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08-21-2009, 04:46 PM   #16
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QuoteOriginally posted by X Man Quote
Yes, the deal was good for Apple. No doubt about it. However, it was not a "bailout" or a "rescue". It was a settlement of lawsuits.

Besides, the quote on the Time cover, doesn't match the version of the quote inside the magazine.

"Thank you for your support of this company. I think the world's a better place for it."
STEVE'S JOB: RESTART APPLE - TIME

I think that's different. I think that "If it bleeds, it leads...." Pinning the "Saving" tag on Job's quote after cutting the quote up in the first place is sensationalism. Pure and simple.

$150 Million dollars would no more have "saved" the Pontiac division of GM. It was a token amount and not a gift or loan.

Regards,
Mike
Jobs and Gates have had their moments. As far as the $150 M goes, it increased their cash on hand by 12.5% which is significant. How much did Hoya purchase Pentax for? (That is somewhat a rhetorical question).

To be frank, I don't like either company that well due to the strangle hold. I used to have a spoof operating system around here somewhere titled "WinBlown 2000." That thing was funny. Even the box was a spoof and funny.

08-21-2009, 05:09 PM   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by KungPOW Quote
Hurray Apple!

now lets talk about Subaru!
Yeah. They're much more fun to drive since they don't tell you where to go and how to get there.
08-21-2009, 05:12 PM   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
Yeah. They're much more fun to drive since they don't tell you where to go and how to get there.
....that's what a wife is for...
08-21-2009, 05:14 PM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by KungPOW Quote
Hurray Apple!

now lets talk about Subaru!
Well, what can I say? The original premise of the thread sucked.

Regards,
Mike

08-22-2009, 09:55 AM   #20
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QuoteOriginally posted by KungPOW Quote
Hurray Apple!

now lets talk about Subaru!
QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
Yeah. They're much more fun to drive since they don't tell you where to go and how to get there.
QuoteOriginally posted by KungPOW Quote
....that's what a wife is for...
Maybe that's why mine drives the Subaru.
08-22-2009, 10:23 AM   #21
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QuoteOriginally posted by X Man Quote
Microsoft did not pull Apple out of the hole. Steve Jobs did.
You are correct, but I wonder what would happen to Apple if there was no Steve Jobs.
08-22-2009, 10:34 AM   #22
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote

Originally Posted by KungPOW
....that's what a wife is for...

-------------

Maybe that's why mine drives the Subaru.
You're wife is a lesbian?

Well, I suppose that might be interesting if she's open minded...
08-22-2009, 11:34 AM   #23
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QuoteOriginally posted by MikePerham Quote
You are correct, but I wonder what would happen to Apple if there was no Steve Jobs.
Now? Panic and then business as usual. While Jobs is the face of Apple, I think the foundation and corporate culture is there to carry Apple forward well into the future, even without Jobs.

Then? Oh, that's much more interesting. It would've been ugly I'm afraid. Apple may have survived, but they most certainly would not have thrived as they did since Job's return.

Jonathan Ive [hardware designer] was there in 1996 but it was just before Jobs returned and it was probably Jobs who hired him. Jobs had that Next OS, Mach Micro-Kernel. So, no Jobs, no OS X? No OS X, no good for Apple. Every single facet of Apple's resurgence from 1998 to now is directly attributable to Steve Jobs.

I think personally that Apple would've failed if not for Job's return.

Regards,
Mike

08-22-2009, 04:55 PM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by X Man Quote
Now? Panic and then business as usual. While Jobs is the face of Apple, I think the foundation and corporate culture is there to carry Apple forward well into the future, even without Jobs.
Probably not.

There are visionary people. And there are people with power. Very rarely only you will find a visionary guy in power.

Empowered people normally are afraid of visionary people and disbelief them at best, or chase them at worst, not support them. Visionary people have to found their own company and then fight against a crowd of power-hungry persons to survive and succeed. Jobs had to do it twice, actually ...

