5 New Lenses of Pentax? Full Frame Back??

mattdm · 05-27-2009, 02:17 PM

Originally posted by RMabo

One idea was to have a 3 focals in one lens, so not really a zoom the classic way. I believe there used to be a Leica with this idea some years back...).

Leica 16-18-21mm f/4 Tri-Elmar Field Report

nulla · 05-27-2009, 04:41 PM

JCPentax's answer to the hoax or not

Quote:

4) While the timeline in the post looks "offocial" I suspect it is a fake. We have not seen any updated lens roadmap and when they distribute this type of thing is comes to all countries. I know everyone in the marketing department in Japan that puts these together and none of them would leak this.

As far as availability on the K-7 and the two new WR lenses, we are looking at early to mid-July.

I would support and take this persons word over yours RiceHigh.

Votesh · 05-27-2009, 07:25 PM

Originally posted by RiceHigh

Any proof for the non-existence of ghost, UFO, etc.? LOL..

In these cases the burden of proof is not on the non-believer, it is on the believer. The non-believer has nothing to prove because their belief is that the thing in question doesn't exist. If all evidence points to that conclusion their non-belief is supported(notice I didn't say proven). However, if the believers were in fact in the right all they would have to do would be to provide one indisputable piece of evidence of the existence of whatever it is they believe in, and it would show their belief to be valid. The reason such things are never disproven is because there is no way to do so. However, proving such a thing is possible, and the lack of proof speaks volumes.

So, instead of relying on the lack of disproof, how about you provide some proof that these lenses are real, and quit just trying to tell people that the lack of disproof is as good as proof.

RiceHigh · 05-28-2009, 12:00 AM

Originally posted by Sean Nelson

What it proves is that "it looks real" doesn't mean it's real. Here's a fake I made by taking a piece of the March 24, 2009 roadmap as a starting point:

It took just a few minutes to do this - it's a lot easier manipulating text than a photo of a new lens or camera. This image is a helluva lot sharper than the blurry ones on your site, so if THIS looks real then you've got ABSOLUTELY NO WAY to judge whether the picture on your site is real or not.

...and the pictures on your site even hide the lens image. I just pasted another image of the DA645 lens, but I suspect whoever came up with the image posted on your site figured it was too much effort to make up a new image so that it wasn't an obvious fake...

I CAN see yours is fake easily, you'd better figure out whats wrong with your edit! :-)

Philippos · 05-28-2009, 09:05 AM

Originally posted by Sean Nelson

What it proves is that "it looks real" doesn't mean it's real. Here's a fake I made by taking a piece of the March 24, 2009 roadmap as a starting point:

It took just a few minutes to do this...

No offence here Sean, you should have taken a few minutes more. It looks totally likely a "monkey".

eurostar · 05-28-2009, 09:23 AM

Originally posted by pgenovese

Hmmm Photokina may reserve some surprises........... Unless all is leaked before :-)

But Photokina is in 2010, not this year...

jeffkrol · 05-28-2009, 10:13 AM

Originally posted by RiceHigh

I CAN see yours is fake easily, you'd better figure out whats wrong with your edit! :-)

Usual avoidance of the facts............

nulla · 05-28-2009, 10:33 AM

RiceHigh

what is your view on JCPentax's comment on the fake or no fake?

Neil

jeffkrol · 05-28-2009, 02:19 PM

Originally posted by nulla

RiceHigh

what is your view on JCPentax's comment on the fake or no fake?

Neil

You really weren't expecting an an answer were you?????

nulla · 05-28-2009, 06:09 PM

Originally posted by jeffkrol

You really weren't expecting an an answer were you?????

Not really

Neil

RiceHigh · 05-28-2009, 06:25 PM

Originally posted by nulla

RiceHigh

what is your view on JCPentax's comment on the fake or no fake?

Neil

Someone has also posted the same remark at my blog, I've responded for his comment overthere:-

"First, there is NO "timeline" shown in the "leak".

