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04-17-2009, 10:31 AM   #256
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QuoteOriginally posted by séamuis Quote
thats been done multiple times within this thread.
as this last 3rd spy photo?

04-17-2009, 10:57 AM   #257
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The shape and size hints at being a pro-level camera (I know, it's in the hands of the photographer, but you get what I mean)

Square format?
04-17-2009, 11:12 AM   #258
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Preparing to be disappointed?
Now, really. You can't see all those things (I'm talking about speculations all over the forum) from that pictures. A friendly advice: expect something similar with current cameras, some changes, issues solved, half-baked functions fully implemented, new features added and so on. And you won't post "I'm angry, I'll switch to Canikonympus" when the real product will be shown to be anything less than a full frame with hexagonal sensor, 30 fps - unlimited buffer even in raw, 9999 AF points, 4" high resolution LCD and interchangeable pentaprism viewfinder with an EVF as an option.
04-17-2009, 11:21 AM   #259
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
Preparing to be disappointed?
Now, really. You can't see all those things (I'm talking about speculations all over the forum) from that pictures. A friendly advice: expect something similar with current cameras, some changes, issues solved, half-baked functions fully implemented, new features added and so on. And you won't post "I'm angry, I'll switch to Canikonympus" when the real product will be shown to be anything less than a full frame with hexagonal sensor, 30 fps - unlimited buffer even in raw, 9999 AF points, 4" high resolution LCD and interchangeable pentaprism viewfinder with an EVF as an option.
Lets not forget that it has to be an affordable $199.99

04-17-2009, 11:22 AM   #260
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well, a couple things we can glean from these photos is the general shape of the form factor (seems considerably deeper, sigh) and hints at modes from the controls (video on the mode dial). in fact, in this latest spy shot it's starting to look more like a video camcorder than a traditional SLR...:ugh:
04-17-2009, 11:31 AM   #261
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QuoteOriginally posted by séamuis Quote
I don't believe this is the same camera. the lugs don't make sense, and the shape of the mirror boxes don't seem to match.
Having deblurred all three images, let me affirm you that at least image #1 and #3 show the same body. There is enough detail to be sure. Esp. the lines and two knobs on the left side of the mirror box.

What looks like a flash in image #1 doesn't look like a flash unit so much in image #3. But no contradiction here either. Both images are with DA35 Ltd.

Image #2 is more heavily distorted. However, the left shoulder is clear enough to say that it is more likely the same camera than not.
04-17-2009, 12:25 PM   #262
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QuoteOriginally posted by séamuis Quote
what R&D? Pentax already implemented this with the LX. it had interchangeable finders and was weather sealed. in 1980. liveview isn't the best option in a lot of situations, especially when using manual lenses. and I personally WOULD purchase such a camera and finders. but I guess im a rouge.
I doubt the LX finder is nearly as well sealed as the K10/20. And prisms are a huge chunk of the cost in an SLR, I can't see Pentax building more than they have to.

Just for laughs: What if the prism cover pops up/off to reveal a waist-level EVF/LCD? Optical and live view on the same prism :P
04-17-2009, 03:01 PM   #263
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QuoteOriginally posted by séamuis:
what R&D? Pentax already implemented this with the LX. it had interchangeable finders and was weather sealed. in 1980. liveview isn't the best option in a lot of situations, especially when using manual lenses. and I personally WOULD purchase such a camera and finders. but I guess im a rouge.
QuoteOriginally posted by CSoars Quote
I doubt the LX finder is nearly as well sealed as the K10/20. And prisms are a huge chunk of the cost in an SLR, I can't see Pentax building more than they have to.
Exactly. The LX's prism has to cover a 35mm film frame and I would guess isn't as well sealed as the K20D. The fact that Pentax created an interchangeable viewfinder 29 years ago is most likely an interesting historical fact. R&D money would still be needed to be spent on creating a new interchangeable finder that covers a smaller area and carries better sealing.

Such costs are not to be sniffed at when dealing with a badly performing (relatively speaking of course ) division of a larger company like Hoya. Ensuring that a presicision engineered prism is still in alignment with the mirror etc. in a system where one element (the prism/viewfinder) can be removed by the user is difficult (I imagine; not being an optical engineer myself! ) and requires time to design and therefore costs money.

It may be a nice feature to have for some but the fact that no modern DSLR (or even autofocus SLR?) has this has to tell you something about the potential market for this ability.

I presume you mea rogue rather than rouge

04-17-2009, 04:02 PM   #264
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QuoteOriginally posted by Caat Quote
Exactly. The LX's prism has to cover a 35mm film frame and I would guess isn't as well sealed as the K20D. The fact that Pentax created an interchangeable viewfinder 29 years ago is most likely an interesting historical fact. R&D money would still be needed to be spent on creating a new interchangeable finder that covers a smaller area and carries better sealing.

Such costs are not to be sniffed at when dealing with a badly performing (relatively speaking of course ) division of a larger company like Hoya. Ensuring that a presicision engineered prism is still in alignment with the mirror etc. in a system where one element (the prism/viewfinder) can be removed by the user is difficult (I imagine; not being an optical engineer myself! ) and requires time to design and therefore costs money.

It may be a nice feature to have for some but the fact that no modern DSLR (or even autofocus SLR?) has this has to tell you something about the potential market for this ability.

I presume you mea rogue rather than rouge

The only possible exception as that this viewfinder include stuff thats rather costly and not something everyone will want or pay for. Like a very advanced optically one and perhaps live view in the finder.
A cheaper standard finder like the one the K20D could be for the cost concious.
04-17-2009, 04:29 PM   #265
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QuoteOriginally posted by Pål Jensen Quote
The only possible exception as that this viewfinder include stuff thats rather costly and not something everyone will want or pay for. Like a very advanced optically one and perhaps live view in the finder.
A cheaper standard finder like the one the K20D could be for the cost concious.
Yes I did think of that. Its a possibility and it could make it work financially.

