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View Poll Results: Will Pentax Succeed with the New K-7 and Strategy?
Yes 19592.86%
No 157.14%
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05-14-2009, 07:38 AM   #181
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At that time, *istD's APS-C market was about explode and grow exponentially for years.

They have to start somewhere with FF as well. And this market is about to explode as well too. Wait for Canon Digital Rebel FF, it will probably come next year.

When Pentax was selling istD for $1800+ in 2004 it was insane price, just a few were sold. istD was collecting dust in the stores and quite a few remained on the shelves till 2006 or 2007 and dropped in price like $1000+. I do not think they were profitable with this camera at all, but it was a start of awareness of Pentax as a modern and capable DSLR company.

05-14-2009, 07:49 AM   #182
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QuoteOriginally posted by awo425 Quote
Wait for Canon Digital Rebel FF, it will probably come next year.
Yes, and it will cost ~2500 euro
05-14-2009, 08:01 AM   #183
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
Yes, and it will cost ~2500 euro
Nice one, do you believe this nonsense yourself

5DII cost $2479 + free shipping. Now, today, 5/14/2009
05-14-2009, 08:04 AM   #184
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QuoteOriginally posted by awo425 Quote
They have to start somewhere with FF as well. And this market is about to explode as well too.
This won't happen, unfortunately. Most people don't realize that outside this type of enthusiasts' forums, there is very little demand for FF cameras. The fact is that most consumers simply don't care.

What would be the next big thing... about to explode?
HD movie capable DSLR and Hybrid. These two would be high in demand among consumers. HD Movies would be standard feature soon, with more and more camcorder features added. And then soon after, when the big two join the game (Rebel Hybrid... ), hybrid cameras sales would explode.

Where does this leave FF? In its niche corner.

05-14-2009, 08:17 AM   #185
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QuoteOriginally posted by nosnoop Quote
This won't happen, unfortunately. Most people don't realize that outside this type of enthusiasts' forums, there is very little demand for FF cameras. The fact is that most consumers simply don't care.

What would be the next big thing... about to explode?
HD movie capable DSLR and Hybrid. These two would be high in demand among consumers. HD Movies would be standard feature soon, with more and more camcorder features added. And then soon after, when the big two join the game (Rebel Hybrid... ), hybrid cameras sales would explode.

Where does this leave FF? In its niche corner.
Video hype will be over very soon. It's already been implemented on mid range cameras like D90, next year it will be standard on all entry level DSLR across the industry. Megapixel wars are over, nobody need 20MP in APS-C. What's next?
05-14-2009, 08:20 AM   #186
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QuoteOriginally posted by awo425 Quote
Nice one, do you believe this nonsense yourself

5DII cost $2479 + free shipping. Now, today, 5/14/2009
Well, do you believe the "Canon Digital Rebel FF, it will probably come next year" nonsense?
Now a 5DII cost about 2150 euro (source, idealo.de). A brand new, similar FF camera should cost around 2500 euro - list/launch price; we may even see another price increase in the mean time. Hence, my price estimation.
OTOH, I don't believe in a plastic-fantastic, ultra-crippled "Digital Rebel FF" sold for about 1500 euro. YMMV.
05-14-2009, 09:13 AM   #187
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QuoteOriginally posted by awo425 Quote
Video hype will be over very soon. It's already been implemented on mid range cameras like D90, next year it will be standard on all entry level DSLR across the industry.
But current implementation is pretty poor actually.
Here are some video features which will be phased in for successive model upgrades (some already in GH1):
Contrast AF during movie mode
1080/30p -> 60i/60p
Stereo or 5.1 mic
Reduced CMOS wobble
Will we see a return of power zoom for movie?
Dedicated Video lens
Higher bitrate for higher quality encoding
... etc.

They would continue to hype the video capability for some time to come.

QuoteQuote:
Megapixel wars are over, nobody need 20MP in APS-C. What's next?
As I said, hybrid cameras.
05-14-2009, 09:22 AM   #188
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I'm one of those shooters who would benefit greatly from a Full Frame Pentax. I have a slew of screwmount & K-mount manual focus prime lenses, with which I shoot exclusively. It would be nice to be able to use my lenses as intended, my 24mm, for example, actually capturing a 24mm view. As it stands now, I'm sorely lacking a decent classic wide angle manual lens.

05-14-2009, 09:39 AM   #189
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I would like a FF camera for:

DoF/Field of View
ISO capabilites
Bigger/brighter viewfinder

Do I need one? Nah. Would it be nice? Of course...
05-14-2009, 09:40 AM   #190
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QuoteOriginally posted by nosnoop Quote
But current implementation is pretty poor actually.
Here are some video features which will be phased in for successive model upgrades (some already in GH1):
Contrast AF during movie mode
1080/30p -> 60i/60p
Stereo or 5.1 mic
Reduced CMOS wobble
Will we see a return of power zoom for movie?
Dedicated Video lens
Higher bitrate for higher quality encoding
... etc.