Second, he only "*suspects* it is a fake" and he "knows that no one in the marketing department would leak", which is a super general statement which is always true! WHO, as a Hoya/Pentax staff, would and should leak anything of the company, especially when it is meant to be confidential?

So, how "worth" it is? And, what does it tell?"

RiceHigh's Pentax Blog: New Lens Roadmap Revamped? (5 New Lenses? Leak?)

RiceHigh · 05-28-2009, 06:26 PM

Originally posted by Philippos

No offence here Sean, you should have taken a few minutes more. It looks totally likely a "monkey".

Putting aside the lens image which is "fingered" anyway, there is an obvious flaw for Sean's picture! Anyone can see that? :-)

(So, that's what I have been pointing out, usually people can find flaws for a hoax, very quickly - but up till now I cannot see a convincing evidence that proves that one is a hoax - which is not easy unless the person who "plays" is very clever and careful minded!)

jeffkrol · 05-28-2009, 06:46 PM

Originally posted by RiceHigh

Someone has also posted the same remark at my blog, I've responded for his comment overthere:-

"First, there is NO "timeline" shown in the "leak".

Second, he only "*suspects* it is a fake" and he "knows that no one in the marketing department would leak", which is a super general statement which is always true! WHO, as a Hoya/Pentax staff, would and should leak anything of the company, especially when it is meant to be confidential?

So, how "worth" it is? And, what does it tell?"

RiceHigh's Pentax Blog: New Lens Roadmap Revamped? (5 New Lenses? Leak?)

It tells the same thing, maybe real maybe not... some (like me) think an f1 is a crazy pipe dream and even Pentax couldn't pull a quality/pricing miracle.
Pentax really has never tried to beat Nikon/Canon head on so again unlikely.
EDIT: Just noticed the text on the bottom looks to be in English. I would not expect that if this was indeed a "working copy". Why not in japanese first. Translate later....
Why is everything you find "worth it" but everything everyone else finds is "worthless"? Technically that's a bit insulting but 2 can play the game.
I find you quite humorous in this regard.
Shadow puppeteering on a computer monitor is valid info while a Pentax rep isn't.

Now to be fair I'll make up some probability of say
5% for you ... 95% against based on Mr. Pentax, common sense, and if it was a REAL Pentax chart it could just be a "placeholder". Could well have said D-FA 50 f/$.&
If the 5% does indeed win I predict 99% it will be for some "limited/anniversary/cosmic alignment" model.

Wonder who posted that at your blog......

mattdm · 05-28-2009, 07:02 PM

Originally posted by RiceHigh

Putting aside the lens image which is "fingered" anyway, there is an obvious flaw for Sean's picture! Anyone can see that? :-)

Okay, so, I'll bite. What are you talking about? I mean other than the word "Fake!" in the image.

Originally posted by RiceHigh

(So, that's what I have been pointing out, usually people can find flaws for a hoax, very quickly - but up till now I cannot see a convincing evidence that proves that one is a hoax - which is not easy unless the person who "plays" is very clever and careful minded!)

But there is convincing evidence: it alleges a nonsensical fantasy lineup.

RiceHigh · 05-28-2009, 07:05 PM

Originally posted by mattdm

Okay, so, I'll bite. What are you talking about? I mean other than the word "Fake!" in the image.

Of course not about the "Fake!" word!!

Hint: It can be easily seen.. w/ a more careful mind! :-)

Quote:

But there is convincing evidence: it alleges a nonsensical fantasy lineup.

Don't believe too much on what a sales rep talks. They usually make statements that are too general or they have something to hide to protect their own interests.

