Pentax KF

borisII · 11-10-2022, 01:58 PM - **1 Like**

The situation is strange. I believe that the release of the camera is an unequivocal answer to the fact that they will not develop a budget niche.
I aslo believe that MF is dead - Ricoh completely failed the competition with Fuji and Hassel and nothing has been heard about 645 for a long time. The 645Z is outdated and costs $7,000. Let me remind - it was released 8.5 years ago.

We hope for K-1III - heavily tweaked in the spirit of K-3III. Nothing else is expected.

Most likely, it is naive to expect progress from Ricoh. It is a pity that KP was discontinued. It's sad that there is no available camera even with 27 autofocus points.

An expensive crop, an expensive FF and a completely backward pseudo-budget camera (also expensive for their niche).
No disappointment at all, but I try to understand the way of Ricoh...but can't.

Maybe it's just hobby of president of Ricoh Imaging?

The Squirrel Mafia · 11-10-2022, 02:06 PM - **2 Likes**

Originally posted by borisII

No disappointment at all, but I try to understand the way of Ricoh...but can't.

Ricoh's gonna do whatever Ricoh wants to do & they don't care what Pentaxians or anyone else thinks. That seems to be their mantra. Hahaha!

Sandy Hancock · 11-10-2022, 02:14 PM - **11 Likes**

Hang on. Up until quite recently, many people thought the K-70 was still one of the best entry-level cameras out there. If it wasn't for the solenoid issue, that is.

Now that's (hopefully!) fixed. With a few other tweaks. And a new name. With presumably minimal R&D or retooling expense. While those resources are presumably concentrated on other projects.

The level of outrage I see here is quite confusing.

**GaryM** · 11-10-2022, 02:30 PM - **7 Likes**

Originally posted by Sandy Hancock

Hang on. Up until quite recently, many people thought the K-70 was still one of the best entry-level cameras out there. If it wasn't for the solenoid issue, that is.

Now that's (hopefully!) fixed. With a few other tweaks. And a new name. With presumably minimal R&D or retooling expense. While those resources are presumably concentrated on other projects.

The level of outrage I see here is quite confusing.

Yup, it is interesting. I've read so many threads with people asking for a camera with *no* video at all, and others who still want an optical viewfinder. So here we have a camera for under $1k (US) that fits that description (well, the KF's video is sure to be barely useable, anyway) and is also weather-resistant. Does anyone else even offer a weather-resistant camera and lens combo for under $1k? The KF even has 3 User Modes on the PASM dial, a feature not even available on some more expensive cameras (eg. the OM-5). We know the IQ will be excellent, and Pentax has a very nice APS-C lens lineup to use with it. I think that most of the people mocking the KF aren't even remotely in the target audience, they're just flexing on their marketing "expertise." Just my opinion, of course.

Wheatfield · 11-10-2022, 02:33 PM

Originally posted by BruceBanner

Pentax.... The K-1 is selling for $3400AUD, I bought it for $2300AUD in 2018 new from a physical store. Their prices have gone up over the years, unlike as you say other brands slowly reducing prices for their gear as the years go by

Nah, they are just dropping older gear, clearing the stuff out at giveaway prices and then charging more for the replacement products.

Mistral75 · 11-10-2022, 02:33 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Rondec

Talking about K mount gear, we've had a camera every couple of years, not? This is what I remember, Pentax KP -- January of 2017, Pentax K-1 II -- March of 2018 (tweak of the Mark I K-1), and Pentax K-3 III on April of 2021. There may have been others that I don't remember, but if that's right, then it is roughly 3 cameras in a 6 year period of time. Maybe they are working on multiple projects at once and so that slows things down, but it just feels like they are under-resourced.

From a (camera) development point of view, subtract the K-1 Mark II (it was not a new camera, only a modified motherboard with an additional chip) and add the Ricoh GR III in February of 2019 (the same development teams work on Pentax and Ricoh GR cameras).

The 2021 GR IIIx shan't be counted here: it's a lens development, not a camera development.

