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01-31-2010, 10:21 AM   #151
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645D with video....

02-01-2010, 02:48 PM   #152
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Looks like the 645D is going to have plenty of competition:

The price for the new Hasselblad H4D-40 is... | Photo Rumors

Hasselblad H4D-40 update | Photo Rumors

First the Leica S2 and now the Hasselblad H4D. Given, the 645D should be quite a bit cheaper than either of those, but I do wonder if Pentax missed the boat by basically adding a digital sensor to their film 645 since both Leica and Hassy are creating medium format systems built from the ground up for digital. It will be interesting to see if MF pros are willing to pay more for the two more "modern systems".

Edit: It looks like the H4D might not be any different then their current cameras, just cheaper. It's a bit confusing because Hassy is billing it as "easy to use entry camera". I guess will see on the 10th.

Last edited by Art Vandelay II; 02-01-2010 at 02:55 PM.
02-01-2010, 03:30 PM   #153
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QuoteOriginally posted by Art Vandelay II Quote
First the Leica S2 and now the Hasselblad H4D. Given, the 645D should be quite a bit cheaper than either of those, but I do wonder if Pentax missed the boat by basically adding a digital sensor to their film 645 since both Leica and Hassy are creating medium format systems built from the ground up for digital. It will be interesting to see if MF pros are willing to pay more for the two more "modern systems"..
Huh?? The pentax 645D is a digital camera from ground up. It is a K-7 with an MF sensor; way ahead of the competition.
02-01-2010, 03:47 PM   #154
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We'll see they messed up with their full frame and now their medium format camera has been delayed for sooo long its almost going to be too late.

I'm really interested to see what's special about it. What sets it apart form the rest minus the price.

Don't get me wrong I love pentax but their not known for their speed as a company.

I'd love a full frame pentax or instead and much more likey some faster primes preferabbly SDM and weathersealed

02-01-2010, 05:26 PM   #155
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QuoteOriginally posted by Pål Jensen Quote
Huh?? The pentax 645D is a digital camera from ground up. It is a K-7 with an MF sensor; way ahead of the competition.
How is it a K-7 with a MF sensor? It looks exactly like a Pentax 645NII with a digital sensor stuffed inside instead of a 120 film back. And I simply meant Leica rethought what a medium format camera should look like with the S2, it looks more like a standard 35mm DSLR with an oversized sensor. I know all of these cameras are just large DSLR's, but Leica's take on medium format is new and different since the S2 doesn't have a big square box on the body where the 120 film used to go. At first glance of photorumors I thought Hassy was doing the same thing with the H4...but now it looks more like they're just retrofitting their old 645 film cameras also.
02-01-2010, 06:41 PM   #156
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QuoteOriginally posted by Art Vandelay II Quote
How is it a K-7 with a MF sensor? It looks exactly like a Pentax 645NII with a digital sensor stuffed inside instead of a 120 film back. .
You can say exactly the same of all DSLR's. Eg. the K-10D looks like a Z-1.
It is only the shape of the 645NII thats retained for the 645D. Everything else is different; even the interface. The 645D shares features and circuitry design with the K-7.
02-02-2010, 02:54 AM   #157
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QuoteOriginally posted by Art Vandelay II Quote
How is it a K-7 with a MF sensor? It looks exactly like a Pentax 645NII with a digital sensor stuffed inside instead of a 120 film back. And I simply meant Leica rethought what a medium format camera should look like with the S2, it looks more like a standard 35mm DSLR with an oversized sensor. I know all of these cameras are just large DSLR's, but Leica's take on medium format is new and different since the S2 doesn't have a big square box on the body where the 120 film used to go. At first glance of photorumors I thought Hassy was doing the same thing with the H4...but now it looks more like they're just retrofitting their old 645 film cameras also.
Though I share some of your thoughts about the Pentax 645, I think, that Hasselblad never intended the H-seris to be a film camera, in the first place. I remember when the H1 was introduced at Photokina and I talked with the H'blad folk, they obviously showed film mags. But it was clear, that this was only meant to be a substitute until the final digibacks for the new system was available. At least with the later H3, H'blad developped a camera that was only built fordigital.

I guess,that digital concept is also part of the Pentax 645. But I am wary, that Pentax is already too late, yet again, with their 645D.

Ben
02-02-2010, 03:39 AM   #158
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QuoteOriginally posted by Pål Jensen Quote
You can say exactly the same of all DSLR's. Eg. the K-10D looks like a Z-1.
It is only the shape of the 645NII thats retained for the 645D. Everything else is different; even the interface. The 645D shares features and circuitry design with the K-7.
Yes, it's as digital as any DSLR could ever be.

02-02-2010, 03:50 AM   #159
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QuoteOriginally posted by Art Vandelay II Quote
Looks like the 645D is going to have plenty of competition:
H4D-40 - 14000 euro (body), 17 000 euro (Kit).
Nothing interesting in specs.

