Pentax- becoming the great unknown

pasipasi · 02-06-2009, 02:44 PM

The 77 limited is almost 1300usd here in Finland

. A new store opened up here in Oulu, where I live, and they carry some Pentax stuff on the shelves, which is nice.

crbrune · 02-06-2009, 02:56 PM

I too bought my first Pentax in 1968. A K1000 after my Voightlander broke down.
I used it for 40 years without ever having a problem with it. Still have it. Early in the digital game I purchased a couple of HPs and when I decided to get serious again I knew it had to be a Pentax. Bought a K100D Super last year and just picked up a K200D. I looked at the big 2 but wanted to continue using all my Pentax lenses and what really sold me was looking on Ebay and seeing all the Nikon and Cannon Refurbished units for sale. You seldom see a refurbished Pentax. There has to be a reason for that. But I agree that marketing leaves something to be desired. I fear that the merger will not help that situation either. I'm sure Pentax is based on repeat sales and apparently its working, but I think they can do better by getting the word out.

Ratmagiclady · 02-06-2009, 03:06 PM

Originally posted by pasipasi

The 77 limited is almost 1300usd here in Finland

. A new store opened up here in Oulu, where I live, and they carry some Pentax stuff on the shelves, which is nice.

Yaknow, if you'll front for it, split the difference, and get hold of some mercury button cells for my old Canons, (Still banned in America despite Bush saying, 'Eh, just go ahead and dump the mercury right into the Great Lakes, heh, heh. Free market. ) for which I would swear by my most-sacred things I would not let the mercury ever go unaccounted for,) maybe I could *bring* you one of those lenses, should my dear Finnish beloved be that interested in seeing Oulu again.

We're all in this together.

Only hazard would be if I put that 77 on a film body, I might buy one in Oulu and be out serious money on the deal.

crispy0009 · 02-07-2009, 02:28 AM

Originally posted by ballgofar

Everyone sees the Nikon advertisements on TV with Ashton Kutcher or whatever his name is, and everyone sees all the professionals at the football games with big old Canons.

I work at Best Buy & people come in all the time, "You got those Ashton Kutcher cameras?". It pisses me off SOOOOOOO much!

**Rorschach** · 02-07-2009, 03:08 AM

Originally posted by Ratmagiclady

Yaknow, if you'll front for it, split the difference, and get hold of some mercury button cells for my old Canons, (Still banned in America despite Bush saying, 'Eh, just go ahead and dump the mercury right into the Great Lakes, heh, heh. Free market. ) for which I would swear by my most-sacred things I would not let the mercury ever go unaccounted for,) maybe I could *bring* you one of those lenses, should my dear Finnish beloved be that interested in seeing Oulu again.

We're all in this together.

Only hazard would be if I put that 77 on a film body, I might buy one in Oulu and be out serious money on the deal.

There's not that much to see in Oulu...but there's maybe too much to smell (heavy wood processing industry)

I used to live there for about ten years. If you want nice scenics you should visit Kuusamo instead

er1kksen · 02-07-2009, 06:39 AM

Originally posted by crispy0009

I work at Best Buy & people come in all the time, "You got those Ashton Kutcher cameras?". It pisses me off SOOOOOOO much!

You could always pay dumb and say, "well, I'm not sure what you're talking about, but if Ashton Kutcher's endorsing it, it must be a quality product, right? Well let me show you what we have here in terms of good, quality products..." and proceed to direct them to buy a nice new K-m.

Once they've been made aware of why the K-m is so good, hopefully they won't care when they discover that the Ashton Kutcher ads actually prominently display a NIKON.

Samsungian · 02-07-2009, 07:08 AM

Assuming your Best Buy is like my Best Buy how exactly would you sell a Pentax product with none on display or available instore? Would you direct the potential pentax buyer to Best Buy website or sell them Nikon & Canon Cameras from your stock onhand?

I like Mr Demi Moore 's nikon ads. He's enthusiastic. I find them better than a Tennis Star's doggie ads for Canon. I don't follow tennis, whats her name anyways?