2023 should see the announcement of the successor to either Ricoh GR III or Pentax K-1 Mark II. The latter is older, the former bears the Ricoh brand and makes more money. Both are currently under development, Ricoh Imaging mastering the pace of such development by allocating money (man.hours) as deemed appropriate.

dbs · 11-10-2022, 02:40 PM

Originally posted by Wheatfield

Nah, they are just dropping older gear, clearing the stuff out at giveaway prices and then charging more for the replacement products.

In Oz we don't get giveaway prices its full tote odds till its gone.
As much as we hope for US pricing regimes they are not available here.

hcarvalhoalves · 11-10-2022, 02:42 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by gatorguy

Pentax has never been about video, nor should they be IMO. They are photographers' camera's, as such better for stills both in results and ergonomics than either of those you mentioned.

There's no technical reason to not offer video in detriment of photo. It's not like Leica, where they compromise video by using CCD sensors on purpose. Pentax uses the same Sony sensors used on multiple cameras, but seem to lack up-to-date hardware/software to process good quality video (even the 4K on K3-III is cropped, and it can't do 60fps). None of this has to impact ergonomics or anything else.

reh321 · 11-10-2022, 02:45 PM

Originally posted by jersey

I think that most of the people mocking the KF aren't even remotely in the target audience, they're just flexing on thei marketing "expertise." Just my opinion, of course.

I am in the “target audience”, and until about a day ago {when I found out what it apparently really is} thought in terms of getting it. I will not spend my money on a K-3iii.

Well, that is OK - I will just ‘make do’ with my KP {I have problems focusing on speeding trains; I was hoping that a new processor would speed up that process. I will try to learn to start focusing sooner} and not send another $1K to Pentax; I do have other uses for that money.

borisII · 11-10-2022, 02:59 PM

Originally posted by GaryM

Does anyone else even offer a weather-resistant camera and lens combo for under $1k?.

Canon 90D is very good DSLR for 1200 USD, much better KF...Nikon D7500 is 1000 USD, Nikon Z fc has weather sealing...

Do you really think that WR is the most important thing in cameras?

MMVIII · 11-10-2022, 03:11 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by hcarvalhoalves

Canon EOS REBEL SL3: released 2019, 4k video, $ 749
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ah0xQlGzxNU

Olympus OM-D E-M10: released 2017, 4k video, $ 598
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xB0-gpR3VpM

Pentax is now half a decade behind.

I would have never thought of a Pentax video camera. If I wanted one, I'd get a dedicated one. Pentax is mules (I keep this typo, obviously it should be miles, but mules is not wrong)ahead in weather resistent stills cameras with IBIS. If I wanted one of these, I'd get a Pentax.

The Squirrel Mafia · 11-10-2022, 03:18 PM - **4 Likes**

Originally posted by Sandy Hancock

The level of outrage I see here is quite confusing.

Hahaha! Indeed it is.

It's as simple as this. The K-70.... errrrrrrrr..... KF is going to be a very capable camera. It has everything you need to take a good picture & hopefully we never hear about another solenoid failure ever again. The image quality is going to be pretty great, given that it's practically a K-70.

For those of us that need better autofocus, more options, & a better build, that's what the K-3III is for. Not only can it take great landscape, portrait, still life, & similar pictures, but it can also handle moving subjects quite well. But yeah. One has to pay to play with that one.

It looks like Ricoh has "completed" their 2 APS-C camera lineup with this camera. Basically no more cannibalizing of their top APS-C camera. It's something that asahi man on the DPR forum had said a while ago. Something along the lines of there being 2 APS-C cameras & 2 FF cameras. Now they need to release the K-1III & eventually release an "entry level" FF camera. Hopefully the K-1III comes out no later than next year. It's long overdue.

hcarvalhoalves · 11-10-2022, 03:22 PM

Originally posted by MMVIII

I would have never thought of a Pentax video camera. If I wanted one, I'd get a dedicated one. Pentax is mules (I keep this typo, obviously it should be miles, but mules is not wrong)ahead in weather resistent stills cameras with IBIS. If I wanted one of these, I'd get a Pentax.

