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07-07-2022, 10:01 AM - 1 Like   #106
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QuoteOriginally posted by Mike.P® Quote
I was just pulling your leg

I may have missed it but has Ricoh ever said that there will actually be a K-1 MKIII ?

I see a lot of anticipation and conjecture but nothing concrete from Ricoh ... although to be fair we see very little about anything coming from them anyway.
They have said it, though not in concrete terms. When the DFA*85/1.4 was released, one of the things Pentax said was that it was of sufficient quality to meet the needs of future higher resolution sensors.
The implication being that there would be future full frame cameras.

The reality is that the K1 sensor is now 10 years or more old. At some point Sony will stop supplying it at which time Ricoh will be forced to either come up with a new camera or abandon ship. Ricoh is giving every indication that they are in the camera business for the long haul with no apparent concern that they are going to be a niche player (much to the chagrin of many of the people here).

07-07-2022, 10:20 AM   #107
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QuoteOriginally posted by house Quote
I'd never do business again with someone behaving as above . Spam is the worst
Well it's not just spam. A lot of it directs you to online community spaces, the very thing Pentax is talking about. I'm not really sure how you engage with people otherwise and without bricks and mortar stores. Fuji has a London flagship store very similar to the idea talked about in the press release, which I've visited. Apart from having a full range of Fuji gear, it didn't feel to me like it was anything other than a sales environment and sure enough I soon had the attention of a salesman showing me the current deals. Now I am particularly turned off by that, I'd rather have the spam.
07-07-2022, 10:46 AM - 1 Like   #108
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QuoteOriginally posted by 3by2 Quote
Well it's not just spam. A lot of it directs you to online community spaces, the very thing Pentax is talking about. I'm not really sure how you engage with people otherwise and without bricks and mortar stores. Fuji has a London flagship store very similar to the idea talked about in the press release, which I've visited. Apart from having a full range of Fuji gear, it didn't feel to me like it was anything other than a sales environment and sure enough I soon had the attention of a salesman showing me the current deals. Now I am particularly turned off by that, I'd rather have the spam.
Ummm, you walked into a store, not a museum. What were you expecting other than a sales environment and sales people?
07-07-2022, 10:53 AM - 1 Like   #109
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QuoteOriginally posted by Mike.P® Quote
I wonder if the K-3 MKIV will have a flippy screen .....
Yes, of course the K3 IV will have a flippy screen, but it won't be moon-lander style. Pentax engineers , as creative as usual, proposed a 15" holographic 360 degrees (spherical) screen so you can view camera display from every angle, upside down, down-side up, belly up , belly down, back to front , front to back, and take pictures while walking on your head without having to bend your knees. The prototype was handed over to cosmonauts at the Japanese space agency for testing at the international space station (in absence of gravity). Cosmonauts reported ball screen was such convenient feature when taking pictures of earth upside down floating in space. Ricoh engineers patented the concept (in case Canon would want to copy), and Ricoh marketing felt that the ball screen was an excellent idea to be different from other brands and that the 360 degree screen was going to be the main selling point of the camera, hoping that finally Pentaxians would stop complaining about flippy screens. (https://opg.optica.org/ao/fulltext.cfm?uri=ao-56-22-6156&id=370091)


Last edited by biz-engineer; 07-07-2022 at 11:07 AM.
07-07-2022, 11:01 AM - 1 Like   #110
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote



What this does is call into question the editorial honesty of the magazine in question. If they were interested in reviewing the best lenses out there, they missed the DFA*85/1.4 (which is as good as it gets), they missed the Limited lenses, etc.

This doesn't read as a prominent photo mag, it reads as the paper version of click bait that has garnered a following.
The magazine has been around a while, the current edition is 441 and it's monthly. It doesn't feature the DFA*85/1.4 as the article seems to be the first of a series and only covers 14mm - 50mm.
The current edition does have a review of the Ricoh GR 111x so they don't ignore Ricoh completely.