They would continue to hype the video capability for some time to come.



As I said, hybrid cameras.
We'll see, I wouldn't bet that APS-C DSLR will be transformed into Video Camera before $1500 affordable FF DSLR will hit the market.
05-14-2009, 09:41 AM   #191
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QuoteOriginally posted by raymeedc Quote
I'm one of those shooters who would benefit greatly from a Full Frame Pentax. I have a slew of screwmount & K-mount manual focus prime lenses, with which I shoot exclusively. It would be nice to be able to use my lenses as intended, my 24mm, for example, actually capturing a 24mm view. As it stands now, I'm sorely lacking a decent classic wide angle manual lens.
none of these work for you?
Pentax Ultra-Wide Prime Lenses
05-14-2009, 12:50 PM   #192
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I would tend to assume that as long as video is *there,* those masses who can be sold one based on being told 'you want video' ...aren't going to make their choices based on matters of degres of quality, anyway.

Fact is, I'm often perplexed by a lot of the talk here, as though it really matters to your photos how *much* marketshare our chosen brand might have. As long as they have *enough* to keep putting what I need in my hands, we're good. If they stop doing that in order to 'compete with Canon' by making nothing but consumer hybrids... I'm not seeing any advantage for us, here. If I want a darn 'video Rebel' or can afford a D700 and a pastle of Nikkors, ...I know where to go.

I'm here for a reason, and it's not a p***ing contest.

I'm sure full-frame will be along eventually. Before I can spend two or three times the going rate for a nice fast short portrait FOV, in fact. If I was in a hurry for the latest and fastest, and wanted/was able to spend an extra grand on just a body or sacrifice the important stuff for video, I could have done that with stuff that's already out there.

I'm just hoping Pentax keeps with making my 'niche' viable. Couldn't care less by how much on some stockbroker's balance.
05-14-2009, 01:27 PM   #193
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ratmagiclady Quote
I would tend to assume that as long as video is *there,* those masses who can be sold one based on being told 'you want video' ...aren't going to make their choices based on matters of degres of quality, anyway.

Fact is, I'm often perplexed by a lot of the talk here, as though it really matters to your photos how *much* marketshare our chosen brand might have. As long as they have *enough* to keep putting what I need in my hands, we're good. If they stop doing that in order to 'compete with Canon' by making nothing but consumer hybrids... I'm not seeing any advantage for us, here. If I want a darn 'video Rebel' or can afford a D700 and a pastle of Nikkors, ...I know where to go.

I'm here for a reason, and it's not a p***ing contest.

I'm sure full-frame will be along eventually. Before I can spend two or three times the going rate for a nice fast short portrait FOV, in fact. If I was in a hurry for the latest and fastest, and wanted/was able to spend an extra grand on just a body or sacrifice the important stuff for video, I could have done that with stuff that's already out there.

I'm just hoping Pentax keeps with making my 'niche' viable. Couldn't care less by how much on some stockbroker's balance.
I agree....
05-14-2009, 01:42 PM   #194
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ratmagiclady Quote
I'm sure full-frame will be along eventually. Before I can spend two or three times the going rate for a nice fast short portrait FOV, in fact. If I was in a hurry for the latest and fastest, and wanted/was able to spend an extra grand on just a body or sacrifice the important stuff for video, I could have done that with stuff that's already out there.

I'm just hoping Pentax keeps with making my 'niche' viable. Couldn't care less by how much on some stockbroker's balance.
Expanding on this, I think the K-7 release is just about perfect for my purposes. Assuming I buy the K-7 this year and Pentax comes out with a full frame in the next two years, I won't mind waiting an addition a year to let it drop down to the affordable range. That would be about a three to four year period, and I'm hoping I can take a lot of pictures in that interim time

I personally know a few professional photographers looking to start out who are already taking this approach with the Nikon D700 and Canon 5D Mark II -- waiting about a year for these models to become affordable. I think it also explains the ongoing popularity of the Canon 5D -- it sits well in a niche for the performance it delivers. If I was going to switch brands to go full frame, I would be much more likely to buy a 5D than say a new Sony A900 for $1,000 more dollars.
05-14-2009, 02:17 PM   #195
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ratmagiclady Quote
Fact is, I'm often perplexed by a lot of the talk here, as though it really matters to your photos how *much* marketshare our chosen brand might have. As long as they have *enough* to keep putting what I need in my hands, we're good. ....
I'm just hoping Pentax keeps with making my 'niche' viable. Couldn't care less by how much on some stockbroker's balance.
But that's the thing. How long Pentax could survive would not be decided by what we think; instead, it will be decided by Hoya's board of directors and stock holders, and their expectations of profitability and market share.

So yes, in a way, the market share is important to how we will take our photos in the future.
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