Power-hungry persons think in terms of shareholder value, merger and aquisitions, and cost cutting. Visionary people just "know" how a great product looks like in ten years time. As the term "visionary" suggests, a visionary person can "see" where others are blind.

The problem is that normal people cannot tell visionary and utopian apart. Utopians dream and shouldn't be followed, visionary should.

No way Apple will continue to be the company it was once Jobs has left it. Becoming blind affects everybody, Apple included.

Last edited by falconeye; 08-22-2009 at 05:02 PM.
08-22-2009, 05:23 PM   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by falconeye Quote

No way Apple will continue to be the company it was once Jobs has left it. Becoming blind affects everybody, Apple included.
Maybe, but the reality is that Jobs' impact on product design over the last few years is somewhat overstated by the popular media. He isn't an idiot, and wants Apple to continue after he leaves. As such he has created a team and infrastructure that allows forward movement even when Jobs isn't at the "helm." He isn't the only person with "vision" in the company.
08-22-2009, 07:08 PM   #26
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Ok, since I jokingly inserted Apple into this discussion, I guess that it's my responsibility to try to drag them out (and Subaru too) and (try to) bring this back on topic. Or is this thread too far gone?

Are there any visionaries @ Pentax? Are there any visionaries at the other camera manufacturers? What is their vision?

Consider, for example, Cosina. Cosina's president, Mr. Kobayashi, believes that there is still some life left in 35mm film and has devoted his company to fill that niche. He has made some very shrewd moves to license a heritage brand name (Voigtlander) and build cameras and lenses based on a well-established and well-loved standard - Leica rangefinders. Their modest success over the years has been a delightful surprise - a vision realized.

Last edited by johnmflores; 08-22-2009 at 07:19 PM.
08-22-2009, 07:50 PM   #27
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QuoteOriginally posted by johnmflores Quote

Are there any visionaries @ Pentax? Are there any visionaries at the other camera manufacturers? What is their vision?
Whoever is responsible for the ltd primes is on the right page imho.
08-22-2009, 09:04 PM   #28
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QuoteOriginally posted by falconeye Quote
There are visionary people. And there are people with power. Very rarely only you will find a visionary guy in power.

Empowered people normally are afraid of visionary people and disbelief them at best, or chase them at worst, not support them. Visionary people have to found their own company and then fight against a crowd of power-hungry persons to survive and succeed. Jobs had to do it twice, actually ...

Power-hungry persons think in terms of shareholder value, merger and aquisitions, and cost cutting. Visionary people just "know" how a great product looks like in ten years time. As the term "visionary" suggests, a visionary person can "see" where others are blind.

The problem is that normal people cannot tell visionary and utopian apart. Utopians dream and shouldn't be followed, visionary should.
Interesting perspective.
Also good reads on your latest blog entries
08-23-2009, 04:27 AM   #29
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Didn't Jobs leave once and the company then tanked? He came back and look where they are today. If he leaves or die, their stocks will dive for sure.
08-23-2009, 06:19 AM   #30
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QuoteOriginally posted by johnmflores Quote
Ok, since I jokingly inserted Apple into this discussion, I guess that it's my responsibility to try to drag them out

QuoteOriginally posted by johnmflores Quote
Are there any visionaries @ Pentax? Are there any visionaries at the other camera manufacturers? What is their vision?
Good question. Normally, one knows them by name. But it may be different for a Japanese company. Then again, the visionaries behind PlayStation3, MetalGear and Gran Turismo are all well known.

To me, all current high end digital cameras resemble 20 y.o. SLR too much to have possibly be designed by visionaries.
QuoteOriginally posted by Jonson PL Quote
Interesting perspective.
Also good reads on your latest blog entries

QuoteOriginally posted by Nubi Quote
Didn't Jobs leave once and the company then tanked?
He didn't leave. He was chased out of the company by the power-hungry once they started to disbelieve him. Google for "John Sculley".
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