Pentax are a small company & 40,000 in 12 months sounds like a decent return

[Rondec]

The hard part with advertising is that it works best on people who are already interested in your type of product.

So, you are, I suppose targeting individuals who aren't satisfied with the results of their cell phone images, but don't already own an ILC (those who own a particular brand are likely to stick with it). It used to be that magazines were a way to go, but they are really drying up and blowing away right now. Targeted internet advertising could be helpful, I suppose.

Olympus is a company that is a lesson. They sold a fair number of cameras, but never managed to turn a profit over the last 10 years. Sinking money into advertising only increased the expenses and ended up sinking the camera brand as part of Olympus.

[Serkevan]

I think there has recently been a change in media tone to the Pentax brand. They seem to have dropped the "Pentax is dead" idea and are now showing a degree of respect. Since the launch of the pentax direction, there have been positive articles. Amateur photographer even apologised for not including Pentax in a comparison, stating the only reason for the oversight was that there was nothing in the range that fitted the category they were comparing. They also replied to a letter stating how much they like Pentax cameras. Maybe we are edging from pointless to niche in the minds of the media. If this were to happen I think we would find Pentax in a similar position to the companies in Kobie's post. One thing not really highlighted, Pentax shifted 40,000 units with zero advertising. While i know it isnt sony/canon numbers, Pentax are a small company & 40,000 in 12 months sounds like a decent return

They shifted 40k cameras without advertising *and without new cameras*. The last Pentax camera was in 2018. The last APS-C camera was in 2017.

I fully expect the K-33 to sell like hot cakes as long as the price isn't a massive show stopper.

[sungibr]

They shifted 40k cameras without advertising *and without new cameras*. The last Pentax camera was in 2018. The last APS-C camera was in 2017.

I fully expect the K-33 to sell like hot cakes as long as the price isn't a massive show stopper.

Make it two. My biggest hopes is the price below $2k. Ideally on the $1600-1800 range. And please, do a combo with the new DA*16-50. That will sell!

[Lord Lucan]

Companies advertise for a reason. That is it increases their sales. If companies didn't make more money after advertising, there wouldn't be any advertisements.

That is the myth of the hard-headed, all-seeing, businessman.

Companies advertise for all sorts of reasons, including vanity, habit, and that, if the boss is influenced by advertising himself (at least of a type), he assumes that everyone else is too. Lady L was a bookkeeper for a small company that spent over a £1000 each year on ads in a trade magazine. Each year the boss would would get a visit from a charming young sales girl to renew the contract. Because the boss was basically a salesman himself, he admired other sales people and wanted them to succeed, even at his own cost.

However, when Lady L made discrete enquiries among the clients she found that most of them never read the magazine, or if they did they had never noticed the company ad which was buried among others at the back. The fact was, the boss did not have a clue whether the ads worked or not, it was just a chancer. Lady L cancelled the contract.

Advertising works differently now. TV, glossy magazines and billboards are not longer the only or even most effective channels. People have become cynical about them anyway. YouTube influencers, celebrity endorsements, and prominence on Amazon (much as I loathe Amazon) are now more important. Influencers are cheap and Pentax should promote some.

[sungibr]

Personally, I think the sponsorship of a few key professionals as brand ambassadors is the most effective way they could spend what would be very little money in the scheme of things. Matt Bishop’s dedicated work with Pentax gear was recently rewarded this way. I doubt that having celebrity faces behind the brand would have anything like the credibility with the main Pentax target markets.

South America, specally Brazil is one place the Pentax Brand abandoned over the years.


I wouldn't bother to work as an embassador for Ricoh, if they wanted to return here

[torge]

would those ambassadors even be noticed outside of the Pentax bubble?

Personally, I think the sponsorship of a few key professionals as brand ambassadors is the most effective way they could spend what would be very little money in the scheme of things. Matt Bishop’s dedicated work with Pentax gear was recently rewarded this way. I doubt that having celebrity faces behind the brand would have anything like the credibility with the main Pentax target markets.