These are not video cameras. It's 2022, every camera is a decent video camera. It has to be, to justify its price, when any smartphone and cheap Chinese action cam can do 4K 60 fps.

MarkJerling · 11-10-2022, 03:25 PM - **3 Likes**

Originally posted by JPT

Two videos are up to promote the KF in Japanese.

This one proves that the KF rocks.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hy0fZwKf_xo

And this one, featuring the head of product development Wakashiro-san and the designer TKO (Suzuki-san), answers the mystery of what F stands for.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=46dEokhbboM

One good thing about the latter video is it serves as a reminder that Pentax doesn't skip on critical features like the prism grip, weather sealing and controls even on their most accessible model. That's worth remembering while we filter out all the negative commentary around this camera. The camera is a very capable platform for both beginners and experienced photographers, even if it lacks the latest mirrorless features.

Thanks for the post. Such a nice change from the stream of negativity here.

gatorguy · 11-10-2022, 03:27 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by borisII

Canon 90D is very good DSLR for 1200 USD, much better KF...Nikon D7500 is 1000 USD, Nikon Z fc has weather sealing...

Do you really think that WR is the most important thing in cameras?

Add the WR lens to any of those and prices are significantly more.

You're correct of course that weather resistance may or may not be an important consideration for any particular buyer, as would be video specs or sensor size or IBIS or body size or other specific camera features. Even being "the latest flagship release" is important for some buyers. Kinda like buying a car or truck where newer must be better.

11-10-2022, 02:45 PM	#339
reh321 Pentaxian Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: South Bend, IN, USA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 23,180	Originally posted by jersey I think that most of the people mocking the KF aren't even remotely in the target audience, they're just flexing on thei marketing "expertise." Just my opinion, of course. I am in the “target audience”, and until about a day ago {when I found out what it apparently really is} thought in terms of getting it. I will not spend my money on a K-3iii. Well, that is OK - I will just ‘make do’ with my KP {I have problems focusing on speeding trains; I was hoping that a new processor would speed up that process. I will try to learn to start focusing sooner} and not send another $1K to Pentax; I do have other uses for that money. Last edited by reh321; 11-10-2022 at 02:54 PM.

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11-10-2022, 01:58 PM - 1 Like	#331
borisII Pentaxian Join Date: Sep 2021 Posts: 323	The situation is strange. I believe that the release of the camera is an unequivocal answer to the fact that they will not develop a budget niche. I aslo believe that MF is dead - Ricoh completely failed the competition with Fuji and Hassel and nothing has been heard about 645 for a long time. The 645Z is outdated and costs $7,000. Let me remind - it was released 8.5 years ago. We hope for K-1III - heavily tweaked in the spirit of K-3III. Nothing else is expected. Most likely, it is naive to expect progress from Ricoh. It is a pity that KP was discontinued. It's sad that there is no available camera even with 27 autofocus points. An expensive crop, an expensive FF and a completely backward pseudo-budget camera (also expensive for their niche). No disappointment at all, but I try to understand the way of Ricoh...but can't. Maybe it's just hobby of president of Ricoh Imaging?

11-10-2022, 02:06 PM - 2 Likes	#332
The Squirrel Mafia Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2015 Posts: 3,054	Originally posted by borisII No disappointment at all, but I try to understand the way of Ricoh...but can't. Ricoh's gonna do whatever Ricoh wants to do & they don't care what Pentaxians or anyone else thinks. That seems to be their mantra. Hahaha!

11-10-2022, 02:14 PM - 11 Likes	#333
Sandy Hancock Moderator Site Supporter Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Adelaide Hills, South Australia Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 11,272	Hang on. Up until quite recently, many people thought the K-70 was still one of the best entry-level cameras out there. If it wasn't for the solenoid issue, that is. Now that's (hopefully!) fixed. With a few other tweaks. And a new name. With presumably minimal R&D or retooling expense. While those resources are presumably concentrated on other projects. The level of outrage I see here is quite confusing.

