Any other new DSLRs at Photokina

vinzer · 02-24-2009, 05:14 PM

Originally posted by wll

Yes, the Oly E-620 seems like a fine little camera ... looks like Oly is on the move and stealing some of Pentax's thunder.

Lets hope that Pentax has a articulating LCD in a small package and that is for the K300D, The new K30D, I hope is a knock out ..... look at the competition, Pentax needs major innovation to stay in the game.

BTW, did I say that new Oly sure looks good on paper :-)

wll

I think a K300D with the Samsung sensor (with the same ISO range as the K20D), updated AF, an FPS bump (plus a bigger buffer to go along with it), plus a 3" LCD (even if it's not tilt-swivel) will do the trick, in addition to the usual weather-sealing and expected live view mode. Even without the AF adjustment and tilt-swivel LCD, on a head-to-head spec comparison, there's something going for the K300D to at least appeal to buyers who look at specs (more MP, bigger screen). Of course, this assumes that a K300D would also be priced the same as the Olympus E-620.

We'll see how Hoya plays their cards soon.

Originally posted by AlbertSiegel

Too bad it does not look as good in print. The issue I've always had with Olympus cameras is no matter how much of an improvement they make in image quality, I could never like the IQ above ISO 200. Their noise reduction leaves the images with a point & shoot feel to them. Too bad since Olympus has a few interesting lenses. This is a large part of the reason why I sold all my Olympus gear a while ago.

Back when I used Olympus, what put me off was the banding at ISO 1600. I assume this new sensor fixes that, but as a whole, Panasonic sensors still leave a lot to be desired. Between that, the cramped viewfinder (also fixed in this rehash some), and manually focusing by wire, I sold the Olympus gear I had.

I also agree about your comment about lenses. There are good decent-priced lenses for the Olympus system, and their zooms are really top-notch.

Originally posted by MMVIII

The grass on the other side of the fence MUST be greener

I just wonder if the same people lust for the olympus AND see only a future for Pentax in a 35mm-sensor

At least, noone put the smaller sensor on the CON-side.

Well, I've been on both sides of the fence (I've even been to other yards, so to speak), so I can appreciate what every manufacturer brings to the table.

vinzer · 02-24-2009, 05:19 PM

Originally posted by Jasvox

I stand by my statement about the Oly E620...nothing about it turns me on. Sure the little features are "wow", but the only thing that is impressive is the AF adjustment...but still nothing to make me think for a split second about wanting one.

Jason

To each his/her own and I respect your position. I'm just looking at it from the perspective of one who might be looking to buy a new DSLR and isn't invested in any system still. The "wow" features are almost always found in higher-end DSLRs, anyway.

Of course, for us already invested in Pentax, the E-620 will not do much for us, but it's still good to have decent competing products to spur Hoya to improve on their offerings.

k100d · 02-24-2009, 05:42 PM

e-620 + 15-54 II ... very deadly combination
would be a fantastic one camera one lens vacation camera

Samsungian · 02-24-2009, 06:12 PM

Ok fine

people like AA battery dslrs.

People Love pentax for suppyling AA dslrs.

I don't like AA option, I won't buy them ( ever again).

It cost me an addition $60 for a charger and a couple sets of batterys when I needed them: You know when Suppiled disposable batterys died.

No one is stupid. Just my rant. Sorry

Better thought, maybe pentax should only make AA dslrs. It would make upgrading to another pentax body a much easier decision for me in the future.

Originally posted by GaryM

I guess I must be stupid then, because I like the AA battery option, it was one of the selling points that got me to buy the K200D and the *istDS before it. With Energizer AA lithiums in the camera and a couple of spare sets in the bag, I never have to worry about carrying a charger around, and my camera is always ready to go. Just one less thing to worry about especially when travelling.

Last edited by Samsungian; 02-24-2009 at 07:45 PM.

Alfisti · 02-24-2009, 07:02 PM

Originally posted by GaryM

I guess I must be stupid then, because I like the AA battery option, it was one of the selling points that got me to buy the K200D and the *istDS before it. With Energizer AA lithiums in the camera and a couple of spare sets in the bag, I never have to worry about carrying a charger around, and my camera is always ready to go. Just one less thing to worry about especially when travelling.

With a battery in the camera and a spare in my bag i never need to worry about travelling with a charger either! Only difference is it's lighter, easier to carry, easiert o load and more reliable.

ddhytz · 02-24-2009, 07:14 PM

Originally posted by k100d

e-620 + 15-54 II ... very deadly combination
would be a fantastic one camera one lens vacation camera

Next month Pentax will give you a hybrid, 24X optical zoom, HD video vacation camera!

whatever7 · 02-24-2009, 07:26 PM

I also hate AA batteries with a passion.