07-07-2022, 11:12 AM   #111
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QuoteOriginally posted by slartibartfast01 Quote
The magazine has been around a while, the current edition is 441 and it's monthly. It doesn't feature the DFA*85/1.4 as the article seems to be the first of a series and only covers 14mm - 50mm.
The current edition does have a review of the Ricoh GR 111x so they don't ignore Ricoh completely.
I know they have a fairly long history, though very little if any market penetration outside of France
Fair enough. This is what happens when someone replies to a post that is only giving part of the story. Should they have covered the Limited lenses in that range? Perhaps, perhaps not, though it does seem strange that a magazine dedicated to photography and the equipment used for it would leave out lenses like the 21LTD and 31LTD, both of which are excellent lenses in their own right.
I'll give them a 1/10 rather than a 0/10 for trying based on the information you have provided.
07-07-2022, 12:15 PM   #112
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
The reality is that the K1 sensor is now 10 years or more old. At some point Sony will stop supplying it at which time Ricoh will be forced to either come up with a new camera or abandon ship. Ricoh is giving every indication that they are in the camera business for the long haul with no apparent concern that they are going to be a niche player (much to the chagrin of many of the people here).
Yup. In fact, considering the situation with semiconductor production, my bet is that the sensor has not been produced for years already, and Ricoh is running the last batch they bought. And, on that note, the only off-the-shelf FF sensor Sony have on their website is the 24 MP, 19 fps BSI sensor present in [name a current camera]. The 61 MP sensor that the A7R4 and Sigma FP L have is likely cut from the same wafer of the (also off-the-shelf) 26 MP APS-C chip in the K-3iii, but only as special-order because it's a more specialized, expensive sensor. The 36/42/45 MP sensors look to be very much discontinued.


My hunch, unless Ricoh want to do a Nikon and pay for a customized sensor (which I doubt), is that they'll be ordering a run of 61 MP sensors. They will not pay for a run with different pixel density.

07-07-2022, 12:36 PM   #113
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QuoteOriginally posted by Serkevan Quote
Yup. In fact, considering the situation with semiconductor production, my bet is that the sensor has not been produced for years already, and Ricoh is running the last batch they bought. And, on that note, the only off-the-shelf FF sensor Sony have on their website is the 24 MP, 19 fps BSI sensor present in [name a current camera]. The 61 MP sensor that the A7R4 and Sigma FP L have is likely cut from the same wafer of the (also off-the-shelf) 26 MP APS-C chip in the K-3iii, but only as special-order because it's a more specialized, expensive sensor. The 36/42/45 MP sensors look to be very much discontinued.


My hunch, unless Ricoh want to do a Nikon and pay for a customized sensor (which I doubt), is that they'll be ordering a run of 61 MP sensors. They will not pay for a run with different pixel density.
That's close to 30% more pixels per side than the present camera. I could live with that. Hopefully I won't have to up my game too much to take advantage of it.
Of course, this presumes a Sony sensor. Who else is making imaging sensors and selling them on a B2B basis?
Panasonic?
Samsung?
07-07-2022, 02:50 PM   #114
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
That's close to 30% more pixels per side than the present camera. I could live with that. Hopefully I won't have to up my game too much to take advantage of it.
Of course, this presumes a Sony sensor. Who else is making imaging sensors and selling them on a B2B basis?
Panasonic?
Samsung?
I think Sony is the only safe bet we have.

Samsung decided that making sensors for phones was a significantly more profitable venture, I doubt they make ILC sensors anymore.

Dunno about Panasonic - do they make the sensors for their own cameras? The 47MP chip in some of their stuff would be a reasonable increase for my use. Would also allow a fairly better frame rate (compared to 61MP) while reusing the electronics of the K-3iii, which is almost certainly what's gonna happen.

EDIT: Apparently, from what a cursory search throws back, the 47MP sensor isn't Sony (which makes sense, it doesn't seem to fit any wafer they currently work with).
07-07-2022, 03:16 PM   #115
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QuoteOriginally posted by Digitalis Quote
Well that and the lack of competition from other RF camera makers, at this point I doubt think Leica could survive another Konica Hexar RF moment.
There was a great deal of talk at one time that Fujifilm X100 series and the later X-pro cameras had done just that, but of course they limited themselves to APS-C there.