11-10-2022, 02:30 PM - 7 Likes	#334
GaryM Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Montclair, CA Photos: Gallery Posts: 426	Originally posted by Sandy Hancock Hang on. Up until quite recently, many people thought the K-70 was still one of the best entry-level cameras out there. If it wasn't for the solenoid issue, that is. Now that's (hopefully!) fixed. With a few other tweaks. And a new name. With presumably minimal R&D or retooling expense. While those resources are presumably concentrated on other projects. The level of outrage I see here is quite confusing. Yup, it is interesting. I've read so many threads with people asking for a camera with no video at all, and others who still want an optical viewfinder. So here we have a camera for under $1k (US) that fits that description (well, the KF's video is sure to be barely useable, anyway) and is also weather-resistant. Does anyone else even offer a weather-resistant camera and lens combo for under $1k? The KF even has 3 User Modes on the PASM dial, a feature not even available on some more expensive cameras (eg. the OM-5). We know the IQ will be excellent, and Pentax has a very nice APS-C lens lineup to use with it. I think that most of the people mocking the KF aren't even remotely in the target audience, they're just flexing on their marketing "expertise." Just my opinion, of course.

11-10-2022, 02:33 PM	#335
Wheatfield Moderator Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: The wheatfields of Canada Posts: 15,981	Originally posted by BruceBanner Pentax.... The K-1 is selling for $3400AUD, I bought it for $2300AUD in 2018 new from a physical store. Their prices have gone up over the years, unlike as you say other brands slowly reducing prices for their gear as the years go by Nah, they are just dropping older gear, clearing the stuff out at giveaway prices and then charging more for the replacement products.

11-10-2022, 02:33 PM - 1 Like	#336
Mistral75 Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Paris, France Posts: 7,527 Original Poster	Originally posted by Rondec Talking about K mount gear, we've had a camera every couple of years, not? This is what I remember, Pentax KP -- January of 2017, Pentax K-1 II -- March of 2018 (tweak of the Mark I K-1), and Pentax K-3 III on April of 2021. There may have been others that I don't remember, but if that's right, then it is roughly 3 cameras in a 6 year period of time. Maybe they are working on multiple projects at once and so that slows things down, but it just feels like they are under-resourced. From a (camera) development point of view, subtract the K-1 Mark II (it was not a new camera, only a modified motherboard with an additional chip) and add the Ricoh GR III in February of 2019 (the same development teams work on Pentax and Ricoh GR cameras). The 2021 GR IIIx shan't be counted here: it's a lens development, not a camera development. 2023 should see the announcement of the successor to either Ricoh GR III or Pentax K-1 Mark II. The latter is older, the former bears the Ricoh brand and makes more money. Both are currently under development, Ricoh Imaging mastering the pace of such development by allocating money (man.hours) as deemed appropriate.

11-10-2022, 02:40 PM	#337
dbs Pentaxian Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Clare Valley S A Photos: Albums Posts: 7,564	Originally posted by Wheatfield Nah, they are just dropping older gear, clearing the stuff out at giveaway prices and then charging more for the replacement products. In Oz we don't get giveaway prices its full tote odds till its gone. As much as we hope for US pricing regimes they are not available here.

11-10-2022, 02:42 PM - 1 Like	#338
hcarvalhoalves Pentaxian Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: São Paulo, Brazil Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,019	Originally posted by gatorguy Pentax has never been about video, nor should they be IMO. They are photographers' camera's, as such better for stills both in results and ergonomics than either of those you mentioned. There's no technical reason to not offer video in detriment of photo. It's not like Leica, where they compromise video by using CCD sensors on purpose. Pentax uses the same Sony sensors used on multiple cameras, but seem to lack up-to-date hardware/software to process good quality video (even the 4K on K3-III is cropped, and it can't do 60fps). None of this has to impact ergonomics or anything else.