Now back on topic. The problem of Olymous right now to me is not the sensor, the biggest problem is the 4/3 will leave the low end market soon.

Basically there won't be any 4/3 body to succeed the E420 and E520. OK the E620 is a follow up of the E520, but you can easily find two bodies from every other mount that have low spec than it.

I understand the 4/3 lenses focus very slowly, if they AF at all, on the micro 4/3 body.

**ManuH** · 02-24-2009, 07:32 PM

Originally posted by Alfisti

With a battery in the camera and a spare in my bag i never need to worry about travelling with a charger either! Only difference is it's lighter, easier to carry, easiert o load and more reliable.

I also used to advocate the Li-On proprietary batteries. Now with Eneloops, I have to say that AA make a strong come back. For travelling I think they are much safer. If your proprietary charger fails or you loose it or forget it, what are you going to do? Also the proliferation of proprietary batteries is not good, if you want to take your cell phone, your ipod, and any other electronic device with you, you have to bring as many different chargers...

cyg · 02-24-2009, 07:47 PM

Originally posted by Alfisti

No f@#$ing AA's.

I always find it slightly amusing that people can feel so strongly about batteries! ;-)

Being of a slightly (!) distracted nature, I find AA compatibility a big plus, and as someone else mentioned, they were one of the reason I went for a *istDS instead of some competitors. On more than one occasion they were the difference between taking pictures and lugging around a bag-(or pocket-)ful of unusable electronics.

To each his (or her) own, I guess.

But considering rechargeable CRV3 are widely and cheaply available, I don't really see the advantage of proprietary battery packs.

Not that I'd feel like cursing them, though. ;-)

er1kksen · 02-24-2009, 08:22 PM

Personally, being in the process of switching from Olympus, I think a cheap used E-620 and that nice, relatively inexpensive underwater housing sound like a really nice underwater setup someday in the future (underwater photography is something I'd like to do). Of course, if someone would just come up with a good affordable underwater housing for the K20D or even the K-m, the Olympus's appeal would be a little lower. I think it sounds like a great camera though, 2 generations improved from the E-410 which I consider to be an excellent camera.

thibs · 02-24-2009, 11:41 PM

Originally posted by Samsungian

Ok fine

people like AA battery dslrs.

People Love pentax for suppyling AA dslrs.

I don't like AA option, I won't buy them ( ever again).

It cost me an addition $60 for a charger and a couple sets of batterys when I needed them: You know when Suppiled disposable batterys died.

No one is stupid. Just my rant. Sorry

Better thought, maybe pentax should only make AA dslrs. It would make upgrading to another pentax body a much easier decision for me in the future.

There is one situataion (it is specific however) where AA's are lovely: my wife has a a K100D which she uses from time to time. Lithium AA are the way to go in this case. No charger problems and the AAs are good for one whole year.

That just a specific and ideal case but still. And AF isfaster than with rechergeable AAs.

Maxington · 02-24-2009, 11:57 PM

I hope all the people who hate AA batteries never buy an external flash.

Erik · 02-25-2009, 01:49 AM

Batteries have become such a complete and total non-issue since I discovered Eneloops.

Wait, no, there's still one thing: it sucks how NiMH batteries die in 5 minutes in -20 C. We have plenty of that sort of weather and it sucks to not be able to take pictures properly in the cold. I understand lithiums are better with cold weather? (This is fiercely offtopic for this thread, but since it's about batteries now anyway...)

Caat · 02-25-2009, 02:30 AM

Originally posted by Erik

Batteries have become such a complete and total non-issue since I discovered Eneloops.

Wait, no, there's still one thing: it sucks how NiMH batteries die in 5 minutes in -20 C. We have plenty of that sort of weather and it sucks to not be able to take pictures properly in the cold. I understand lithiums are better with cold weather? (This is fiercely offtopic for this thread, but since it's about batteries now anyway...)

Lithium ions are slightly better in this regard I think but lithium polymer batteries can actually freeze and therefore are a big no no in sub-zero temperatures.

Matjazz · 02-25-2009, 02:41 AM

Nowardays you can get charged AAs (Varta ready2go) on every gas station. Enellops in K100D last 800 shots with onboard flash used - veryfied on a wedding.

I got my DS for AA and pentaprism. Now that I have K10D I'm even thinking of downgrading to K200D for AA support, but I'm not sure I wan't to give up the K10D's pentaprism. I'll wait for PMA, maybe Pentax has K300D with AA, K20D sensor and pentaprism comming out.

