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View Poll Results: Will Pentax Succeed with the New K-7 and Strategy?
Yes 19592.86%
No 157.14%
Voters: 210. You may not vote on this poll

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05-10-2009, 07:21 PM   #46
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Roland, you're right. :-)

Yes, Roland.

Last weekend I went to hiking and I did usually find that my 5D with 24-105L is just a little bit too heavy for hiking and biking. And, the body is susceptible to raining too and its no good when weather is not so predictable here in Summer in Hongkong.

Another fortunate thing was I brought a FAJ 18-35 as my ultra wide (fixed at 19mm on Full Frame) instead of a 17-40L which would otherwise mean another 500g+! :-(

Unless one wants a lot of weigh for doing gymnastics while hiking, I think a semi-pro but *compact* calibrator DSLR will surely be a good thing! ;-) And, especially considering that it is fully weather sealed for the compact kit, as a package.

QuoteOriginally posted by RMabo Quote
With the K-7, Pentax has tried to make something *unique*.
A compact weather sealed semi pro / pro hybrid DSLR with fast AF, fast continous shooting, video, in a light and rugged and very compact body with professional user interface, to appeal to outdoor photographers and street photographers that wants something small, light with fantastic image quality.

The 24x36 competition is too big, even the 4/3 competition (Olympus E-3) is too big.
Will Pentax survive? I say they have a better chance to survive by going their own path instead of joining Nikon and Canon. And as we have seen, the Sony A900 has failed to make an impact on the market. Why buy a Sony when you can buy a Nikon or Canon?
One needs to be *different*. If you offer the same thing as Canon and Nikon, why buy the copy instead of the original? Sony has tried to be the copy, and they have not - so far - suceeded with their 24x36 offering.

I feel positive about the move Pentax makes, and I believe what they do know is their only chance to survive. If they release "just another 24x36", they would be doomed.


05-10-2009, 07:47 PM   #47
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QuoteOriginally posted by Samsungian Quote
$400 installed for a replacement full frame 12mp sensor. If you ask me, these full frame replacement sensors are not alot of money & installed.

Now if I foolishly choose to send 5D to Canon via my favorite local repair shop they quoted me $775. So they get a $375 handling fee to cover shipping to Canon Repair in NJ or Canon Repair in California. I haven't had a problem yet, just one of the many questions I asked prior to buying into eos system.

$400 for a Canon made replacement 12mp full frame sensor installed...

I wonder how much Pentax charges for a K20D replacement aps-c 15mp sensor? Anyone know?
Well maybe they don't fail.. just kidding. Anyways Pentax authorized repair charged me over $300 to replace a sensor and replace a small piston lift in the flash. This was a few years ago....... $400 MAY be cost to Canon and labor thrown in gratis, but not to others..... An APS-c sensor wholesale runs $30-$40.....
Pentax prefers (and probably has to) make money on repairs, Canon can (and historically has) given a lot for free...
Your story proves little...
05-10-2009, 07:54 PM   #48
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Not another full frame thread...

anyway, I'm interested in a Pentax FF DSLR and will purchase one when it is available.

(I know Pentax reads these forums and want my voice heard.)

Last edited by Angevinn; 05-10-2009 at 08:09 PM.
05-10-2009, 08:19 PM   #49
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QuoteOriginally posted by whatever7 Quote
I already predicted that Pentax will announce a FF body in 2010 fotokina. It's more and more likely the closer we get to it.
Here's my prediction: the chance of Pentax producing a FF body within the next two years is practically 0%. In fact, I am almost willing to bet that it would not ever happen, though I have learned never to use the word "never"...

Actually, the key to Pentax survival would be the hybrid camera, which I predict will take over the entry level DSLR market within the next 3 years. If Pentax has not joined Samsung NX system, they would have to come up with their own somehow.

FF will always be the niche market. Yes, even with the might of Nikon and Canon, they could hardly muster more than a lowly single digit market share. With the traditional Nikon/Canon : Pentax sales ratio, a Pentax FF sales would be abysmal; hardly enough volume to support a new lens line. Just see what happens to Sony; at least they do not need a whole new lens lineup for a single model.

On the contrary, blindly entering the FF market could actually threaten the survival of Pentax, as Pentax could not take a huge flop like Sony A900 + whole new lineup of FF lenses.

05-10-2009, 08:37 PM   #50
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QuoteOriginally posted by creampuff Quote

While RH has had his share of controversy, I personally don't think this thread is anymore controversial or stupid as started by some others.
It isn't the actual poll question so much - that's pretty innocent and straightforward, assuming anyone can really know the Pentax strategy.

