[vimlr007]

In one of the recent threads - somebody posted that he felt that the delay of a new K1-iii was probably due to supply chain shortages of full frame sensors from Sony -- I did some digging and came across a really fantastic informational page on Sony about FF sensors ... apologies if this has been posted about before but it really is a great article!

https://pro.sony/ue_US/technology/full-frame-sensor

Regards

vimlr007

[reh321]

In one of the recent threads - somebody posted that he felt that the delay of a new K1-iii was probably due to supply chain shortages of full frame sensors from Sony -- I did some digging and came across a really fantastic informational page on Sony about FF sensors ... apologies if this has been posted about before but it really is a great article!

https://pro.sony/ue_US/technology/full-frame-sensor

Regards

vimlr007

I got bored reading what I already knew, and didn’t read each and every line.

What is your conclusion?

Is there a connection between Sony’s supply and what Pentax is releasing?

[borisII]

Where is the proof of your information? Sony A7 cameras has a lot of versions - 24, 33, 42, 50 and 60 MP - all cameras are in stores...

[biz-engineer]

No shortage in 2023.
https://www.wsts.org/esraCMS/extension/media/f/WST/5757/WSTS_FC_2022_11.pdf

Low volume of sensors for the camera market (compared to other segments), sensors are easy to get, provided you pay the money.
Automotive customers have complained that they can't get microchips and they even say that it's going to be difficult for them to source microchips in 2023, but that's because they don't want to pay the money, especially for the level of quality they are asking.
Of course, when the market demand is close to full capacity of the supply, you can't get microchips at low-ball prices as when supply exceed demand.

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Last edited by biz-engineer; 01-17-2023 at 10:14 AM.

[thibs]

Where is the proof of your information? Sony A7 cameras has a lot of versions - 24, 33, 42, 50 and 60 MP - all cameras are in stores...

LOL. A Sony sensor in a Sony camera ... Really ?

[ProfessorBuzz]

No shortage in 2023.
https://www.wsts.org/esraCMS/extension/media/f/WST/5757/WSTS_FC_2022_11.pdf

That's sales forecast data, NOT availability data.

Low volume of sensors for the camera market (compared to other segments), sensors are easy to get, provided you pay the money.

Again, not a true statement. Buyers of Sony and other image sensors provide a purchase forecast to the manufacturer or distributor, and an allocation is made on that basis. Prices are negotiated; manufacturing is scheduled.

Automotive customers have complained that they can't get microchips and they even say that it's going to be difficult for them to source microchips in 2023, but that's because they don't want to pay the money, especially for the level of quality they are asking.
Of course, when the market demand is close to full capacity of the supply, you can't get microchips at low-ball prices as when supply exceed demand.

Shortages of components continue to be an issue for all electronics users. Consumer demand has slowed for consumer electronic products like laptops, PCs, etc except for the newest/highest performance.
Industrial and commercial purchasers continue to face shortages and shipping delays.

[Michael Piziak]

In one of the recent threads - somebody posted that he felt that the delay of a new K1-iii was probably due to supply chain shortages of full frame sensors from Sony -- I did some digging and came across a really fantastic informational page on Sony about FF sensors ... apologies if this has been posted about before but it really is a great article!

https://pro.sony/ue_US/technology/full-frame-sensor

Regards

vimlr007

I find this thread interesting & will continue to follow it!
I have skimmed over the link above a few times, but can't find any info. on sensor demand - if it's in there, what does it say?

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Last edited by Michael Piziak; 01-17-2023 at 12:27 PM.

[Serkevan]

sensors are easy to get, provided you pay the money.

Yes, if you're willing to pay through the nose because you can offload your costs somewhere else (like the consumer), you can get the sensors.

That's more or less the definition of a shortage, Biz - there's no longer enough for everyone, so they jack the prices to drop demand
It was supposed to be significantly better these days, though... it might not be the case.

[borisII]

LOL. A Sony sensor in a Sony camera ... Really ?

Do you think that Sony can't supply 1000 sensors per month for Ricoh?

[Michael Piziak]

Do you think that Sony can't supply 1000 sensors per month for Ricoh?

I think that Pentax could easily update the 645z without changing much in the camera. Just put the 100MP sensor in it that the Fujifilm medium format cameras have. My understanding is that the Fujifilm and Pentax medium format sensors are already the same size - unlike comparing it to Hasselblad.

[gatorguy]

Do you think that Sony can't supply 1000 sensors per month for Ricoh?

Dunno...Does another company already have a contract for sensors that includes the 1000 of 'em that Pentax would want, or perhaps has a stronger customer relationship and leverage? Hello supply, I want you to meet demand. Let the head-butting begin.

[Mooncatt]

That's more or less the definition of a shortage, Biz - there's no longer enough for everyone, so they jack the prices to drop demand
It was supposed to be significantly better these days, though... it might not be the case.

I suspect these prices are here to stay. Not sure about other countries, but the U.S. companies have been jacking up wages to try attracting people back into the workforce after all the Covid related cutbacks and shutdowns have eased up. What may have started as little supply mixing with high demand is now going to translate into increasing supply to meet the demand while keeping prices high to cover the increased wage costs. Over time things should settle into a new normal of higher prices, higher wages, but spending power on par with pre-Covid levels.

[borisII]

I think that Pentax could easily update the 645z without changing much in the camera. Just put the 100MP sensor in it that the Fujifilm medium format cameras have. My understanding is that the Fujifilm and Pentax medium format sensors are already the same size - unlike comparing it to Hasselblad.

645Z project has no prospects I think. I don't wait the upgrade of 645Z in near future...The competition lost IMO...

---------- Post added 01-17-23 at 01:21 PM ----------

Dunno...Does another company already have a contract for sensors that includes the 1000 of 'em that Pentax would want, or perhaps has a stronger customer relationship and leverage? Hello supply, I want you to meet demand. Let the head-butting begin.

American English is not my native language, I didn't catch your idea, sorry...I mean 1000 sensor for K-1III. Let it be 3000, not the big difference.

[biz-engineer]

Again, not a true statement. Buyers of Sony and other image sensors provide a purchase forecast to the manufacturer or distributor, and an allocation is made on that basis. Prices are negotiated; manufacturing is scheduled.

Yes I know, for some strange reasons.

Shortages of components continue to be an issue for all electronics users.

Shouldn't be an issue for cameras, because volumes of cameras, even from Sony or Canon, are very low compared to other products. Cameras are not even to the level of volumes required for cars, and volume for cars are hundreds of magnitude smaller than for consumer electronics. Quantities needed for camera are tiny.

I believe that if we aren't seeing a Pentax K1 III , it is not related to a shortage of sensors , whatever the sensor, because Pentax volumes would be 50 times less than the needs of Sony, Fuji and Nikon combined, and not a huge deal to insert a few production batches for Pentax. Delay (assuming a release date was already provided) for Pentax K1 III is most likely due to a shortage of camera R&D resources. Other brands are able to release new cameras, for much higher production quantities than Pentax.

[gatorguy]

Other brands are able to release new cameras, for much higher production quantities than Pentax.

There were only 7 new cameras released last year, across all manufacturers. Seven.

-Two Canon, the EOS R7 and R10
-Two Fujis, X-H2S and X-T5
-A single Nikon, the Z30
-and two OM's, OM-1 and OM-5

That's not many at all Biz, so it's hardly a brisk roll-out full of innovative new cameras coming to the market.
Contrast that to just five years ago with 27 new camera models across 7 different manufacturers. Ten years ago? 42.