Originally posted by er1kksen

You could always pay dumb and say, "well, I'm not sure what you're talking about, but if Ashton Kutcher's endorsing it, it must be a quality product, right? Well let me show you what we have here in terms of good, quality products..." and proceed to direct them to buy a nice new K-m.

Once they've been made aware of why the K-m is so good, hopefully they won't care when they discover that the Ashton Kutcher ads actually prominently display a NIKON.

panoguy · 02-07-2009, 08:00 AM

My wife has an AE-1, I bought a 300D as my first digital SLR, and then went to a 20D and some L-series lenses. Had a great time with them and the pictures were nice, but never really *learned alot* about what I was doing - I'm no longtime photographer or artiste (I'm a retoucher, so I can fix what I can't shoot ;-) ).

When it came time to upgrade the 20D, I was looking for higher resolution (30D, 40D? ha!), pro-sumer lenses that didn't break the bank (L-series?), and knew that I wanted to focus on landscapes (pardon the pun). I did the research on dpreview and elsewhere (PopPhoto gave the K10 and K20's glowing reviews), and guess what...

Pentax made exactly what I was looking for.

(Just put a "K" in front of my last camera!) Adding weather seals, good high-ISO, and controls that (once you get used to them) make it easier for me to improve my photographs just sweetens the pot.

I'm not a brand whore (heck, I drive a Hyundai) and I really care that the tool does its job, helps me take good photos without frustrating me, and doesn't become a money-pit. Most importantly, after a year the K20D hits those non-specification "essentials" on the head. I'm set for the next few years... and don't care too much what everyone else says or buys.

-Mark (not a "Pentaxian" unless the above qualifies)

fadzil karim · 02-07-2009, 09:00 AM

Theres several stores here where i can get my stuff. My favorite camera shop for Pentax is Foto Keat.

**rparmar** · 02-07-2009, 09:54 AM

It seems some will complain no matter what. Pentax is is a much better situation than even a few years ago, with three excellent bodies in the line-up, a full slate of quality glass, and great third-party support. There are Pentax ads in photo mags, on billboards, etc. and decent showings at the trade fairs. All their products get good review coverage and positive notice in dozens of publications. All over the internet are blogs, forums, dedicated websites, galleries, etc.

What more could you possible want?

Would Pentax products be better if they were are popular as Canon? No, I think they'd be worse.

m8o · 02-07-2009, 10:34 AM

I knew of Pentax as "one of the good cameras" from when I was a young lass in the 60's & 70's. In 'modrun' days primarily because the point & shoot I settled on buying for my wife early this decade was a Casio, which is equipped with a Pentax lens (before Casio removed the Pentax badging from it). That was the primary impetus to me finding the K10D in '07.

Votesh · 02-07-2009, 11:35 AM

Originally posted by rparmar

Would Pentax products be better if they were are popular as Canon? No, I think they'd be worse.

Why do you think they'd be worse?
You seem to have a very optimistic view of current Pentax marketing. Not that that's a bad thing. However, others have a very different view. Personally I could care less whether they have TV ads, a ton of magazine ads, or whatever. The thing is, such presence would help expand the number of Pentax users. While popularity is not always the absolute best thing, having more customers would increase the ability of Pentax to release new products.

My only problem with Pentax these days is that even though they have great bodies and some even better lenses, they don't have the money or impetus to develop or release products that I would love to be able to buy new, that other companies readily offer. For example, I would love to be able to purchase a DA* version of either the A* or FA* 200mm Macro lenses. However, apparently Pentax doesn't see the need to have such a product in their line-up at this time. If there were more Pentax users, especially pros, requesting such a lens they would be more inclined to offer a new product like that. I'd also like to see a 300mm 2.8 offered. While similar lenses are offered by 3rd party manufacturers I'd prefer to buy Pentax, especially considering the reputations of the past Pentax offerings in these ranges. In fact, I just spent $1500 on a used A* 200mm when a new version of similar lenses from C & N would cost hundreds of dollars less. The A* is supposed to be better than either of these lenses so I'm not really complaining, but I would love to be able to get a new version of this same lens.