QuoteOriginally posted by Digitalis Quote
I recall one of my studio photography colleagues stunned expression when I stated this fact, to further this point I placed my D-FA 50mm f/1.4 right next to her 50mm f/1.4 Opera. I think Pentax could make a killing as a third party lens manufacturer.
I do wonder what’s happened with all the existing Nikon and Canon DSLR bodies, even Sony’s. Are their owners content with what they have, or are they eager to replace them with the new offerings? Perhaps they’re looking for someone to give them a future pathway that doesn’t involve forking out large amounts of money on a new system. If such a venture were possible, would it be high-end lenses for loyal 5D users, or lower-priced lenses for any of the poorly-served Canon APS-C cameras? I’ve no idea, but there’s probably a few potential sales to owners of Sony’s orphaned DSLRs.
07-07-2022, 04:10 PM   #116
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QuoteOriginally posted by RobA_Oz Quote
There was a great deal of talk at one time that Fujifilm X100 series and the later X-pro cameras had done just that, but of course they limited themselves to APS-C there.


I do wonder what’s happened with all the existing Nikon and Canon DSLR bodies, even Sony’s. Are their owners content with what they have, or are they eager to replace them with the new offerings? Perhaps they’re looking for someone to give them a future pathway that doesn’t involve forking out large amounts of money on a new system. If such a venture were possible, would it be high-end lenses for loyal 5D users, or lower-priced lenses for any of the poorly-served Canon APS-C cameras? I’ve no idea, but there’s probably a few potential sales to owners of Sony’s orphaned DSLRs.
I think a lot depends on the user. Canon and Nikon have made it pretty painless to move to MILC with seamless adapters and so I think some have moved over and simply continue using their old lenses with adapters.

On the other hand, people who shoot APS-C SLRs are probably still shooting with their old camera and consumer zooms. They'll move on when their current cameras start to malfunction, but there isn't a particular reason for them to upgrade, they don't use their SLRs that much anyway (mainly for kid events and low light stuff), and they are happy enough with what they have now.
07-07-2022, 04:19 PM   #117
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QuoteOriginally posted by Serkevan Quote
I think Sony is the only safe bet we have.

Samsung decided that making sensors for phones was a significantly more profitable venture, I doubt they make ILC sensors anymore.

Dunno about Panasonic - do they make the sensors for their own cameras? The 47MP chip in some of their stuff would be a reasonable increase for my use. Would also allow a fairly better frame rate (compared to 61MP) while reusing the electronics of the K-3iii, which is almost certainly what's gonna happen.

EDIT: Apparently, from what a cursory search throws back, the 47MP sensor isn't Sony (which makes sense, it doesn't seem to fit any wafer they currently work with).
If memory serves the recent Leica m has some odd sensor in it? Made up from several pieces resulting in the occasional visible "stitch" in the images?
07-07-2022, 04:44 PM   #118
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QuoteOriginally posted by RobA_Oz Quote
There was a great deal of talk at one time that Fujifilm X100 series and the later X-pro cameras had done just that, but of course they limited themselves to APS-C there.
The APS-C Tunnel vision of the cameras and their viewfinder was a major detractor for these cameras.


QuoteOriginally posted by RobA_Oz Quote
I do wonder what’s happened with all the existing Nikon and Canon DSLR bodies, even Sony’s. Are their owners content with what they have, or are they eager to replace them with the new offerings? Perhaps they’re looking for someone to give them a future pathway that doesn’t involve forking out large amounts of money on a new system. If such a venture were possible, would it be high-end lenses for loyal 5D users, or lower-priced lenses for any of the poorly-served Canon APS-C cameras?
This is where things get interesting. Not long ago I had a discussion with my colleagues about this: before the fall of the DSLR most students started off with an APS-C Sony or a Fuji camera, sometimes you would see an entry level Nikon or Canon - rarely a full frame DSLR as the cost of lenses and the body itself were rather high. With the glut of DSLRS being sold on the second hand market now it is quite possible to pick up a Nikon D4s in respectable condition for $1600 AUD and a basic lens for under 1K - and I have seen other high-end DSLRS in the hands of amateurs who ordinarily couldn't justify the purchase of such a high end camera.

Among professional photographers I only know a handful that work with Sony cameras commercially, Canon and Nikon are still in their industry tug-of-war. I'm one of the very few that use Pentax & Leica so I know what it is like to be in an extreme minority.

Last edited by Digitalis; 07-07-2022 at 04:53 PM.
07-07-2022, 04:55 PM   #119
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Hi

On a side note wasn't one of the first mirrorless cameras the Pentax k-01 which got canned after being caned by everyone ?

So who do you blame ?
07-07-2022, 04:57 PM   #120
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QuoteOriginally posted by dbs Quote
So who do you blame ?
Marc Newson.
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