Forgot Password
Pentax Camera Forums Home
 

Reply
Show Printable Version Search this Thread
03-15-2010, 10:43 AM   #721
Veteran Member




Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Colorado USA
Posts: 1,337
$2,000 for Sony body leaves $7400 for Zeiss glass

$2,000 for Sony body leaves $7,400 for Zeiss glass shopping spree:

SLR Camera Lenses

Looks like two A850, because if you do this for a living you must have a spare dslr, and you get 16-35mm 2.8 Zeiss, 24-70mm 2.8 Zeiss, and 70-200mm 2.8 Zeiss and for same money a 645D body only costs, well if it were for sale in USA like the Sony gear is

I still say $9400 is too much money for a camera, but thats me.

I now suspect dozens of eager 645D buyers here at pentaxforums will add a 645D because its a heck of a good deal in that the lenses are so abundant and cheap to locate.


QuoteOriginally posted by pingflood Quote
For landscapes it's hard to beat the A850 at under $2k.



Last edited by Samsungian; 03-15-2010 at 11:04 AM.
03-15-2010, 11:08 AM   #722
Veteran Member
falconeye's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Munich, Alps, Germany
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 6,863
QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote
645D (II)
I am not sure if this is the right thing to do. Skipping FF altogether, I mean.

Except this 645DII is EVIL, ships with adapters for MF optical viewfinder, and 645 and KAF lenses. And isn't more expensive than a 5Dmk3.
03-15-2010, 11:18 AM   #723
Pentaxian




Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Romania
Posts: 9,343
An even cheaper MF camera? Who needs the small format, anyway?
But... would Pentax China knows about a camera nowhere near to be launched? Hoya's lips seem to be very tight.
03-15-2010, 11:31 AM   #724
Veteran Member
rparmar's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2008
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 8,783
The main thing I would want to see that the 645D does not address, is front tilt functionality. Forget all this megapixel talk, that is the difference between landscape photography and LANDSCAPE PHOTOGRAPHY.

Given that the Hartblei are no longer being made, the only real option is to get a Pentacon 6 to Pentax 645 adapter and strap on an old Russian lens. But if Pentax were to release a dedicated lens for this purpose it could then compete with the Canon 45/2.8 tilt/shift for FF digital at $1200. And the Hasselblad HTS 1.5 adapter at $5400.

Besides landscape photogs, a 645 mount tilt/shift lens for the 645D would open up the camera to the architectural photography market.


Last edited by rparmar; 03-15-2010 at 11:38 AM.
03-15-2010, 12:00 PM   #725
Senior Member
MMVIII's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: EU
Posts: 242
Thanks to Samsungian we now know that this glass of wine is half empty (what else), Bordeaux is to expensive so that he will get onother can of Budweiser. Amazing.

And Robin,
QuoteQuote:
Besides landscape photogs, a 645 mount tilt/shift lens for the 645D would open up the camera to the architectural photography market.
I'm not so up to date with TS on Pentax MF, but shouldn't a Zörk-adapter give you some possibilities or do you loose to much on quality/handling and convenience?

http://www.zoerk.com/pages/p_mfs.htm

Last edited by MMVIII; 03-15-2010 at 12:07 PM. Reason: better link
03-15-2010, 01:51 PM   #726
Veteran Member
Torphoto's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Trinidad W.I.
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 620
Ok with all this talk, I want full sized samples to see if it is a worthy investment for a studio vs a 1ds mkIV or d3X, 645 lenses are cheap.

So where are my raw samples, anyone?
03-15-2010, 01:55 PM   #727
Veteran Member




Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Copenhagen
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 1,845
QuoteOriginally posted by summonbaka Quote
By the way, there are better pictures (and pictures that make me wanna erase mine) in this thread: https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-news-rumors/93373-pentax-surprise-show.html

And something i forgot:
The horizontal tilt can be displayed in the main LCD, but it appears in the viewfinder and in the top LCD.
Don't worry. Those other pictures are not from a private person, but from the japanese DC Watch.


Hearing about the beauty of the VF in the Leica S2. I sure would wish that I could transfer the 645D VF onto my DSLR
There was always something special about MF in the film days. And the work I've seen from MF digital has always impressed.

There were tilt and shift lenses for the Pentax MF film cameras, so I'm sure there are gonna be some for the 645D as well.