It's the follow-on discussion

QuoteOriginally posted by RiceHigh Quote
I know Pentax is still unable to make a Full Frame body at this moment, nor they are willing to bear the risk.

So, now they go in another way to compete - make a high grade body with most updated features, the best possible ergonomics and compactness as well as with highest possible build quality, so that it makes itself an unique product with all those valuable differentiating characteristics in the current market. But, it is still an APS-C DSLR afterall!

So and so, what do you think if this would succeed? Image quality wise, I still not believing that any APS-C can beat those of the current Full Frame lines. And price wise, the price difference is not very big. Say, if you pay just a little bit more, even one can get the old Full Frame Canon 5D MkI which can still be bought brand new in the market for the time being. And then for a little bit more, the popular Nikon D700 is there!

All in all, Do you think that Pentax can win in the game and competition? Or, just to continue their life in the DSLR battle field with the new K-7??
The entire FF argument is a straw man, set up and knocked down for (to me) inexplicable reasons.

  • Why say Pentax is "still unable" to make a FF camera - do we know that? Do we know whether they ever tried? Do we kow whether they intend to try?
  • Why say they are going in "another way" to compete, as if they failed at competing in the FF market? Have they changed direction? Tell us how you actually KNOW that.
  • Why say "Still an APS-c, after all" when such a huge percentage of digital cameras are crop sensor? Do we know whether Pentax has any pretensions to attack the full professional market?
  • Why say the "price difference is not very big" when comparing a newly to-be released body whose spec.'s are not even known to a trailing edge FF Canon? (also, better to quote real prices than to assert as a fact something not defined).
  • Why even begin to compare K-7 to a D700 - they are completely different market segments?
To use the Subaru analogy, do Subaru owners wring their hands because WRX STi isn't a true competitor for the BMW M3?

No, the people who want them just buy and drive the cars

Maybe I should cut RH a break, but I can't see any reason for this thread other than to stimulate controversy.

For a long time I had RH blocked just so I would stay out of the threads. Two weeks ago I relented - even Ned gives him some credit - so I unblocked him.

I should block him again for my own sanity.
05-10-2009, 08:48 PM   #51
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
It isn't the actual poll question so much - that's pretty innocent and straightforward, assuming anyone can really know the Pentax strategy.

It's the follow-on discussion



The entire FF argument is a straw man, set up and knocked down for (to me) inexplicable reasons.

  • Why say Pentax is "still unable" to make a FF camera - do we know that? Do we know whether they ever tried? Do we kow whether they intend to try?
  • Why say they are going in "another way" to compete, as if they failed at competing in the FF market? Have they changed direction? Tell us how you actually KNOW that.
  • Why say "Still an APS-c, after all" when such a huge percentage of digital cameras are crop sensor? Do we know whether Pentax has any pretensions to attack the full professional market?
  • Why say the "price difference is not very big" when comparing a newly to-be released body whose spec.'s are not even known to a trailing edge FF Canon? (also, better to quote real prices than to assert as a fact something not defined).
  • Why even begin to compare K-7 to a D700 - they are completely different market segments?
To use the Subaru analogy, do Subaru owners wring their hands because WRX STi isn't a true competitor for the BMW M3?

No, the people who want them just buy and drive the cars

Maybe I should cut RH a break, but I can't see any reason for this thread other than to stimulate controversy.

For a long time I had RH blocked just so I would stay out of the threads. Two weeks ago I relented - even Ned gives him some credit - so I unblocked him.

I should block him again for my own sanity.
Careful, you'll be accused of fanboyism...and unfair attacks on our favorite fair weather friend of Pentax. Feel free to block him again...
It's his typical baiting style and assumptions listed as "known facts" that is,was and always will be frustrating.......
Welcome back
05-10-2009, 09:10 PM   #52
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it would be nice to see how does the shares split with the professional market

journalists
nature
fashion
weddings
and so on

The Canon XXXD is a phenomenal and a great success. FF or not it is one of a kind in history.
This camera prety much made digital photography what it is today

Last edited by redpigeons; 05-10-2009 at 09:17 PM.
05-10-2009, 09:44 PM   #53
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QuoteOriginally posted by Dom Quote
Just out of curiosity, where do you see the K20D in comparison to Canon and Nikon?

In my opinion it's far superior to the EOS 5D Mk II and the Nikon D3, image quality wise. And the build quality isn't shabby either.
Far better? I hope you don't mean the high ISO performance. IMHO, EOS 5D II and D3 are much better cameras. They are also much more expensive cameras.

