Originally posted by Lowell Goudge I agree, if we use the car industry as an example, it was the big companies that died.
Also we need to note that Chrysler (and American motors which they bought from Renault) have been dying for years. The failed merger/buyout by daimler is another example, and note this is the second bail out of Chrysler the first was in the early 1980's, let's not forget that!
Also, it was well known almost 20 years ago that GM would ultimately fail due to the burden of the pension plan and health care benefits.
They and the unions have only themselves to blaim for not addressing the situation long ago. Some companies recoginzed over 50 years ago that a 100% company funded pention was not the way to go and got out of it, so in that respect the auto companies and auto unions are 50 years behind the times.
the bottom line is that while the auto industry might make for some interesting comparisons, they brought this on themselves.
this is very interesting, can you substantiate that/explain further?
what i don't understand is to what extent wages payed (including social security contribution and so on) can affect an efficient (profitable) company? a general rule of thumb is that every employee (on average ofcourse) will produce about 10x as much for his employer than what he is payed, this means that 10% more or less (or even 100%) in wages will make little difference to the health of the company, _all else being equal_, and keep in mind all else is not equal in general: if you treat your employees better, they won't want to leave, they will be happier and work harder, you will lose less money (less attrition, smaller costs for training and so on), and perhaps even become more efficient due to your employees being loyal. and round and round it goes (of course, it's not as simple, but if done right, it can work that way). however, if you are unable, unwilling, or simply not motivated to put competitive products on the market, which people will _buy_, which people can use -- and not find unreliable, built terribly, or whatever --, you might have a bit of a problem surviving.
at first glance, you are right: they did it to themselves, but in a much more direct way, they ignored their competition, and their customers, and they got bitten from both sides. the fact that they did it before (and survived to do it again, on "your" money, as it happens) is, frankly, sickening. am i missing something? :/