05-27-2009, 02:17 PM	#136
mattdm Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Boston, MA Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,948	okay, i'm done. let's go off-topic. :) Originally posted by RMabo One idea was to have a 3 focals in one lens, so not really a zoom the classic way. I believe there used to be a Leica with this idea some years back...). Leica 16-18-21mm f/4 Tri-Elmar Field Report

05-28-2009, 06:25 PM	#146
RiceHigh Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Hong Kong Posts: 1,934 Original Poster	My View Originally posted by nulla RiceHigh what is your view on JCPentax's comment on the fake or no fake? Neil Someone has also posted the same remark at my blog, I've responded for his comment overthere:- "First, there is NO "timeline" shown in the "leak". Second, he only "suspects it is a fake" and he "knows that no one in the marketing department would leak", which is a super general statement which is always true! WHO, as a Hoya/Pentax staff, would and should leak anything of the company, especially when it is meant to be confidential? So, how "worth" it is? And, what does it tell?" RiceHigh's Pentax Blog: New Lens Roadmap Revamped? (5 New Lenses? Leak?)

05-28-2009, 06:46 PM	#148
jeffkrol Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Wisconsin USA Photos: Gallery Posts: 8,434	Originally posted by RiceHigh Someone has also posted the same remark at my blog, I've responded for his comment overthere:- "First, there is NO "timeline" shown in the "leak". Second, he only "suspects it is a fake" and he "knows that no one in the marketing department would leak", which is a super general statement which is always true! WHO, as a Hoya/Pentax staff, would and should leak anything of the company, especially when it is meant to be confidential? So, how "worth" it is? And, what does it tell?" RiceHigh's Pentax Blog: New Lens Roadmap Revamped? (5 New Lenses? Leak?) It tells the same thing, maybe real maybe not... some (like me) think an f1 is a crazy pipe dream and even Pentax couldn't pull a quality/pricing miracle. Pentax really has never tried to beat Nikon/Canon head on so again unlikely. EDIT: Just noticed the text on the bottom looks to be in English. I would not expect that if this was indeed a "working copy". Why not in japanese first. Translate later.... Why is everything you find "worth it" but everything everyone else finds is "worthless"? Technically that's a bit insulting but 2 can play the game. I find you quite humorous in this regard. Shadow puppeteering on a computer monitor is valid info while a Pentax rep isn't. Now to be fair I'll make up some probability of say 5% for you ... 95% against based on Mr. Pentax, common sense, and if it was a REAL Pentax chart it could just be a "placeholder". Could well have said D-FA 50 f/$.& If the 5% does indeed win I predict 99% it will be for some "limited/anniversary/cosmic alignment" model. Wonder who posted that at your blog...... Last edited by jeffkrol; 05-28-2009 at 06:56 PM.

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05-27-2009, 04:41 PM	#137
nulla Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Melbourne Australia Posts: 1,560	JCPentax's answer to the hoax or not Quote: 4) While the timeline in the post looks "offocial" I suspect it is a fake. We have not seen any updated lens roadmap and when they distribute this type of thing is comes to all countries. I know everyone in the marketing department in Japan that puts these together and none of them would leak this. As far as availability on the K-7 and the two new WR lenses, we are looking at early to mid-July. I would support and take this persons word over yours RiceHigh.

05-27-2009, 07:25 PM	#138
Votesh Inactive Account Join Date: Apr 2008 Photos: Gallery Posts: 817	Originally posted by RiceHigh Any proof for the non-existence of ghost, UFO, etc.? LOL.. In these cases the burden of proof is not on the non-believer, it is on the believer. The non-believer has nothing to prove because their belief is that the thing in question doesn't exist. If all evidence points to that conclusion their non-belief is supported(notice I didn't say proven). However, if the believers were in fact in the right all they would have to do would be to provide one indisputable piece of evidence of the existence of whatever it is they believe in, and it would show their belief to be valid. The reason such things are never disproven is because there is no way to do so. However, proving such a thing is possible, and the lack of proof speaks volumes. So, instead of relying on the lack of disproof, how about you provide some proof that these lenses are real, and quit just trying to tell people that the lack of disproof is as good as proof.

