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02-27-2021, 01:46 PM   #331
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
The FA Limiteds are fairly famous for being among those lenses having the so-called "Ghostless" coatings. Replacement of "Ghostless" with "HD" may or may not be much of an improvement, tests will tell.

Pentax Coatings: Ghostless, SP & Aero Bright - PentaxForums.com

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Steve
Thanks Steve. I'm keeping the old ones, all three. Only those and the Samyang 2.8/14. Everything else (56 items, what a nightmare!) has to go. Totalled up somewhere around 8k. We do accumulate over the years. Time, money, space and declining health.

02-27-2021, 01:56 PM - 1 Like   #332
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
How could that be? You are adding air-glass interfaces, while the lens remains the same.
True, but don't lenses have glass-air interfaces and a coating on the front element? Whatever, if I point an FA smc lens at a sunlight
scene with/without this particular filter -with it, it reduces flare. Maybe, not always, but often. It may degrade other aspects of the image, but I've never detected this. I'm happily convinced they are useful.
02-27-2021, 02:08 PM   #333
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
I'm not particularly confident in B-W's MRC coating either - is it as good as the old smc? A brief search, and I could only find a chart comparing it to a single coating - I thought companies stopped doing that for decades.
you have to remember that the SMC coatings changed over time:

QuoteQuote:
The modern SMC coating that DA lenses have been using for about a decade now isn't the same as the SMC coating that Pentax originally launched in the 1970's. In fact, most DA lenses have been said to have a "ghostless" coating, so while we don't expect the difference between SMC and HD coating to be be a game-changer, it should certainly still be easy to observe.
Read more at: HD vs. SMC Pentax Limited Primes Review - Introduction | PentaxForums.com Reviews

yes I am presuming that the SMC coatings of the FA Limiteds manufactured in recent years got the same modern " updates "
02-27-2021, 02:13 PM   #334
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QuoteOriginally posted by aslyfox Quote
you have to remember that the SMC changed over time



Read more at: HD vs. SMC Pentax Limited Primes Review - Introduction | PentaxForums.com Reviews

yes I am presuming that the SMC coatings of the FA Limiteds manufactured in recent years got the same modern " updates "
Yes, it did. Perhaps I shouldn't have said "old".

I vaguely remember that the ghostless smc also implies a special optical design.

02-27-2021, 02:15 PM   #335
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
Yes, it did. Perhaps I shouldn't have said "old".

I vaguely remember that the ghostless smc also implies a special optical design.
I wonder when that started, from which serial numbers?
02-27-2021, 02:18 PM   #336
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
The FA Limiteds are fairly famous for being among those lenses having the so-called "Ghostless" coatings. Replacement of "Ghostless" with "HD" may or may not be much of an improvement, tests will tell.

Pentax Coatings: Ghostless, SP & Aero Bright - PentaxForums.com

PENTAX LENS TECHNOLOGY | PENTAX STAR LENS | RICOH IMAGING


Steve
Maybe because the FA limiteds have wider apertures, maybe different coatings, but I always found them to flare quite a bit worse than the DA limiteds, even before the HD coatings were added.

That said, when the DA limiteds got their update, most everyone like the HD versions better, with the exception of the HD DA 15 limited, where they felt that the update spoiled it's diffraction stars.
02-27-2021, 02:19 PM - 1 Like   #337
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QuoteOriginally posted by Parry Quote
I wonder when that started, from which serial numbers?


at least I know that my FA limiteds ( MIJ ) don't have the most recent SMC coatings

but I am keeping them any way
02-27-2021, 02:21 PM   #338
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QuoteOriginally posted by aslyfox Quote


at least I know that my FA limiteds ( MIJ ) don't have the most recent SMC coatings

but I am keeping them any way
Same. If this was a good economy I might sell and trade up. But it just isn't. I mean lens coatings are the least of most people's worries right now.

02-27-2021, 02:41 PM   #339
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
I'm not particularly confident in B-W's MRC coating either - is it as good as the old smc?
A brief search, and I could only find a chart comparing it to a single coating - I thought companies stopped doing that for decades.
Yes MRC coating is in the same league than SMC.MRC offers 7+1 layers on each side (16 combined).
Searching for MRC coating gives dozens results with charts comparing single coating to multi coating:
schneiderkreuznach.com/en/photo-optics/b-w-filters/coating-systems
schneiderkreuznach.com/en/vorlage/uv-clear
schneiderkreuznach.com/download_file/force/1955/1085
west-l.ru/uploads/tdpdf/bw_filters_eng_bro.pdf#page=5
omnifoto.nl/shop_images/pdf_documenten/B_W filters/WorldOfFilters.pdf#page=5
nnps.org/pdf_files/Recommended%20Photo%20gear/MRC.pdf#page=10
images-eu.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/C1x9LZAkTES.pdf?tag=pentaxforums-20&#page=57
stemmer-imaging.com/media/uploads/websites/documents/products/optics/Schneider/en_US-Schneider-Kreuznach-Industrial-Filters.pdf#page=18
evtifeev.com/wp-content/files/manual/MRC.pdf
schneiderkreuznach.com/application/files/8115/0781/8891/hydrophobic-mrc-coating.pdf

