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05-01-2009, 09:03 AM   #1636
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QuoteOriginally posted by Art Vandelay II Quote
Blah, so it sounds like business as usual. I really wish Pentax would take their own advice and be interesting. If this camera is made of magnesium then make a silver version (if its plastic don't bother), sue a square sensor or APS-H sensor. Something, anything to stand out a bit. I personally was really hoping for APS-H. I even started calculating some of the lens by 1.25. the 17-70mm would become a 22-87mm. Now to me that is interesting. A standard zoom that starts in the ultra wide territory.
This APS-H stuff, to reiterate this for about the hundredth time, makes no sense. Pentax has an APS-C lens lineup, not an APS-H lens lineup. APS-H would be inferior to full frame in resolution, and inferior to APS-C in that 1) Pentax does not produce APS-H lenses and 2) no third party company produces APS-H lenses.

Introducing an APS-H camera now, with barely any compatible lenses, when the format is already a thing of the past since several years, and when the market is very clearly divided into APS-C (for amateurs) and full frame (for pros) would be the most spectacular corporate suicide in the history of photographic equipment.

No, the 17-70 would not become a 22-87 mm lens. It would become an APS-C lens on a camera it was not designed for and -- best case scenario -- blur and vignette like crazy. The 17-70 is already very soft in the corners at 17mm, has 1.5 EV of light falloff in the corners open wide and some pretty bad distortion -- now imagine what this would look like on a bigger sensor! Allow me to quote the official Pentax marketing blurb on this lens: "The image circle is perfectly proportioned to a PENTAX camera's image-sensor size." I have not seen how this lens behaves on a full frame camera but it is pretty much a no-brainer to assume that on the wide end there will be black borders -- it would barely be any better on APS-H.

So yes, it would be nice if by some sort of black magic you could have a free 22-87 mm lens, but in reality that's not how it works. Pentax will never, ever release an APS-H camera.

05-01-2009, 09:08 AM   #1637
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QuoteOriginally posted by Erik Quote
Pentax will never, ever release an APS-H camera.
Ah, finalmente!
05-01-2009, 09:13 AM   #1638
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QuoteOriginally posted by mutedphotos Quote
Ah, finalmente!
Finalmente! At que enfim!
05-01-2009, 09:13 AM   #1639
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Re: Sketch

QuoteOriginally posted by Kenn100D Quote
yup he has seen it or somebody gave this pic to him and photoshopped to sketch. so technically it's still unofficial. so no harm on NDA person who gave it to him.
No, I used a Pencil and Paper to do the Sketch! ;-D

I hate to use the Photoshop. If I had to do what you suggested, I would use the Art Filter of the K-m!! LOL..

05-01-2009, 09:14 AM   #1640
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QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote
For what?

I know that Rice's information is almost 100% real.
I have official information about K-7 and I can compare.
<rant>
it seems that a lot of people have pictures or specs of the new upcoming camera. that last picture leak, and the one blende8 posted earlier of some parts of the camera, seem like the only genuine leaked info. I myself seem to be in the party who has nothing but wants to see everything.

if you, or RH or anyone, have the official specs/pics then please show us. I don't understand why you guys are so secretive about it if you are NOT under NDA.

'but my sources are!'

but you are not! so it doesnt matter or just please keep your mouth shut.

all i can conclude from anyone saying that they have seen pictures or have the specs is that they want everyone's eyes pointed on them. do you guys just want attention? youre an elitist and we are mere peons since you have the dirt early right?!

if you know something say it, and show us something credible (note: linking to RH blog IS NOT CREDIBLE unless he shows us a credible source). i'm sick of all the, "oh but ive seen the specs and know they are right! Trust me!" if you dont want to spill the beans just shut up. it doesnt help your reputation or credibility, but only makes you look like a child craving attention. </rant>


P.S. this is nothing against you personally Ogl, just the most recent post of 'no those specs are right. believe me'

edit: that photoshopped pencil sketch looks nice tho

Last edited by eyou; 05-01-2009 at 09:25 AM.
05-01-2009, 09:20 AM   #1641
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QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote
What happened with K20D?
Well there were people saying that the K20D was comparable with a Canon 1Ds MKIII. And also that it did look like a big camera like the 1Ds and Nikon D3(D2x in that time I suppose ?).
And also that it should feature a blazing fast AF system and a high FPS shooting rate.
None of the above were true.
That happened

So I think we all have to wait until Pentax show the real specs.
05-01-2009, 09:21 AM   #1642
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QuoteOriginally posted by eyou Quote
<rant>
if you, or RH or anyone, have the official specs/pics then please show us. I don't understand why you guys are so secretive about it if you are NOT under NDA.