Granted, Pentax is doing better by again offering stuff like a ring flash, but more customers would undoubtedly help hem add more products that just aren't fiscally prudent at the moment. It might also help if they did better when guessing the dates of release for new products. By all means, I'm not bashing Pentax, I'm just saying more in flow of cash is never bad.

er1kksen · 02-07-2009, 11:37 AM

Originally posted by Samsungian

Assuming your Best Buy is like my Best Buy how exactly would you sell a Pentax product with none on display or available instore? Would you direct the potential pentax buyer to Best Buy website or sell them Nikon & Canon Cameras from your stock onhand?

I like Mr Demi Moore 's nikon ads. He's enthusiastic. I find them better than a Tennis Star's doggie ads for Canon. I don't follow tennis, whats her name anyways?

Oh... I don't live near any Best Buys that I know of, so I wouldn't really know... just a thought I guess.

**rparmar** · 02-07-2009, 01:32 PM

Originally posted by Votesh

Why do you think they'd be worse?

Because very rarely do the words "popular", "value" and "quality" go hand in hand. If it did in this domain, Canon would offer the best value for money and I'd be using their products, rendering this discourse null and void.

Originally posted by Votesh

Personally I could care less whether they have TV ads, a ton of magazine ads, or whatever. The thing is, such presence would help expand the number of Pentax users. While popularity is not always the absolute best thing, having more customers would increase the ability of Pentax to release new products.

Greater sales only equates to more profit if the cost of the advertising itself is offset. Even then, greater profit does not in any way guarantee more products or even quicker product development... it could simply be taken as additional income out of the Pentax division.

m8o · 02-07-2009, 03:28 PM

Originally posted by Samsungian

I like Mr Demi Moore 's nikon ads. He's enthusiastic. I find them better than a Tennis Star's doggie ads for Canon. I don't follow tennis, whats her name anyways?

Haha on the Mr. Demi Moore... and bigger haha on the Maria Sharapova ad comment. I may have made mention about those ads in the past, but never fully describe the story I have to share in regards to that. I think I will.

The first/original ad was hands down the best, and just like many sequels to movies shouldn't have had more made as they were just weak impersonations of the original; something like the 4rth or 5th sequel being the inclusion of that [her?] dog.

Me, I loved that 1st ads from the 1st time I saw the smiley face she made from tennis balls, and snapped a shot of it. And that was before I discovered that one of my oldest friends I've known & kept in touch with periodically for about 35 years now was the agency's head creative ad designer for the firm that made that ad.

They did everything from conception to execution; they came up with "Make Every Shot a PowerShot". Whatever you have to say about the ads today, that was and is brilliant.

When working with her shooting the ad, his eye height is about up to her nipples!

He's a collector of very old cameras and knows a good deal about them & photography. The CEO or some other high level exec of Canon was good friends with her or something, and insisted on using her for their ad campaign (backwards, as you normally come-up with a idea & campain then find the right situation & person for it), and not for DSLRs but for the PowerShots. My friend recognized they had a problem:
1) She's a sports star in a high speed action sport.
2) PowerShots are pretty much incapable of taking good shots of her in action.

There was no way they could advertise the cameras being used to take good action photos of her, as noone buying one would succeed in that manner and be pissed @ the false advertising that drew them in. ...Enter, her action to create the static scene of the smiley face made of tennis balls, which she then takes a snap of at the end using a PowerShot. Brilliant. But it should have ended with that 1st ad. (he's no longer with the firm either as of 2 or 3 years)

02-07-2009, 07:08 AM	#52
Samsungian Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Colorado USA Posts: 1,337	My Best Buy carrys no Pentax, no K-m, nothing at all. Assuming your Best Buy is like my Best Buy how exactly would you sell a Pentax product with none on display or available instore? Would you direct the potential pentax buyer to Best Buy website or sell them Nikon & Canon Cameras from your stock onhand? I like Mr Demi Moore 's nikon ads. He's enthusiastic. I find them better than a Tennis Star's doggie ads for Canon. I don't follow tennis, whats her name anyways? Originally posted by er1kksen You could always pay dumb and say, "well, I'm not sure what you're talking about, but if Ashton Kutcher's endorsing it, it must be a quality product, right? Well let me show you what we have here in terms of good, quality products..." and proceed to direct them to buy a nice new K-m. Once they've been made aware of why the K-m is so good, hopefully they won't care when they discover that the Ashton Kutcher ads actually prominently display a NIKON.