Last edited by angerdan; 02-27-2021 at 02:49 PM.
02-27-2021, 03:02 PM - 1 Like   #340
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QuoteOriginally posted by BarryE Quote
Disagree. There is a clear flare resistance using clear B+W nano filters on SMC coated lenses. I agree, poorer quality filters degrade lens' performance. Have you tested them?

---------- Post added 02-27-21 at 08:28 PM ----------



Less light through lens? True, but not relevant to me. It's marginal and I use a tripod 99% of the time.

I'm not sure HD coatings let through more light. It must depend on conditions and angles of light rays.
All that coatings on a filter can do is lessen flare off the filter. However, since flare can never be 100% eliminated, any glass put in front of a lens will decrease flare resistance.
It not like as if the filter is removing flare creating light.
02-28-2021, 04:30 AM - 1 Like   #342
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Check this from the Leica pdf on the SL 28mm f2. Note the missing element near the focusing element in the lower part of the "lens cut" diagram. This one is even more glaring as they show the correct and the incorrect next to each other.
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02-28-2021, 04:41 AM   #343
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
All that coatings on a filter can do is lessen flare off the filter. However, since flare can never be 100% eliminated, any glass put in front of a lens will decrease flare resistance.
It not like as if the filter is removing flare creating light.
The strange thing, Bill, is that they seem to work. Like most things in our photography there are just too many factors to account for when we are shooting. Setting up comparative test shots with/without this filter can can show improvements in flare resistance. However, moving the tripod a few degrees would probably alter the results. All somewhat hypothetical with real photos.

I am just not interested in obsessing about test shots, beyond the indicative - which help me to be aware of problems I might face. No doubt the HD coatings will show an improvement if flare resistance, for the test scenarios used. Probably, if that test was altered slightly the results will differ, perhaps markedly. On balance HD will likely be better. How much better and how much better than SMC/B+W nobody will ever be able to define for actual usage for photographers of different styles and approaches.

I'm looking forward to seeing the reviews, but unless I have a chance to make my own comparisons, I guess I'll just carry on taking photos and trying not to think about how much better a shot might have been with different gear - it's so damaging.

It's just struck me that one of the easiest way to reduce flare is with a hand or map to shield the sun. Maybe this instinctive action saves my filters ruining my shots more often. That and my approach to bracket and then bracket some more ...
02-28-2021, 01:43 PM - 1 Like   #344
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QuoteOriginally posted by BarryE Quote
The strange thing, Bill, is that they seem to work. Like most things in our photography there are just too many factors to account for when we are shooting. Setting up comparative test shots with/without this filter can can show improvements in flare resistance. However, moving the tripod a few degrees would probably alter the results. All somewhat hypothetical with real photos.

I am just not interested in obsessing about test shots, beyond the indicative - which help me to be aware of problems I might face. No doubt the HD coatings will show an improvement if flare resistance, for the test scenarios used. Probably, if that test was altered slightly the results will differ, perhaps markedly. On balance HD will likely be better. How much better and how much better than SMC/B+W nobody will ever be able to define for actual usage for photographers of different styles and approaches.

I'm looking forward to seeing the reviews, but unless I have a chance to make my own comparisons, I guess I'll just carry on taking photos and trying not to think about how much better a shot might have been with different gear - it's so damaging.

It's just struck me that one of the easiest way to reduce flare is with a hand or map to shield the sun. Maybe this instinctive action saves my filters ruining my shots more often. That and my approach to bracket and then bracket some more ...
You will get far more flare resistance from a well fitted lens hood or as you have found, a well placed shade that anything else you can add to a lens.
You will also get more protection to your lens from a good hood than you will from a "protective" filter in almost all situations.
03-01-2021, 03:07 AM - 1 Like   #345
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
You will get far more flare resistance from a well fitted lens hood or as you have found, a well placed shade that anything else you can add to a lens.
You will also get more protection to your lens from a good hood than you will from a "protective" filter in almost all situations.
I have one lens which really needs a protective filter: The DA35 Macro ltd - you just get too close to your subjects with that lens
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