02-24-2009, 06:12 PM	#64
Samsungian Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Colorado USA Posts: 1,337	Sorry, You're not stupid, I'm just rant ing Ok fine people like AA battery dslrs. People Love pentax for suppyling AA dslrs. I don't like AA option, I won't buy them ( ever again). It cost me an addition $60 for a charger and a couple sets of batterys when I needed them: You know when Suppiled disposable batterys died. No one is stupid. Just my rant. Sorry Better thought, maybe pentax should only make AA dslrs. It would make upgrading to another pentax body a much easier decision for me in the future. Originally posted by GaryM I guess I must be stupid then, because I like the AA battery option, it was one of the selling points that got me to buy the K200D and the istDS before it. With Energizer AA lithiums in the camera and a couple of spare sets in the bag, I never have to worry about carrying a charger around, and my camera is always ready to go. Just one less thing to worry about especially when travelling. Last edited by Samsungian; 02-24-2009 at 07:45 PM.*

02-24-2009, 07:47 PM	#69
cyg Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Ottawa, ON Posts: 134	Most batteries are in fact stupid. Originally posted by Alfisti No f@#$ing AA's. I always find it slightly amusing that people can feel so strongly about batteries! ;-) Being of a slightly (!) distracted nature, I find AA compatibility a big plus, and as someone else mentioned, they were one of the reason I went for a *istDS instead of some competitors. On more than one occasion they were the difference between taking pictures and lugging around a bag-(or pocket-)ful of unusable electronics. To each his (or her) own, I guess. But considering rechargeable CRV3 are widely and cheaply available, I don't really see the advantage of proprietary battery packs. Not that I'd feel like cursing them, though. ;-)

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02-24-2009, 05:14 PM	#61
vinzer Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Philippines Posts: 1,399	Originally posted by wll Yes, the Oly E-620 seems like a fine little camera ... looks like Oly is on the move and stealing some of Pentax's thunder. Lets hope that Pentax has a articulating LCD in a small package and that is for the K300D, The new K30D, I hope is a knock out ..... look at the competition, Pentax needs major innovation to stay in the game. BTW, did I say that new Oly sure looks good on paper :-) wll I think a K300D with the Samsung sensor (with the same ISO range as the K20D), updated AF, an FPS bump (plus a bigger buffer to go along with it), plus a 3" LCD (even if it's not tilt-swivel) will do the trick, in addition to the usual weather-sealing and expected live view mode. Even without the AF adjustment and tilt-swivel LCD, on a head-to-head spec comparison, there's something going for the K300D to at least appeal to buyers who look at specs (more MP, bigger screen). Of course, this assumes that a K300D would also be priced the same as the Olympus E-620. We'll see how Hoya plays their cards soon. Originally posted by AlbertSiegel Too bad it does not look as good in print. The issue I've always had with Olympus cameras is no matter how much of an improvement they make in image quality, I could never like the IQ above ISO 200. Their noise reduction leaves the images with a point & shoot feel to them. Too bad since Olympus has a few interesting lenses. This is a large part of the reason why I sold all my Olympus gear a while ago. Back when I used Olympus, what put me off was the banding at ISO 1600. I assume this new sensor fixes that, but as a whole, Panasonic sensors still leave a lot to be desired. Between that, the cramped viewfinder (also fixed in this rehash some), and manually focusing by wire, I sold the Olympus gear I had. I also agree about your comment about lenses. There are good decent-priced lenses for the Olympus system, and their zooms are really top-notch. Originally posted by MMVIII The grass on the other side of the fence MUST be greener I just wonder if the same people lust for the olympus AND see only a future for Pentax in a 35mm-sensor At least, noone put the smaller sensor on the CON-side. Well, I've been on both sides of the fence (I've even been to other yards, so to speak), so I can appreciate what every manufacturer brings to the table.

02-24-2009, 05:19 PM	#62
vinzer Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Philippines Posts: 1,399	Originally posted by Jasvox I stand by my statement about the Oly E620...nothing about it turns me on. Sure the little features are "wow", but the only thing that is impressive is the AF adjustment...but still nothing to make me think for a split second about wanting one. Jason To each his/her own and I respect your position. I'm just looking at it from the perspective of one who might be looking to buy a new DSLR and isn't invested in any system still. The "wow" features are almost always found in higher-end DSLRs, anyway. Of course, for us already invested in Pentax, the E-620 will not do much for us, but it's still good to have decent competing products to spur Hoya to improve on their offerings.

02-24-2009, 05:42 PM	#63
k100d Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Toronto Posts: 3,911	e-620 + 15-54 II ... very deadly combination would be a fantastic one camera one lens vacation camera

02-24-2009, 07:02 PM	#65
Alfisti Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Toronto (for now) Posts: 1,748	Originally posted by GaryM I guess I must be stupid then, because I like the AA battery option, it was one of the selling points that got me to buy the K200D and the *istDS before it. With Energizer AA lithiums in the camera and a couple of spare sets in the bag, I never have to worry about carrying a charger around, and my camera is always ready to go. Just one less thing to worry about especially when travelling. With a battery in the camera and a spare in my bag i never need to worry about travelling with a charger either! Only difference is it's lighter, easier to carry, easiert o load and more reliable.