02-07-2009, 08:00 AM	#53
panoguy Pentaxian Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Washington, D.C. Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,327	I was "cannon fodder" for years... My wife has an AE-1, I bought a 300D as my first digital SLR, and then went to a 20D and some L-series lenses. Had a great time with them and the pictures were nice, but never really learned alot about what I was doing - I'm no longtime photographer or artiste (I'm a retoucher, so I can fix what I can't shoot ;-) ). When it came time to upgrade the 20D, I was looking for higher resolution (30D, 40D? ha!), pro-sumer lenses that didn't break the bank (L-series?), and knew that I wanted to focus on landscapes (pardon the pun). I did the research on dpreview and elsewhere (PopPhoto gave the K10 and K20's glowing reviews), and guess what... Pentax made exactly what I was looking for. (Just put a "K" in front of my last camera!) Adding weather seals, good high-ISO, and controls that (once you get used to them) make it easier for me to improve my photographs just sweetens the pot. I'm not a brand whore (heck, I drive a Hyundai) and I really care that the tool does its job, helps me take good photos without frustrating me, and doesn't become a money-pit. Most importantly, after a year the K20D hits those non-specification "essentials" on the head. I'm set for the next few years... and don't care too much what everyone else says or buys. -Mark (not a "Pentaxian" unless the above qualifies)

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02-06-2009, 02:44 PM	#46
pasipasi Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Oulu Photos: Gallery Posts: 532	The 77 limited is almost 1300usd here in Finland . A new store opened up here in Oulu, where I live, and they carry some Pentax stuff on the shelves, which is nice.

02-06-2009, 02:56 PM	#47
crbrune Inactive Account Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Carson City, Michigan Photos: Gallery Posts: 18	I too bought my first Pentax in 1968. A K1000 after my Voightlander broke down. I used it for 40 years without ever having a problem with it. Still have it. Early in the digital game I purchased a couple of HPs and when I decided to get serious again I knew it had to be a Pentax. Bought a K100D Super last year and just picked up a K200D. I looked at the big 2 but wanted to continue using all my Pentax lenses and what really sold me was looking on Ebay and seeing all the Nikon and Cannon Refurbished units for sale. You seldom see a refurbished Pentax. There has to be a reason for that. But I agree that marketing leaves something to be desired. I fear that the merger will not help that situation either. I'm sure Pentax is based on repeat sales and apparently its working, but I think they can do better by getting the word out.

02-06-2009, 03:06 PM	#48
Ratmagiclady Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: GA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 13,563	Originally posted by pasipasi The 77 limited is almost 1300usd here in Finland . A new store opened up here in Oulu, where I live, and they carry some Pentax stuff on the shelves, which is nice. Yaknow, if you'll front for it, split the difference, and get hold of some mercury button cells for my old Canons, (Still banned in America despite Bush saying, 'Eh, just go ahead and dump the mercury right into the Great Lakes, heh, heh. Free market. ) for which I would swear by my most-sacred things I would not let the mercury ever go unaccounted for,) maybe I could bring you one of those lenses, should my dear Finnish beloved be that interested in seeing Oulu again. We're all in this together. Only hazard would be if I put that 77 on a film body, I might buy one in Oulu and be out serious money on the deal.

02-07-2009, 02:28 AM	#49
crispy0009 Forum Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Palm Beach Gardens, FLORIDA Posts: 62	Originally posted by ballgofar Everyone sees the Nikon advertisements on TV with Ashton Kutcher or whatever his name is, and everyone sees all the professionals at the football games with big old Canons. I work at Best Buy & people come in all the time, "You got those Ashton Kutcher cameras?". It pisses me off SOOOOOOO much!

