[biz-engineer]

I wonder why Ricoh put so much effort into the quality of the optical viewfinder. They could have used a high quality Pentax-mirror (lighter and cheaper) and it'd still be better than an EVF, and the camera would be 200gr lighter weight.

[ffking]

On a side note, someone posted a review of the year by dp review. Don't watch it, in the Pentax section it was nothing but negativity! One thing they did mock was the name. They laughed at K3iii but are fine with Sony A7ii/iii/iv A7rii, Nikon z6ii etc etc. I don't mind criticism but pointless hypocrisy devalues the reviewer. Can't they see that?

I can't understand the active hostility many show towards Pentax (Northrup also goes between ignoring and snide throw-away comments) - but it's not a question of comeuppance - I don't think Pentax people were ever triumphalist in the way that Nikonians were when they were riding high or Sonyites have been more recently (never got that from Canon, interestingly) - so I can't see where the venom comes from other than insecurity about anything that challenges the assumed hegemony of their favoured model (as in way of doing things, not camera model) It's a shame - no photographer should want to push any brand under - and all should welcome the competition that drives innovation.

[Serkevan]

I can't understand the active hostility many show towards Pentax (Northrup also goes between ignoring and snide throw-away comments) - but it's nor a question of comeuppance - I don't think Pentax people were ever triumphalist in the way that Nikonians were when they were riding high or Sonyites have been more recently (never got that from Canon, interestingly) - so I can't see where the venom comes from other than insecurity about anything that challenges the assumed hegemony of their favoured model (as in way of doing things, not camera model) It's a shame - no photographer should want to push any brand under - and all should welcome the competition that drives innovation.

I doubt it's even insecurity, that would imply more self-awareness than I afford them.

IMO, it's a simple case of "haha red-headed stepchild, bully them". The only way to keep a pride of Canonites, a herd of Nikonians and a murder of Sony... Of Sonies? from jumping at each other's throats is to throw them another, fresh throat.

[Rondec]

It isn't a mistake to bring higher end crop sensor camera... the problem is, what constitutes as "higher end". I'm sure the camera will be impressive in terms of IQ and ergonomics, but these kind of things are found in budget cameras like K-70. Will AF be on par with cameras in similar price point? I certainly hope so, but I won't be surprised if AF is the best Pentax ever had, but still behind what Canon and Nikon offer in their similarly priced stuff. Will the new pentaprism make such a difference in shooting experience (and justify the lack of flip screen)? Or maybe it will turn out as 'useful' feature as interchangeable grips on KP? Hard to say.

You pay large amounts for incremental improvements in quality -- image and otherwise. If you want to shoot 4K video with a Pentax camera, this will be the only option for you. If you want 12 fps, once again, this will be the only option for your K mount lenses.

You see this all of the time with glass. Why buy a DFA * 85 when you can buy a FA 77 or Samyang 85mm f1.4? The answer is that most people won't but there will be a group of people who want the things the more expensive camera/piece of glass brings to the table and they will be willing to pay for that improvement. Even if there is no flip screen.

[Serkevan]

I wonder why Ricoh put so much effort into the quality of the optical viewfinder. They could have used a high quality Pentax-mirror (lighter and cheaper) and it'd still be better than an EVF, and the camera would be 200gr lighter weight.

I'm not so sure about that, I've seen the pentamirrors in cheaper Canikons and they are terrible. I suppose that better ones could be used, but to make the OVF as bright and large as the K-3iii's maybe the R&D would have been too problematic, or expensive. If the OVF got even slightly worse compared to the K-3 the ruckus would have been massive, no matter how much lighter the camera got as a result.


IMO making the very best pentaprism possible is a very Pentax thing to do, and I personally appreciate it; in fact such a statement with regards to optical viewfinders is one of the things that cement my... I'm not gonna say loyalty because I'd never have that for a company, but let's say it makes me confident in my system choice . I'm sure I'm not the only one who feels the same way.

[Rondec]

I'm not so sure about that, I've seen the pentamirrors in cheaper Canikons and they are terrible. I suppose that better ones could be used, but to make the OVF as bright and large as the K-3iii's maybe the R&D would have been too problematic, or expensive. If the OVF got even slightly worse compared to the K-3 the ruckus would have been massive, no matter how much lighter the camera got as a result.


IMO making the very best pentaprism possible is a very Pentax thing to do, and I personally appreciate it; in fact such a statement with regards to optical viewfinders is one of the things that cement my... I'm not gonna say loyalty because I'd never have that for a company, but let's say it makes me confident in my system choice . I'm sure I'm not the only one who feels the same way.

I really am interested in how many of these features can bleed over to the K-1 II sequel. Certainly if you end up with a viewfinder that even approaches those of the classic manual focus SLRs back in the day, that would be a benefit for those of us who value that sort of experience.

[MegaPower]

that shutter sound is nice.
deep and quiet sound.

[Wheatfield]

I really am interested in how many of these features can bleed over to the K-1 II sequel. Certainly if you end up with a viewfinder that even approaches those of the classic manual focus SLRs back in the day, that would be a benefit for those of us who value that sort of experience.