Besides, why settle for 0.89 crop; in imitation of 35 mm film size. When you can have 1.7 times bigger in Medium Format
There was never any golden format. Just various options through times. With digital, the start/standard was APS-C format.
FF as in Full Format, could be large format, and way too expensive still


Here were some Leica first impressions regarding the S2 :
"The viewfinder is huge and bright - much bigger than the viewfinder of the 1DsIII, and way bigger than the viewfinders of APS-C cameras. Overall the camera is big, but surprisingly it is not as big as my 1DsIII..."http://www.juzaphoto.com/eng/articles/leica_s2_review_samples.htm


What really opened my eye to what MF could do, was the crop from this shot with the S2 :
Leica S2 Model
In the eyeball, one can clearly see the photographers and their set-up. Knowing that Leica will be their competitior, I’m sure Pentax will be ready to put out some exemplary optics.



The superb photographer Lepingzha, was very impressed by the medium format Pentax optics. So much that he prefered them on his Canon 35 mm digital cams :
MF for Pentax. Japan only [Page 1]: Pentax SLR Talk Forum: Digital Photography Review

Mamiya 645 lens on D2Hs , D2Xs ?: Nikon D3 - D1 / D700 Forum: Digital Photography Review

Some of his extraordinary work can be seen here :
Leping Zha Landscape Photography


QuoteOriginally posted by gazonk Quote
Why do you guys keep comparing japanese oranges with american apples?

645D: ¥848,000
????.com-????-??????????4000???????????????645D?

D3x: ¥832,000
????.com- ??? D3X [???]

The difference gets a little bigger if you have a card from Yodobashi (you need to be resident in Japan), you get 10% bonus points on the 645D and 14% on the D3x. So you end up with the following prices with current exchange rates:

645D: USD 8422
D3x: USD 7896

So, if you compare in the same shop in the market where you actually can order the 645D, AND you're able to use the yodobashi card, the difference is still less than 600 $.
Thanks for the info

Last edited by Jonson PL; 03-15-2010 at 02:52 PM.
03-15-2010, 02:27 PM   #728
Veteran Member
rparmar's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2008
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 8,783
QuoteOriginally posted by MMVIII Quote
I'm not so up to date with TS on Pentax MF, but shouldn't a Zörk-adapter give you some possibilities or do you loose to much on quality/handling and convenience?
The Zörk uses enlarger lenses or something, right? While that works it would not benefit Pentax. If they come out with their own solution it is not only easier for their customers but they are not giving up sales to a third party. Besides, having a total solution shows they are serious about that market segment.

This is how Canon wins professional customers. No matter what you need now or in the future you can be sure Canon can supply it. They address weaknesses in their line-up slowly but surely. Until recently they had a rather poor tilt and shift lens; now they have one with stellar IQ qualities (according to BJP etc.).

03-15-2010, 04:20 PM   #729
Senior Member




Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 119
QuoteOriginally posted by konraDarnok Quote
You could apply this exact same logic to the never ending APS-C vs. FF debate -- it would be even more true. There's nothing particularly "full" about a full frame. It's just another format that's marginally different.

I can't be the only one that's tired of reading this stuff.

Moderators
need to come up with a filter that automatically changes "FF" or "full frame" to something witty, like "ponies" . . .or maybe automatically moved to a whole different forum called "sour grapes" or "greener fields" under the off-topic header.
Me too. I am sooo sick and tired of the APS-C vs. FF (I mean 35mm) line. There's been nuff said about this.

Back to the topic. I will sell my (not my wife's) car to get my hands on this 645D baby and start up my 645 system. Will get about on a scooter instead for the joy of delving into the (cropped) MF world!

Will still keep my K20D & lenses, of course!
03-15-2010, 06:37 PM   #730
Veteran Member




Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: CT, USA
Posts: 499
QuoteOriginally posted by er1kksen Quote
Of course, resolution isn't dependent entirely on pixel count. Things like the strength or weakness (or lack) of an AA filter also have a large impact on actual resolution (in terms of detail captured).
True enough; it's also true they have yet to pass a law against making a 35mm FF dSLR with a weak AA Filter, or without one.

QuoteOriginally posted by gazonk Quote
No. You can't compare American and Japanese prices. Japanese D3x prices are very close to 645d prices.
QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
I'd say that this is selling against the D3x, not the D3s.
The D3X price isn't really the issue anyway. If you're going to look at the FF dSLR that most closely would be considered by those interested in high resolution, low speed subject matter, then you would be more likely be looking at the Sony A850 or Canon 5d Mk II, one of which is less than 1/4 the price and the other of which is less than 1/3 the price. (NO, I'm not quoting Japanese prices, and I really could care less; even with a significant discount IF the 645D ever makes it to the US market, it will STILL sell for multiples of the price of most FF cameras, especially those that are more in line in other areas like frame rates and autofocus - though the Sony doesn't give you the Canon discount AF performance to try to "force" you to go for their overpriced 1DS series.)