02-07-2009, 03:08 AM	#50
Rorschach Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Kuusamo, Finland Photos: Gallery Posts: 652	Originally posted by Ratmagiclady Yaknow, if you'll front for it, split the difference, and get hold of some mercury button cells for my old Canons, (Still banned in America despite Bush saying, 'Eh, just go ahead and dump the mercury right into the Great Lakes, heh, heh. Free market. ) for which I would swear by my most-sacred things I would not let the mercury ever go unaccounted for,) maybe I could bring you one of those lenses, should my dear Finnish beloved be that interested in seeing Oulu again. We're all in this together. Only hazard would be if I put that 77 on a film body, I might buy one in Oulu and be out serious money on the deal. There's not that much to see in Oulu...but there's maybe too much to smell (heavy wood processing industry) I used to live there for about ten years. If you want nice scenics you should visit Kuusamo instead

02-07-2009, 06:39 AM	#51
er1kksen Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Forestville, NY Photos: Albums Posts: 1,801	Originally posted by crispy0009 I work at Best Buy & people come in all the time, "You got those Ashton Kutcher cameras?". It pisses me off SOOOOOOO much! You could always pay dumb and say, "well, I'm not sure what you're talking about, but if Ashton Kutcher's endorsing it, it must be a quality product, right? Well let me show you what we have here in terms of good, quality products..." and proceed to direct them to buy a nice new K-m. Once they've been made aware of why the K-m is so good, hopefully they won't care when they discover that the Ashton Kutcher ads actually prominently display a NIKON.

02-07-2009, 09:00 AM	#54
fadzil karim Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia Photos: Gallery Posts: 128	Theres several stores here where i can get my stuff. My favorite camera shop for Pentax is Foto Keat.

02-07-2009, 09:54 AM	#55
rparmar Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2008 Photos: Gallery Posts: 8,819	It seems some will complain no matter what. Pentax is is a much better situation than even a few years ago, with three excellent bodies in the line-up, a full slate of quality glass, and great third-party support. There are Pentax ads in photo mags, on billboards, etc. and decent showings at the trade fairs. All their products get good review coverage and positive notice in dozens of publications. All over the internet are blogs, forums, dedicated websites, galleries, etc. What more could you possible want? Would Pentax products be better if they were are popular as Canon? No, I think they'd be worse.

02-07-2009, 10:34 AM	#56
m8o Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: 40°-55'-44" N / 73°-24'-07" W [on LI] Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,092	I knew of Pentax as "one of the good cameras" from when I was a young lass in the 60's & 70's. In 'modrun' days primarily because the point & shoot I settled on buying for my wife early this decade was a Casio, which is equipped with a Pentax lens (before Casio removed the Pentax badging from it). That was the primary impetus to me finding the K10D in '07.

02-07-2009, 11:35 AM	#57
Votesh Inactive Account Join Date: Apr 2008 Photos: Gallery Posts: 817	Originally posted by rparmar Would Pentax products be better if they were are popular as Canon? No, I think they'd be worse. Why do you think they'd be worse? You seem to have a very optimistic view of current Pentax marketing. Not that that's a bad thing. However, others have a very different view. Personally I could care less whether they have TV ads, a ton of magazine ads, or whatever. The thing is, such presence would help expand the number of Pentax users. While popularity is not always the absolute best thing, having more customers would increase the ability of Pentax to release new products. My only problem with Pentax these days is that even though they have great bodies and some even better lenses, they don't have the money or impetus to develop or release products that I would love to be able to buy new, that other companies readily offer. For example, I would love to be able to purchase a DA* version of either the A* or FA* 200mm Macro lenses. However, apparently Pentax doesn't see the need to have such a product in their line-up at this time. If there were more Pentax users, especially pros, requesting such a lens they would be more inclined to offer a new product like that. I'd also like to see a 300mm 2.8 offered. While similar lenses are offered by 3rd party manufacturers I'd prefer to buy Pentax, especially considering the reputations of the past Pentax offerings in these ranges. In fact, I just spent $1500 on a used A* 200mm when a new version of similar lenses from C & N would cost hundreds of dollars less. The A* is supposed to be better than either of these lenses so I'm not really complaining, but I would love to be able to get a new version of this same lens. Granted, Pentax is doing better by again offering stuff like a ring flash, but more customers would undoubtedly help hem add more products that just aren't fiscally prudent at the moment. It might also help if they did better when guessing the dates of release for new products. By all means, I'm not bashing Pentax, I'm just saying more in flow of cash is never bad.