A standard 0.95x K20D prism. A 1.0x 'aero-bright'* prism. And a 1.0x times aero-bright prism with built in E.L. display for live histogram and possibly liveview.

Maybe. It would work as long as the extra prisms really added something though. Simply shipping with a K20D prism and having a 1.0x finder wouldn't go down well given that 1.0x prisms are found on several models by competitors. As soon as you throw in a unique feature such as built in E.L. display then you get interesting and can start justifying it as an accessory/extra as no competitor has it anyway.


* some marketing term will be used to sell it I am sure

Further edit: but ultimately you'd want to ship the camera with the best you can get away with at the target price point. If Pentax could afford to sell it with an E.L display finder without breaking its target price point (what ever that may be for this camera, more than the K20D but is this due to the economic conditions or the camera? [bit of both?]) then I am sure it would. Better to get guarenteed sales at the moment, i.e.increasing the number of people buying the camera, than rely on lower sales being offset by people buying costly accessories. But this all depends on the cost of the camera, the cost of the accessory, Pentax's profit margins, and the target price point. None of which we know.

An interesting idea though!

Last edited by Caat; 04-17-2009 at 04:37 PM. Reason: spelling
04-17-2009, 06:24 PM   #266
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I think you guys are over estamating the thickness of the mirror box.

I compare the third pic with my K100D and Nikon FM2 film bodies. Assuming the right dial is the same size. The thickness of the shoulder is thinner IMO than even the FM2. The mirror box is thicker in contrast. I doubt the overall thickness is thicker than the K-M.

What is certain though, the mirror box go straight up to the prism to form a straight line. This is a new type of prism that looks more like a triangle on the size.

I would like to use photoshop to show you what I think the body looks like on the size, but I can't find any side shot of mz-5n.

Last edited by whatever7; 04-17-2009 at 06:31 PM.
04-17-2009, 09:47 PM   #267
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QuoteOriginally posted by whatever7 Quote
I think you guys are over estamating the thickness of the mirror box.

I compare the third pic with my K100D and Nikon FM2 film bodies. Assuming the right dial is the same size. The thickness of the shoulder is thinner IMO than even the FM2. The mirror box is thicker in contrast. I doubt the overall thickness is thicker than the K-M.
this dial has a button in the middle so it's probably a little bigger.
04-17-2009, 09:48 PM   #268
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It is an...

EVF type camera modeled from samsung's NX.

Just a guess from the similarity in viewfinder shape (same shortness but samsung's is more rounded). Yeah, not very convincing, but it's where my money is.

If not, then at least a new function is built-in. Looks like the 11th function in the mode wheel is for video.

Last edited by odmlediam; 04-17-2009 at 10:12 PM.
04-17-2009, 10:35 PM   #269
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QuoteOriginally posted by Vylen Quote
3.2" ... gotta out-do people if 3" has been out for 2 years...
Well Pentax is known for producing advanced amateur bodies at compact sizes. We've seen more than one reference before that the new camera will be smaller than the K20D, I don't think a 3.2" LCD will fit. I personally think the K200D is pretty big for its class so I'd love to see the new model to be even smaller than the K200D.
04-17-2009, 11:47 PM   #270
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QuoteOriginally posted by illdefined Quote
so far i'm really disheartened by the apparent depth of this new camera type. for me the only dimension of the K20D that could've used shortening was its depth (compared to other brands aps-c models).
I agree fully. Since the digital age bodies has just got thicker and thicker.



But this is on the other hand resulting from the sum of the registration distance + sensor with SR + back display. You have to give up SR or back display (or the K mount) to make a Pentax DSLR much shorter than the K-m (*ist DS is 1-2 mm thinner).

QuoteOriginally posted by CSoars Quote
Just for laughs: What if the prism cover pops up/off to reveal a waist-level EVF/LCD? Optical and live view on the same prism :P
I'm beginning to think that it actually have no built in flash (and I like that). But then this button has to do something. I think it is too exposed to release a viewfinder. It would constantly fall of by mistake. On the LX you have to push and turn and drag to take away the viewfinder.

QuoteOriginally posted by Pål Jensen Quote
The only possible exception as that this viewfinder include stuff thats rather costly and not something everyone will want or pay for. Like a very advanced optically one and perhaps live view in the finder.
A cheaper standard finder like the one the K20D could be for the cost concious.
That would make sence.

QuoteOriginally posted by whatever7 Quote
I think you guys are over estamating the thickness of the mirror box.

I compare the third pic with my K100D and Nikon FM2 film bodies. Assuming the right dial is the same size. The thickness of the shoulder is thinner IMO than even the FM2. The mirror box is thicker in contrast. I doubt the overall thickness is thicker than the K-M.
I hope you are right. But to realy make the camera thinner, not only at the shoulders but over the mirrorbox, you need to loose the back screen...actually, there is no proof of a back screen anywhere on these photos. What if...

QuoteOriginally posted by Caat Quote
A standard 0.95x K20D prism. A 1.0x 'aero-bright'* prism. And a 1.0x times aero-bright prism with built in E.L. display for live histogram and possibly liveview.

...As soon as you throw in a unique feature such as built in E.L. display then you get interesting and can start justifying it as an accessory/extra as no competitor has it anyway.
...this mysterious viewfinder is a combination of an optical view finder and a built in display, which has allowed them to drop the back screen?
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