11-10-2022, 02:59 PM	#340
borisII Pentaxian Join Date: Sep 2021 Posts: 323	Originally posted by GaryM Does anyone else even offer a weather-resistant camera and lens combo for under $1k?. Canon 90D is very good DSLR for 1200 USD, much better KF...Nikon D7500 is 1000 USD, Nikon Z fc has weather sealing... Do you really think that WR is the most important thing in cameras?

11-10-2022, 03:11 PM - 1 Like	#341
MMVIII Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: EU Posts: 1,121	Originally posted by hcarvalhoalves Canon EOS REBEL SL3: released 2019, 4k video, $ 749 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ah0xQlGzxNU Olympus OM-D E-M10: released 2017, 4k video, $ 598 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xB0-gpR3VpM Pentax is now half a decade behind. I would have never thought of a Pentax video camera. If I wanted one, I'd get a dedicated one. Pentax is mules (I keep this typo, obviously it should be miles, but mules is not wrong)ahead in weather resistent stills cameras with IBIS. If I wanted one of these, I'd get a Pentax.

11-10-2022, 03:18 PM - 4 Likes	#342
The Squirrel Mafia Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2015 Posts: 3,054	Originally posted by Sandy Hancock The level of outrage I see here is quite confusing. Hahaha! Indeed it is. It's as simple as this. The K-70.... errrrrrrrr..... KF is going to be a very capable camera. It has everything you need to take a good picture & hopefully we never hear about another solenoid failure ever again. The image quality is going to be pretty great, given that it's practically a K-70. For those of us that need better autofocus, more options, & a better build, that's what the K-3III is for. Not only can it take great landscape, portrait, still life, & similar pictures, but it can also handle moving subjects quite well. But yeah. One has to pay to play with that one. It looks like Ricoh has "completed" their 2 APS-C camera lineup with this camera. Basically no more cannibalizing of their top APS-C camera. It's something that asahi man on the DPR forum had said a while ago. Something along the lines of there being 2 APS-C cameras & 2 FF cameras. Now they need to release the K-1III & eventually release an "entry level" FF camera. Hopefully the K-1III comes out no later than next year. It's long overdue.

11-10-2022, 03:22 PM	#343
hcarvalhoalves Pentaxian Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: São Paulo, Brazil Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,019	Originally posted by MMVIII I would have never thought of a Pentax video camera. If I wanted one, I'd get a dedicated one. Pentax is mules (I keep this typo, obviously it should be miles, but mules is not wrong)ahead in weather resistent stills cameras with IBIS. If I wanted one of these, I'd get a Pentax. These are not video cameras. It's 2022, every camera is a decent video camera. It has to be, to justify its price, when any smartphone and cheap Chinese action cam can do 4K 60 fps.

11-10-2022, 03:25 PM - 3 Likes	#344
MarkJerling Moderator Site Supporter Join Date: May 2012 Location: Wairarapa, New Zealand Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 20,406	Originally posted by JPT Two videos are up to promote the KF in Japanese. This one proves that the KF rocks. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hy0fZwKf_xo And this one, featuring the head of product development Wakashiro-san and the designer TKO (Suzuki-san), answers the mystery of what F stands for. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=46dEokhbboM One good thing about the latter video is it serves as a reminder that Pentax doesn't skip on critical features like the prism grip, weather sealing and controls even on their most accessible model. That's worth remembering while we filter out all the negative commentary around this camera. The camera is a very capable platform for both beginners and experienced photographers, even if it lacks the latest mirrorless features. Thanks for the post. Such a nice change from the stream of negativity here.

11-10-2022, 03:27 PM - 1 Like	#345
gatorguy Moderator Join Date: Feb 2015 Location: Central Florida Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,092	Originally posted by borisII Canon 90D is very good DSLR for 1200 USD, much better KF...Nikon D7500 is 1000 USD, Nikon Z fc has weather sealing... Do you really think that WR is the most important thing in cameras? Add the WR lens to any of those and prices are significantly more. You're correct of course that weather resistance may or may not be an important consideration for any particular buyer, as would be video specs or sensor size or IBIS or body size or other specific camera features. Even being "the latest flagship release" is important for some buyers. Kinda like buying a car or truck where newer must be better.