That's why I'm following this thread. I'm not in the market for an APS-C camera, but the feature set on this thing will scale up nicely to what I would be in the market for.

[Kunzite]

I really am interested in how many of these features can bleed over to the K-1 II sequel. Certainly if you end up with a viewfinder that even approaches those of the classic manual focus SLRs back in the day, that would be a benefit for those of us who value that sort of experience.

Same here, although the performance interests me more (but the viewfinder is a strong #2).

I disagree with the idea of cheapening the viewfinder. That's how you fail.
The viewfinder is the one differentiator from the multitude of mirrorless systems out there. If you'll make it cheap, if you'll make it worse, it becomes irrelevant - and then, only the disadvantages (moving mirror, dedicated AF, longer register distance) remain.

[reh321]

I wonder why Ricoh put so much effort into the quality of the optical viewfinder. They could have used a high quality Pentax-mirror (lighter and cheaper) and it'd still be better than an EVF, and the camera would be 200gr lighter weight.

Optical viewfinder is the one thing that distinguishes them from the other manufacturers. If they don’t put effort into that, why bother to put effort into anything??

[ecostigny]

Moveable and fixed?

Whoops! I meant to say moveable only.

[shiner]

90% of this thread has been complaining about the camera not having the one feature that guarantees an end to world strife. Depending on the person doing the complaining, that feature could be GPS, an articulated screen or now, it seems, a pop up flash.

You seem to indeed be complaining about complaining. I was only pointing out that in the recent past, the elimination of pop-up flash was necessitated by the extra space required by the GPS module. Geez.

[Oktyabr]

Or else... what? You WON'T BUY IT?! Oh, the horror

As I said, what you and I individually think of the camera matters little. Ricoh just needs to convince enough folks that the camera offers sufficient capabilities for them to buy at whatever the initial release price is, followed by the discounted pricing later on. Ricoh will measure its success or failure based on sales, revenue and profit - not the opinions of a handful of members posting here.

What you and I think matters little. What EVERYONE ELSE thinks will make or break Pentax. If they are in line with my way of thinking, the K1ii offers better value. Anyone that is seriously concerned about 4k video, 10+ fps, accurate AF, ALREADY owns something else... probably a Sony.

It's just my humble opinion that this camera is catering to a share of the market that Pentax will never possess. They might as well have just released a mirrorless and gotten it over with. Pentax's fame (and fortune) lies in keeping as many of their devout followers as possible and maybe, just maybe, enticing some from over the fence as well.

If this model is priced above the K1ii, *without* a flippy screen, or without GPS/Astro, what can it possibly offer, in that price range, that would make any Sony/Fuji/Olympus/Canikon sell their gear and switch? That's not a rhetorical question, by the way.

[repaap]

What you and I think matters little. What EVERYONE ELSE thinks will make or break Pentax. If they are in line with my way of thinking, the K1ii offers better value. Anyone that is seriously concerned about 4k video, 10+ fps, accurate AF, ALREADY owns something else... probably a Sony.

It's just my humble opinion that this camera is catering to a share of the market that Pentax will never possess. They might as well have just released a mirrorless and gotten it over with. Pentax's fame (and fortune) lies in keeping as many of their devout followers as possible and maybe, just maybe, enticing some from over the fence as well.

If this model is priced above the K1ii, *without* a flippy screen, or without GPS/Astro, what can it possibly offer, in that price range, that would make any Sony/Fuji/Olympus/Canikon sell their gear and switch? That's not a rhetorical question, by the way.

So, because of that, you think ricoh should have just abandoned this progress.

---------- Post added 01-03-21 at 09:59 ----------

To me, these conversations don’t really make sense. There are stillthings, we don’t know about this camera. But we do know things it is promised to do atleast. They said that it is going to be the best Pentax aps-c camera and sertainly by specs it does look like that already. If -that- does not justificate just couple of hundred premium over previous gen K-3, then what would.

If they would have popped out slight update on K-P and dressed it in K-3III. Then I could understand this outrage. Now it is completelly new camera from bottom to up. And with exeptional OVF(the thing separating them from mirrorless, remember) and with performance to even challenge milcs. In this case this rage is hard to understand. But this is just me. Go ahead. I’ll unsubscribe and you can have it. I’ll go shoot pictures with what I have and wait for more info. Happy new year

[zapp]

I wonder why Ricoh put so much effort into the quality of the optical viewfinder. They could have used a high quality Pentax-mirror (lighter and cheaper) and it'd still be better than an EVF, and the camera would be 200gr lighter weight.

Pentax is investing in quality that is the message, Penta-mirror prisms are no comparison to glass prisms. This will not be a cheap, crappy low end camera. It will sport high quality dslr components to compete against the rest of the world. It will be surrounded by * lenses like the updated 16-50 and the fairly new 11-18, more to come. KP will drop in price and offer a lower end, yet not cheap, alternative. Pentax was never cheap, you always got quality for a decent price.
By parameters, the new camera is worth a price tag similar if not above the current K1. K3 is for speed, K1 for resolution. The next K1 may add speed or increase resolution to a point that it replaces 645.