02-24-2009, 07:14 PM	#66
ddhytz Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Melbourne Posts: 602	Originally posted by k100d e-620 + 15-54 II ... very deadly combination would be a fantastic one camera one lens vacation camera Next month Pentax will give you a hybrid, 24X optical zoom, HD video vacation camera!

02-24-2009, 07:26 PM	#67
whatever7 Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 278	I also hate AA batteries with a passion. Now back on topic. The problem of Olymous right now to me is not the sensor, the biggest problem is the 4/3 will leave the low end market soon. Basically there won't be any 4/3 body to succeed the E420 and E520. OK the E620 is a follow up of the E520, but you can easily find two bodies from every other mount that have low spec than it. I understand the 4/3 lenses focus very slowly, if they AF at all, on the micro 4/3 body.

02-24-2009, 07:32 PM	#68
ManuH Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Montreal Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,249	Originally posted by Alfisti With a battery in the camera and a spare in my bag i never need to worry about travelling with a charger either! Only difference is it's lighter, easier to carry, easiert o load and more reliable. I also used to advocate the Li-On proprietary batteries. Now with Eneloops, I have to say that AA make a strong come back. For travelling I think they are much safer. If your proprietary charger fails or you loose it or forget it, what are you going to do? Also the proliferation of proprietary batteries is not good, if you want to take your cell phone, your ipod, and any other electronic device with you, you have to bring as many different chargers...

02-24-2009, 08:22 PM	#70
er1kksen Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Forestville, NY Photos: Albums Posts: 1,801	Personally, being in the process of switching from Olympus, I think a cheap used E-620 and that nice, relatively inexpensive underwater housing sound like a really nice underwater setup someday in the future (underwater photography is something I'd like to do). Of course, if someone would just come up with a good affordable underwater housing for the K20D or even the K-m, the Olympus's appeal would be a little lower. I think it sounds like a great camera though, 2 generations improved from the E-410 which I consider to be an excellent camera.

02-24-2009, 11:41 PM	#71
thibs Pentaxian Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Belgium Photos: Albums Posts: 7,001	Originally posted by Samsungian Ok fine people like AA battery dslrs. People Love pentax for suppyling AA dslrs. I don't like AA option, I won't buy them ( ever again). It cost me an addition $60 for a charger and a couple sets of batterys when I needed them: You know when Suppiled disposable batterys died. No one is stupid. Just my rant. Sorry Better thought, maybe pentax should only make AA dslrs. It would make upgrading to another pentax body a much easier decision for me in the future. There is one situataion (it is specific however) where AA's are lovely: my wife has a a K100D which she uses from time to time. Lithium AA are the way to go in this case. No charger problems and the AAs are good for one whole year. That just a specific and ideal case but still. And AF isfaster than with rechergeable AAs.

02-24-2009, 11:57 PM	#72
Maxington Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Australia Posts: 255	I hope all the people who hate AA batteries never buy an external flash.

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02-25-2009, 01:49 AM	#73
Erik Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Umeå, Sweden Posts: 755	Batteries have become such a complete and total non-issue since I discovered Eneloops. Wait, no, there's still one thing: it sucks how NiMH batteries die in 5 minutes in -20 C. We have plenty of that sort of weather and it sucks to not be able to take pictures properly in the cold. I understand lithiums are better with cold weather? (This is fiercely offtopic for this thread, but since it's about batteries now anyway...)

02-25-2009, 02:30 AM	#74
Caat Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: United Kingdom Photos: Albums Posts: 927	Originally posted by Erik Batteries have become such a complete and total non-issue since I discovered Eneloops. Wait, no, there's still one thing: it sucks how NiMH batteries die in 5 minutes in -20 C. We have plenty of that sort of weather and it sucks to not be able to take pictures properly in the cold. I understand lithiums are better with cold weather? (This is fiercely offtopic for this thread, but since it's about batteries now anyway...) Lithium ions are slightly better in this regard I think but lithium polymer batteries can actually freeze and therefore are a big no no in sub-zero temperatures.

02-25-2009, 02:41 AM	#75
Matjazz Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: EU/Slovenia Photos: Gallery Posts: 774	Nowardays you can get charged AAs (Varta ready2go) on every gas station. Enellops in K100D last 800 shots with onboard flash used - veryfied on a wedding. I got my DS for AA and pentaprism. Now that I have K10D I'm even thinking of downgrading to K200D for AA support, but I'm not sure I wan't to give up the K10D's pentaprism. I'll wait for PMA, maybe Pentax has K300D with AA, K20D sensor and pentaprism comming out.