Forgot Password
Pentax Camera Forums Home
 

Reply
Show Printable Version Search this Thread
12-07-2009, 08:33 AM   #46
Pentaxian
thibs's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Belgium
Photos: Albums
Posts: 5,161
QuoteOriginally posted by audiobomber Quote
I've heard disputing views on the 100mm Macro. Some say it's a Tokina lens, some say it's a Pentax redesign of the FA 100mm Macro.
Indeed which iw why I added 'AFAIK' at the end

I don't remind having seen any patent from Pentax concerning the 100 macro and the FA has do noticeable problem on digital. Why would Pentax reuse the 50 macro design but redesign the 100 macro? I know Pentax is known to take weird decisions but still...

12-07-2009, 09:03 AM   #47
ogl
Banned




Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Siberia
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 7,114
QuoteOriginally posted by thibs Quote
Interesting. Could you provide a link? Thx.
I've found patent for 16.5-135 in European or USA patent base...maybe...I don't remember.
Pentax patent. But it was 2 year ago, I didn't save the link.

Let's try to find all together now.
12-07-2009, 01:35 PM   #48
Veteran Member




Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Sweden
Posts: 841
The optics in the Tokina lenses that Pentax also makes, are the same and they have the same lens coating. What differs is the outer design and electronics (of course, since Tokina makes them for other mounts than Pentax).

The optics are made by Hoya.

Now, Tokina puts togheter the optics with their own designed exterior and chips for Canon and Nikon mounts. This "putting parts together" happens in Japan.

And Pentax puts together the very same optics with Pentax designed exterior and Pentax chips. And this happens in Vietnam.

Yes, the 12-24 f/4 is an original Tokina design.

And yes, the 100 f/2.8 Macro is a Pentax original design.
Why make a new 100 Macro and keeping the optical design of the 50 macro, just re-designing the exterior?

Because the FA 100 Macro was, by many, considered one of the weaker macros technically (not as good as similar offerings from Canon and Nikon), and the FA 50 Macro was considered as one of the best macros ever made on this planet!

The problem with the FA 100 Macro is the performance wide opened.
The new D FA 100 Macro is a sharper and better performer at the wider apertures.

However, the FA 100 Macro had an extremely pleasing colour rendition, bokeh and overall look to the images that many found very attractive. The D FA 100 Macro isn't as sweet. Technically better, but subjectively not as beautiful images. More a neutral recorder than the subjective FA.
12-07-2009, 01:45 PM   #49
Senior Member
Itai's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Montreal
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 211
Much better than the rumors of a few weeks ago :)

Actually this time it makes complete sense.The loss of the FA 600mm may be a bit dissapointing.

I know someone mentioned the 18-250 not making sense but if you _know_ that this one lens reduced the quality of images comming out of Pentax cameras, compared to otherwise great lenses, it'll keep people tempted by the long range out of trouble. If they really want low quality, the could always for a similar range from Tamron or Sigma (which does make great lenses too, btw).

What I'm hoping is that Pentax is making room for new lenses in the production lines. People have long asked for me range and Pentax is lagging in rectilenear lens focal-length coverage compared to other systems. It would probably easy for them to adapt the well-respected Tokina 11-16mm F2.8 for example, although I'd like to see them more agressive with a 9-16mm F4 (or F2.8) to match the maximum wide-angle coverage for cropped-sensor DSLRs. They should probably extend the long end too, which I wouldn't personally use but wildlife photographers would greatly appreciate.

- Itai
Digital Camera Buying Guide, Photography Articles and Reviews | NeoCamera.com

12-07-2009, 01:48 PM   #50
Pentaxian
audiobomber's Avatar

Join Date: May 2008
Location: Sudbury, Ontario
Photos: Albums
Posts: 6,631
QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote
I've found patent for 16.5-135 in European or USA patent base...maybe...I don't remember.
Pentax patent. But it was 2 year ago, I didn't save the link.