'but my sources are!'

but you are not! so it doesnt matter or just please keep your mouth shut.

all i can conclude from anyone saying that they have seen pictures or have the specs is that they want everyone's eyes pointed on them. do you guys just want attention? youre an elitist and we are mere peons since you have the dirt early right?!

if you know something say it. i'm sick of all the, "oh but ive seen the specs and know they are right! Trust me!" if you dont want to spill the beans just shut up. it doesnt help your rep, but only makes you look like an elitist snob. </rant>


P.S. this is nothing against you personally Ogl, just the most recent post of 'no those specs are right. believe me'

Maybe because it is the truth? If you get told something under confidence you shut up about it or else you'll be left out in the cold next time around...
However, the camera is in production. It's features (most of it anyway) is known. Theres no particular reason to be excessively sceptical to any rumors from credible sources leaking out now.....
05-01-2009, 09:36 AM   #1643
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QuoteOriginally posted by Priyantha Bleeker Quote
Well there were people saying that the K20D was comparable with a Canon 1Ds MKIII. And also that it did look like a big camera like the 1Ds and Nikon D3(D2x in that time I suppose ?).
And also that it should feature a blazing fast AF system and a high FPS shooting rate.
None of the above were true.
That happened

So I think we all have to wait until Pentax show the real specs.

I never heard such silly things. Nobody say that K-7 is close to D3/1Ds.

K-7 is better than K20D and it's all. It's the best Pentax camera now and if somebody want - he can compare with Sony A700, Nikon D90, Canon 50D.


Last edited by ogl; 05-01-2009 at 09:47 AM.
05-01-2009, 09:37 AM   #1644
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QuoteOriginally posted by Caat Quote
I'm not including anything about the AF assist light or white balance sensor thing as this is just speculation (however likely it may or may not be).
Speculation? The LED light is right THERE on the photo!
What other proof do you want? And it simply cannot be a white balance sensor.

So the AF assist light is not a speculation. And I bet that it would work as a video light as well.
05-01-2009, 09:39 AM   #1645
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QuoteOriginally posted by Pl Jensen Quote
Maybe because it is the truth? If you get told something under confidence you shut up about it or else you'll be left out in the cold next time around...
However, the camera is in production. It's features (most of it anyway) is known. Theres no particular reason to be excessively sceptical to any rumors from credible sources leaking out now.....
well it looks like theyre doing a good job of keeping it on the DL by not boasting....

thats what i dont get. if they were told not to say anything, from what they have ALREADY said, i would hope that person would not keep them in the circle next time.

it does seem like they MIGHT have access to official specs/pics, but instead of being helpful its coming off as, 'hey look at me im better than you' like theyve been promoted to some omniscient god-like status. thats how i feel at least.

who's going to be the prometheus and give us low-life underlings the fire from the gods?!

Last edited by eyou; 05-01-2009 at 09:48 AM.
05-01-2009, 09:42 AM   #1646
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K-7

I guess the best thing is to shoot till May 21 for the unveiling. i was checking if i would upgrade to K20 or wait for K-7. I'm saving some money now. Hope it's between 800 to 1000 euro's for the body only.
05-01-2009, 09:54 AM   #1647
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QuoteOriginally posted by Erik Quote
This APS-H stuff, to reiterate this for about the hundredth time, makes no sense. Pentax has an APS-C lens lineup, not an APS-H lens lineup. APS-H would be inferior to full frame in resolution, and inferior to APS-C in that 1) Pentax does not produce APS-H lenses and 2) no third party company produces APS-H lenses.
Based off softness I'll grant you the 17-70mm lens was a bad example to use, but obviously all of Pentax's FA lenses would cover it just fine. And from the FF tests I've seen The DA35, DA40, DA70, DA*200, and DA*300 should all cover ASP-H as well. As far as 3rd party goes, there are still plenty of 3rd party FF lenses that will cover it fine. The only thing that might be missing is a standard zoom.