Last edited by ogl; 02-02-2010 at 06:01 AM.
02-02-2010, 05:23 AM   #160
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Looks to me like Pentax is going to be even in specs and cheaper in price, for what that is worth. Should be able to challenge both upper end full frame as well as medium format. I am sure that is their hope, being that the medium format market is so small.
02-02-2010, 06:32 AM   #161
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QuoteOriginally posted by Art Vandelay II Quote
It looks exactly like a Pentax 645NII with a digital sensor stuffed inside instead of a 120 film back. I simply meant Leica rethought what a medium format camera should look like with the S2, it looks more like a standard 35mm DSLR with an oversized sensor.
I think the design is supposed to harken back to the 645 - Pentax's approach of retro styling. If they made a dMF that looked like on oversized SLR, you could say that they're simply using the 67 design and slapping on a digital back...
02-02-2010, 12:27 PM   #162
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Bleh.. I`m getting myself a used 5D mk.1 and submitting it to a mirror surgery.
Just need to get a spare grand.

Get ready to hear back from me lol.
02-02-2010, 01:29 PM   #163
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45.7X35.3 would be pretty sweet.
That's twice as big as 135FF

The Leica S2 is only 50% bigger than 135FF, IIRC.
03-25-2010, 08:46 PM   #164
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QuoteOriginally posted by WerTicus Quote
Does anyone know what the 645d will cost?

They might come in at Canikon's full frame prices, then its a choice for pro's Canikon full frame or a MEDIUM for same money

In a brand name many of them grew up using.
apparently "... $9400 camera (Japan 850,000)!" according to a comment here, toward the end of the page:

Pentax unveils its first medium format DSLR from Adorama Learning Center

if it's not going to cost that 'good' (compared to competition) then it won't sell really but consider this: the competition (Leica S2 / Hasselblad Hx / PhaseOne et al) costs at least twice as much while being "studio-friendly" equipment only with a lot of truly useful and important professional features missing in them even if you do agree to carry the heavy burden of their bulk on your shoulders and into the field. they have omitted such features simply because a studio camera doesn't need them, which is true of course.

however, doing very basic and plain math, given the Pentax 645D rivals the competition at least 4 times in performance and the price is less than half, it's like paying around a mere $500 for this camera!

i know only one thing: me wanteth zat!

and i know yet another thing too: pro foto magz will test this camera, tell you it's great but "simply not professional enough due to color shift or high ISO issues and so on blah blah!" as they have done already with the K-7 (and well then Bob's certainly my uncle too of course?)

i also know of many non-pro people out there who are not even advanced or serious amateur photographers really yet they are "Canonikon" riders no matter what basically because such gear are more expensive and more appropriate to "wear" in a party or a on a vacation in some fancy high class place in the world to show off ...

not for me: i'm the type of pro who does care for quality certainly but considers costs at the same time as well, and that's when Pentax is my beloved auntie! :^)

Last edited by penties rider; 03-25-2010 at 09:03 PM. Reason: typo! + missing info + content
03-25-2010, 09:16 PM   #165
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QuoteOriginally posted by ilya80 Quote
Bleh.. I`m getting myself a used 5D mk.1 and submitting it to a mirror surgery.
Just need to get a spare grand.

Get ready to hear back from me lol.
"Also blindly believing in Pentax FF camera"


yes my good friend but also consider this: according to industry observers' predictions, not so long into the future (a mere 5 years from now!) cell phone sensors will be yielding 50MP images with pro cameras going well beyond the GP (giga pixel) barrier!

now, maybe Pentax will do what you have in mind too, but given a sensor's resolution has to have at least 50% more pixels (in the same size sensor that is, noise issues aside!) to make a truly noticeable change in image quality and clarity, i wouldn't produce and market an FF-size digital sensor camera if i were Pentax. (well, unless for competition purposes alone.)

i'm hoping (guessing too) that Pentax will simply skip that range (as its APS-C size sensor cameras are more than adequate enough already imo) and then just stick with larger size sensors with improvements to be made in pixel size and distribution / color rendition / noise qualities and issues along those lines ...

i believe that's the way all others ought to go otherwise "cell phone photographers" will certainly take over the professional ones, which is a little too scary! (some are already doing that ...)

besides, when will come the day that photographers (videographers too!) will be able to shoot at ISOs above 1600, even 12800, yet get results as fine as those of a 25 ISO Kodachrome color slide film or similar emulsions, even better preferably? (say the quality of the emulsion mentioned albeit on 8" * 10" sheet film! i think such films were even produced for a while in the last century.)

there's also another thing in my mind: if such high resolutions @ such high ISOs capable of yielding the fineness of 'grain' and noiseless results of lower ISOs become available someday (and please note: experts have been at it for nearly two centuries now to make such a dream come true and still not there!) then will even best of the present time lenses be able to match such high definition image sensing on future sensors?

if an when such a day arrives, i'm then also guessing lenses will suffer and will have to be replaced with mirrors at first probably, and then eliminated altogether a while later perhaps with some kind of scanning device to replace optics totally in order to capture the detail that such 'highly sensitive' sensors will be able to 'sense and see', if ever. (well, just my 2.9 pennies of opinion in here but it's been in my mind for a while ...)

Last edited by penties rider; 03-25-2010 at 09:36 PM. Reason: typo etc!
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