02-07-2009, 11:37 AM	#58
er1kksen Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Forestville, NY Photos: Albums Posts: 1,801	Originally posted by Samsungian Assuming your Best Buy is like my Best Buy how exactly would you sell a Pentax product with none on display or available instore? Would you direct the potential pentax buyer to Best Buy website or sell them Nikon & Canon Cameras from your stock onhand? I like Mr Demi Moore 's nikon ads. He's enthusiastic. I find them better than a Tennis Star's doggie ads for Canon. I don't follow tennis, whats her name anyways? Oh... I don't live near any Best Buys that I know of, so I wouldn't really know... just a thought I guess.

02-07-2009, 01:32 PM	#59
rparmar Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2008 Photos: Gallery Posts: 8,819	Originally posted by Votesh Why do you think they'd be worse? Because very rarely do the words "popular", "value" and "quality" go hand in hand. If it did in this domain, Canon would offer the best value for money and I'd be using their products, rendering this discourse null and void. Originally posted by Votesh Personally I could care less whether they have TV ads, a ton of magazine ads, or whatever. The thing is, such presence would help expand the number of Pentax users. While popularity is not always the absolute best thing, having more customers would increase the ability of Pentax to release new products. Greater sales only equates to more profit if the cost of the advertising itself is offset. Even then, greater profit does not in any way guarantee more products or even quicker product development... it could simply be taken as additional income out of the Pentax division.

02-07-2009, 03:28 PM	#60
m8o Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: 40°-55'-44" N / 73°-24'-07" W [on LI] Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,092	Originally posted by Samsungian I like Mr Demi Moore 's nikon ads. He's enthusiastic. I find them better than a Tennis Star's doggie ads for Canon. I don't follow tennis, whats her name anyways? Haha on the Mr. Demi Moore... and bigger haha on the Maria Sharapova ad comment. I may have made mention about those ads in the past, but never fully describe the story I have to share in regards to that. I think I will. The first/original ad was hands down the best, and just like many sequels to movies shouldn't have had more made as they were just weak impersonations of the original; something like the 4rth or 5th sequel being the inclusion of that [her?] dog. Me, I loved that 1st ads from the 1st time I saw the smiley face she made from tennis balls, and snapped a shot of it. And that was before I discovered that one of my oldest friends I've known & kept in touch with periodically for about 35 years now was the agency's head creative ad designer for the firm that made that ad. They did everything from conception to execution; they came up with "Make Every Shot a PowerShot". Whatever you have to say about the ads today, that was and is brilliant. When working with her shooting the ad, his eye height is about up to her nipples! He's a collector of very old cameras and knows a good deal about them & photography. The CEO or some other high level exec of Canon was good friends with her or something, and insisted on using her for their ad campaign (backwards, as you normally come-up with a idea & campain then find the right situation & person for it), and not for DSLRs but for the PowerShots. My friend recognized they had a problem: 1) She's a sports star in a high speed action sport. 2) PowerShots are pretty much incapable of taking good shots of her in action. There was no way they could advertise the cameras being used to take good action photos of her, as noone buying one would succeed in that manner and be pissed @ the false advertising that drew them in. ...Enter, her action to create the static scene of the smiley face made of tennis balls, which she then takes a snap of at the end using a PowerShot. Brilliant. But it should have ended with that 1st ad. (he's no longer with the firm either as of 2 or 3 years)