Let's try to find all together now.
I couldn't find a patent document.
12-07-2009, 02:03 PM   #51
Veteran Member




Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 2,311
QuoteOriginally posted by RMabo Quote
...and the FA 50 Macro was considered as one of the best macros ever made on this planet!
This is interesting! How does the FA 50 macro hold up against todays 50mm range macros or normals?
12-07-2009, 02:30 PM   #52
Moderator
Site Supporter
Blue's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Florida Hill Country
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 17,166
QuoteOriginally posted by the swede Quote
This is interesting! How does the FA 50 macro hold up against todays 50mm range macros or normals?
Optically, they are very similar. The D FA 50mm has the "ghostless" coating. I think you would find the FA would hold up fairly well against the macros.
12-07-2009, 03:43 PM   #53
Veteran Member
jeffkrol's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Wisconsin USA
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 8,434
QuoteOriginally posted by the swede Quote
This is interesting! How does the FA 50 macro hold up against today's 50mm range macros or normals?
FA50 (which I own and can verify) has a ghosting problem w/ the digital sensor. Theory is that there is a secondary reflection off the back of the last element.
This has been eliminated in the DFA series. The 100's do not have this nor if I remember correctly the older "A" series 50's but I'd have to check.
See this:
Strange blob with FA 50 1:1.4: News Discussion Forum: Digital Photography Review
So does the older Tamron 90mm SPII.
Thus the DFA re-design...

12-07-2009, 05:27 PM   #54
Veteran Member




Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Boston, PRofMA
Photos: Albums
Posts: 3,053
By "ghosting", you mean handling lens flare badly?
I can confirm the FA50/1.4 washes out like crazy when you try shooting into the sun...ditto the FA77 at the right angle (sun just out of frame). Light just bounces around like crazy inside the lens...
My Sigma 17-70 does much better but isn't as sharp...
12-07-2009, 06:03 PM   #55
Moderator
Site Supporter
Blue's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Florida Hill Country
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 17,166
QuoteOriginally posted by jeffkrol Quote
FA50 (which I own and can verify) has a ghosting problem w/ the digital sensor. Theory is that there is a secondary reflection off the back of the last element.
This has been eliminated in the DFA series. The 100's do not have this nor if I remember correctly the older "A" series 50's but I'd have to check.
See this:
Strange blob with FA 50 1:1.4: News Discussion Forum: Digital Photography Review
So does the older Tamron 90mm SPII.
Thus the DFA re-design...
All of the pre F series 50mm macros are optically different including the A series and weren't 1:1.

As far as the Tamron 90mm SP adaptall 2 goes, the 52B, 52BB, 52E, 152E goes, those had 8 elements in 6 groups and varied from 8 to 9 aperture blades. The 72 series of which only the 72B was an adaptall 2 had 10 elements in 9 groups and 9 blades. It was the most recent of the series 72 that had coatings applied to deal with ghosting.

Edit: All that said some people have successfully used the FA macro on digital for macro images as well as other uses.

https://www.pentaxforums.com/lensreviews/SMC-Pentax-FA-50mm-F2.8-Macro-Lens.html

Last edited by Blue; 12-07-2009 at 06:09 PM.
12-07-2009, 08:41 PM   #56
Veteran Member
Eaglerapids's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Idaho,USA
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 1,588
My K20D may be my last Pentax body without the dream of a super tele. Man, even a 400/4 would give me something to reach for but without a super tele I have enough Pentax primes to keep me busy up to 300mm. I just need something longer and it increasingly looks like Canon is the way to go long. The point that it's possible to get the Canon 500/4 or 600/4 and a body for the price of a Pentax 600/4 that won't even be made anymore is compelling. I just looked up the Canon 500/4 and it's in stock at B&H, that's something isn't it, looking for something like that and it's possible to get it right now? Criminy, I still can't buy a WR 1.4X converter from Pentax, one of the reasons I bought the DA* 300/4, at the time there was the promise of the teleconverter and Pentax couldn't even pull that off.
Now, it would take a miracle before I could afford the 500/4 but the 400/5.6 could hold me over nicely till then.
God, I hate thinking this way but.........................
12-07-2009, 09:25 PM   #57
ogl
Banned




Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Siberia
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 7,114
QuoteOriginally posted by audiobomber Quote
I couldn't find a patent document.
In American patent base.
http://patft1.uspto.gov/netahtml/PTO/search-bool.html
12-07-2009, 09:28 PM   #58
Pentaxian
audiobomber's Avatar

Join Date: May 2008
Location: Sudbury, Ontario
Photos: Albums
Posts: 6,631
QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote
In American patent base.
I found a couple of world patent search engines, but you probably need to pay to get a better search.
12-07-2009, 09:34 PM   #59
ogl
Banned




Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Siberia
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 7,114
United States Patent: 7283311)

The present invention relates to a wide-angle zoom lens system which is suitable for a single-lens reflex (SLR) camera, and especially suitable for a digital single-lens reflex camera.
Suitable for a digital SLR camera having a smaller imaging device.
16.48-131.0 (3.5-5.8)

The real design focal range and aperture and marketing data are not the same.

I don't know any Pentax DA16.5-131/3.5-5.8 lenses.
Maybe I'm wrong, but there are several similiar patents for such lens.

Last edited by ogl; 12-07-2009 at 09:43 PM.
12-07-2009, 09:39 PM   #60
Site Supporter
Marc Langille's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: NW Arkansas, USA
Posts: 4,702
QuoteOriginally posted by Samsungian Quote
Ironically the Canon 600mm f4 IS sells for $2500 less than HoyaPentax' newly discontinued, special order only 600mm f4.


Canon | Telephoto EF 600mm f/4.0L IS Image Stabilizer | 2534A002
I agree that it's sad to see it go!

I would like to ask you regarding your price quote: where did you obtain this information that the FA 600/4 is priced at $2500 more than the Canon 600/4? For the record, the FA* sold for approx. $6500 from B&H when it was available for ordering - sometime in early spring/summer of 2007 within the USA. I can assure you that was the street price ($6500) of the FA* 600/4 and at B&H Photo. I know because I seriously considered ordering one in 2007 from B&H but held off because of the weight of the lens. I am not sure where you are quoting over $10,000 for the FA* 600/4??

You'll find several examples confirming the street price:

Pentax Big Glass - Photo.net Nature Forum

The Pentax Big Glass Comparison Pages

That's $1500 cheaper than the Canon 600/4 lens currently selling at B&H. I would welcome knowing where you quoted such a high price for the FA* 600/4 of $10,500? It's even more interesting since that means a disparity of ~$4000 from street price. I am not wanting to stir up an argument, but that's a big difference good sir! For reference the FA* 250-600/5.6 sold new at the higher price for $7400 - $7500.

Regards,
Marc
Reply

Bookmarks
  • Submit Thread to Facebook Facebook
  • Submit Thread to Twitter Twitter
  • Submit Thread to Digg Digg
Tags - Make this thread easier to find by adding keywords to it!
japan, lens, pentax, pentax news, pentax rumors
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
FA Ltd will be discontinued and FF never comes henryjing Pentax News and Rumors 22 10-18-2010 12:53 PM
DA* 55mm/1.4 Lens Hood Discontinued MrPetkus Pentax News and Rumors 27 06-29-2010 12:22 PM
Pentax FA50mm: Discontinued Lens Francesco Pentax News and Rumors 203 06-11-2010 10:19 AM
Hood for discontinued lens. . . snostorm Ask B&H Photo! 1 06-04-2010 06:29 AM
Discontinued Lens List Russell-Evans Pentax SLR Lens Discussion 16 12-10-2009 12:13 PM



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 11:38 AM. | See also: NikonForums.com, part of our network of photo forums!
  • Red (Default)
  • Green
  • Gray
  • Dark
  • Dark Yellow
  • Dark Blue
  • Old Red
  • Old Green
  • Old Gray
  • Dial-Up Style
Hello! It's great to see you back on the forum! Have you considered joining the community?
register
Creating a FREE ACCOUNT takes under a minute, removes ads, and lets you post! [Dismiss]
Top