05-28-2009, 12:00 AM	#139
RiceHigh Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Hong Kong Posts: 1,934 Original Poster	Originally posted by Sean Nelson What it proves is that "it looks real" *doesn't mean it's real*. Here's a fake I made by taking a piece of the March 24, 2009 roadmap as a starting point: It took just a few minutes to do this - it's a lot easier manipulating text than a photo of a new lens or camera. This image is a helluva lot sharper than the blurry ones on your site, so if THIS looks real then you've got ABSOLUTELY NO WAY to judge whether the picture on your site is real or not. ...and the pictures on your site even hide the lens image. I just pasted another image of the DA645 lens, but I suspect whoever came up with the image posted on your site figured it was too much effort to make up a new image so that it wasn't an obvious fake... I CAN see yours is fake easily, you'd better figure out whats wrong with your edit! :-)

05-28-2009, 09:05 AM	#140
Philippos Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Volos - Greece Posts: 178	Originally posted by Sean Nelson What it proves is that "it looks real" *doesn't mean it's real*. Here's a fake I made by taking a piece of the March 24, 2009 roadmap as a starting point: It took just a few minutes to do this... No offence here Sean, you should have taken a few minutes more. It looks totally likely a "monkey".

05-28-2009, 09:23 AM	#141
eurostar Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Albareto, Italy Photos: Gallery Posts: 819	Originally posted by pgenovese Hmmm Photokina may reserve some surprises........... Unless all is leaked before :-) But Photokina is in 2010, not this year...

05-28-2009, 10:13 AM	#142
jeffkrol Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Wisconsin USA Photos: Gallery Posts: 8,434	Originally posted by RiceHigh I CAN see yours is fake easily, you'd better figure out whats wrong with your edit! :-) Usual avoidance of the facts............

05-28-2009, 10:33 AM	#143
nulla Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Melbourne Australia Posts: 1,560	RiceHigh what is your view on JCPentax's comment on the fake or no fake? Neil

05-28-2009, 02:19 PM	#144
jeffkrol Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Wisconsin USA Photos: Gallery Posts: 8,434	Originally posted by nulla RiceHigh what is your view on JCPentax's comment on the fake or no fake? Neil You really weren't expecting an an answer were you?????

05-28-2009, 06:09 PM	#145
nulla Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Melbourne Australia Posts: 1,560	Originally posted by jeffkrol You really weren't expecting an an answer were you????? Not really Neil

05-28-2009, 06:26 PM	#147
RiceHigh Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Hong Kong Posts: 1,934 Original Poster	Originally posted by Philippos No offence here Sean, you should have taken a few minutes more. It looks totally likely a "monkey". Putting aside the lens image which is "fingered" anyway, there is an obvious flaw for Sean's picture! Anyone can see that? :-) (So, that's what I have been pointing out, usually people can find flaws for a hoax, very quickly - but up till now I cannot see a convincing evidence that proves that one is a hoax - which is not easy unless the person who "plays" is very clever and careful minded!)

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05-28-2009, 07:02 PM	#149
mattdm Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Boston, MA Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,948	Originally posted by RiceHigh Putting aside the lens image which is "fingered" anyway, there is an obvious flaw for Sean's picture! Anyone can see that? :-) Okay, so, I'll bite. What are you talking about? I mean other than the word "Fake!" in the image. Originally posted by RiceHigh (So, that's what I have been pointing out, usually people can find flaws for a hoax, very quickly - but up till now I cannot see a convincing evidence that proves that one is a hoax - which is not easy unless the person who "plays" is very clever and careful minded!) But there is convincing evidence: it alleges a nonsensical fantasy lineup.

05-28-2009, 07:05 PM	#150
RiceHigh Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Hong Kong Posts: 1,934 Original Poster	Originally posted by mattdm Okay, so, I'll bite. What are you talking about? I mean other than the word "Fake!" in the image. Of course not about the "Fake!" word!! Hint: It can be easily seen.. w/ a more careful mind! :-) Quote: But there is convincing evidence: it alleges a nonsensical fantasy lineup. Don't believe too much on what a sales rep talks. They usually make statements that are too general or they have something to hide to protect their own interests.