A square APS-C sensor would also be appealing to me. As I said, just do something different for once. I can already feel the collective moan of "that's it?" when the official specs are finally released after all this hype and teasing. If Pentax wants to "leak" product announcements like this a month in advance to build up discussion and interest that is great, but the product better deliver with the goods.

If RH's specs are correct then big freaking deal, it sounds like a D90 with SR and weather sealing (only 10 months after the D90 was announced). Take a chance for christ sake, be interesting.
05-01-2009, 09:55 AM   #1648
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QuoteOriginally posted by RuiC Quote
No button there. Just the room for mirror motor.
Ok, I could live with that, but - based on what? The Z and Mz series have had the DOP-button at exactly this place, having exactly this shape. Just curious...
05-01-2009, 10:03 AM   #1649
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QuoteOriginally posted by Art Vandelay II Quote
Based off softness I'll grant you the 17-70mm lens was a bad example to use, but obviously all of Pentax's FA lenses would cover it just fine.
Well, there are no 17mm wide angle zooms among Pentax's FA lenses, and excepting four, the FA lenses are not in current production, so there would be no real advantage and your point about 22-86 lenses, or whatever, is moot. You would just be using different lenses, not better or more useful lenses. Even if Pentax reintroduced the FA designs with a new camera, they would also need to redesign the lot to incorporate SDM and weather sealing which is becoming the standard on the fancier lenses nowadays. Pentax can really not afford to do this at this point.

QuoteOriginally posted by Art Vandelay II Quote
And from the FF tests I've seen The DA35, DA40, DA70, DA*200, and DA*300 should all cover ASP-H as well. As far as 3rd party goes, there are still plenty of 3rd party FF lenses that will cover it fine. The only thing that might be missing is a standard zoom.
The 35 Limited does almost certainly not cover FF. The rest, probably, but those four niche lenses are not anywhere close to being a complete line-up. 3rd party FF lenses are dropping one by one in Pentax mount as manufacturers realize that APS-C designed lenses can be more compact, and are what the target audience wants.

QuoteOriginally posted by Art Vandelay II Quote
A square APS-C sensor would also be appealing to me. As I said, just do something different for once. I can already feel the collective moan of "that's it?" when the official specs are finally released after all this hype and teasing. If Pentax wants to "leak" product announcements like this a month in advance to build up discussion and interest that is great, but the product better deliver with the goods.
Well. To me it seems like people are clamoring for "something different" so hard that it becomes a goal in itself, instead of a means to an end that makes sense.

There is nothing wrong with APS-C sensor cameras, they take very good pictures. There is no good reason for APS-H (not to mention this particularly persistent rumour seems to be taken straight out of thin air). You could make a case for full frame, and Pentax will undoubtedly produce an FF camera at some point, but APS-H is the worst of both worlds. It is a temporary stop-gap solution that Canon invented back when good FF sensors were still not economically/technically feasible. It is not a good idea to dig up that particular corpse in 2009 only to "be different."

EDIT: The APS-H and square sensor rumours are also particularly silly since Pentax, out of all digital SLR manufacturers, are the ones that are most fiercely dedicated to APS-C as a format. They have stated this again and again, and make it very clear by introducing lenses like the 50-135 instead of a 70-200, and so forth. Pentax has bet everything on one horse, and they are not about to kill that horse.

EDIT 2: Oh, and the new camera is "different" in the ways that Pentax has already profiled themselves as being "different". Pentax today is about well-built, solid constructions and small form factors. This is going to be a small, well-built, "Limited style", weather sealed body. Pentax is aiming at people who want small, solid cameras and lenses that work in dust and rain, and that is what they are pursuing with the K-7. It is the logical extension of their weather sealed DA* and Limited lens lines.

Last edited by Erik; 05-01-2009 at 10:13 AM.
05-01-2009, 10:05 AM   #1650
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QuoteOriginally posted by eyou Quote
if you know something say it, and show us something credible
I understand what you are saying.

But tell me: What would you do if a friend offers you to give you the photos on your word to keep them private?
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