05-11-2009, 12:43 AM   #54
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
[*]Why say Pentax is "still unable" to make a FF camera - do we know that? Do we know whether they ever tried? Do we kow whether they intend to try?
"Ask yourself what lenses are you planning to use on this hypothetical new full frame body?" - Ned Bunnell

QuoteQuote:
[*]Why say they are going in "another way" to compete, as if they failed at competing in the FF market? Have they changed direction? Tell us how you actually KNOW that.
Hoya and Pentax officials told that, in this PMA and the last Photokina.

QuoteQuote:
[*]Why say "Still an APS-c, after all" when such a huge percentage of digital cameras are crop sensor? Do we know whether Pentax has any pretensions to attack the full professional market?
Every "large" brand has Full Frame DSLR models - Canon, Nikon and Sony. Even Olympus once advertised much that their 4/3 system is a full frame one! (misleading enough? Yes, it is but the sensor size is only 1/4th!)

So, if Pentax wants to climb up in the market, they have to do something different in order to compete, if they do not have the Full Frame symbol and technologies.

QuoteQuote:
[*]Why say the "price difference is not very big" when comparing a newly to-be released body whose spec.'s are not even known to a trailing edge FF Canon? (also, better to quote real prices than to assert as a fact something not defined).
The estimated street price according to some sources is $1500, which is not too far from a brand new FF Canon 5D Mk1.

QuoteQuote:
[*]Why even begin to compare K-7 to a D700 - they are completely different market segments?
No. Do not eliminate the possibility of any conflict of interest for any products. People have limited resources and have priorities over the things they want to buy. If they buy one thing then they would not buy another.

Originally, I just wanted to buy a Canon 500D. But since the "outbreak" of the K-7, I withheld my purchase plan and waited for the K-7 now.

QuoteQuote:
Maybe I should cut RH a break, but I can't see any reason for this thread other than to stimulate controversy.
Nope. You or some other guys like you should take a break yourself! I care not much about your (over-)reactions actually. Sometimes I replied. But most of the time, I chose to just *ignore*.

QuoteQuote:
For a long time I had RH blocked just so I would stay out of the threads. Two weeks ago I relented - even Ned gives him some credit - so I unblocked him.
Do you always listen to what Ned said? So, Ned will surely tell the world we all Pentaxians should buy the latest best stuff from Pentax! Go pre-order a K-7 now! ;-D

QuoteQuote:
I should block him again for my own sanity.
For your own sanity, you should buy something at the medicine shops, but not relying on any function here! :-)
05-11-2009, 01:31 AM   #55
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I think for this thread: Si tacuisses, philosophus mansisses
Here we go. History repeating itself. It's the same constellation: expecting a company to bring a single special product, one has "found out" and is sure to be the only way to salvation, else they are "doomed", for sure.
Not beeing emotionally involved it might be amusing to see so much personal passion in these things from a person. Having highest hope for a new cameramodel and investing a lot of time in collecting every tiny bit on the net is the one side, but this enthusiasm will come to a cost, at least if we have learned something from the Mz-1 story and the disappointment and bitterness in some blog and postings over years. Please, don't let this happen again, my advice, take care, and remember that this is about a photographic company which will have to take decisions you don't have the slightest insight in and which can seriously damage your selfcreated image of it.

I enjoyed reading this anticipation for the new camera here and on the blog, please don't spoil it by falling in old habits.
05-11-2009, 02:14 AM   #56
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QuoteOriginally posted by RiceHigh Quote
I think a semi-pro but *compact* calibrator DSLR will surely be a good thing! ;-)
What is a calibrator DSLR ?
05-11-2009, 02:22 AM   #57
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QuoteOriginally posted by falconeye Quote
What is a calibrator DSLR ?
Typo! You guess yourself for the correct word!
05-11-2009, 03:44 AM   #58
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QuoteOriginally posted by RiceHigh Quote
This is silly. I voted it too!

I made the poll public, so go view yourself!

You didn't answer my question.
05-11-2009, 03:53 AM   #59
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calibrator DSLR

"calibrator DSLR ..."
QuoteOriginally posted by RiceHigh Quote
Typo! You guess yourself for the correct word!
I cannot guess. I am still blind because calibrator goes so well with measurbator
05-11-2009, 04:34 AM   #60
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QuoteOriginally posted by falconeye Quote
"calibrator DSLR ..."


I cannot guess. I am still blind because calibrator goes so well with measurbator
Yes, a measurbator types too much for the word calibrator so that I could not type the right word which I originally meant!
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