QuoteOriginally posted by konraDarnok Quote
You could apply this exact same logic to the never ending APS-C vs. FF debate -- it would be even more true. There's nothing particularly "full" about a full frame. It's just another format that's marginally different.

I can't be the only one that's tired of reading this stuff.

Moderators
need to come up with a filter that automatically changes "FF" or "full frame" to something witty, like "ponies" . . .or maybe automatically moved to a whole different forum called "sour grapes" or "greener fields" under the off-topic header.
As tired as you might be of listening to the APS-C vs. FF debate, I'm ten times as tired of hearing all of the ridiculous arguments about why Pentax shouldn't make a FF dSLR, and find it particularly irritating how the same arguments that those individuals make concerning why a Pentax FF dSLR is supposedly a bad idea get conveniently forgotten when they chest beat about the 645D (that they'll never buy, with VERY few exceptions), a camera which magnifies every supposed issue that's supposed to make a FF dSLR a business catastrophe for Pentax (including, but not limited to, the cost, the small market, the fact that they can't compete with the established players, etc. ad nauseum.) Oh, and the difference bwtween FF 35mm format and APS-C is bigger than the difference between the cropped 645D and FF 35mm format, not to mention that there's a lot more people that have FF 35mm Pentax mount glass then there are people with 645 glass.

QuoteOriginally posted by gazonk Quote
Why do you guys keep comparing japanese oranges with american apples?

645D: ¥848,000
????.com-????-??????????4000???????????????645D?

D3x: ¥832,000
????.com- ??? D3X [???]

The difference gets a little bigger if you have a card from Yodobashi (you need to be resident in Japan), you get 10% bonus points on the 645D and 14% on the D3x. So you end up with the following prices with current exchange rates:

645D: USD 8422
D3x: USD 7896

So, if you compare in the same shop in the market where you actually can order the 645D, AND you're able to use the yodobashi card, the difference is still less than 600 $.
Again, see the comment above. The slow, low frame rate, low ISO range 645D is competing more with FF dSLRs like the slow, lower ISO range A850, which is 1/4 the price. I'm sure even your Japanese prices aren't going to narrow THAT gap to "competitive."
03-15-2010, 06:49 PM   #731
Veteran Member




Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: CT, USA
Posts: 499
QuoteOriginally posted by cousinsane Quote
The D3x has only 24.5MP. If you are only interested in shooting landscape, I'd say D3x is pretty terrible in the bang for buck department. The 645D might actually be a better deal(per MP) for those who can afford it.
QuoteOriginally posted by pingflood Quote
For landscapes it's hard to beat the A850 at under $2k.
$235.00 per megapixel for 645D

$81.26 per megapixel for A850

You were saying about bang for buck??
03-15-2010, 07:22 PM   #732
Veteran Member
rparmar's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2008
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 8,783
QuoteOriginally posted by 24X36NOW Quote
The slow, low frame rate, low ISO range 645D is competing more with FF dSLRs like the slow, lower ISO range A850, which is 1/4 the price.
Nope, wrong again. The 645D is competing with the other MF crop cameras. And in that market it has a faster frame rate, just as good (or better) ISO and is half the price at worst. Oh, and it is weather-sealed. Oh, and it has tons of automation features other MF cameras only wish they had.

May not be for you, may not be for me, but it certainly is a darned good deal for someone.

And yes, I own 645 glass. I guess that qualifies me to make an opinion? Sheesh!
03-15-2010, 07:26 PM   #733
ogl
Pentaxian
ogl's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Siberia
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 7,254
QuoteOriginally posted by pingflood Quote
For landscapes it's hard to beat the A850 at under $2k.
If only for rather amateur landscapes.

APS-C is not bad for landscapes too, and in some cases I'd say APS-C could be better.

Wide-angle lenses are rather mediocre at corners at FF bodies.
Nikkor AF-S 16-35mm f/4 G ED VR (FX) - Review / Test Report
Zeiss ZA Vario-Sonnar T* 16-35mm f/2.8 SSM ( Sony SAL-1635Z ) - Full Format Review / Test Report

I really never saw outstanding landscapes from 35 mm SLR cameras. I don't see such pictures from FF DSLR. Only good. IMO.

Dear friend, many years ago, 135 format was for amateurs , all of us had used 35 mm SLR and landscapes from 35 mm film was for home use.

Serious landscapes were, are and will = MIDDLE and LARGE format.

Last edited by ogl; 03-15-2010 at 07:37 PM.
03-15-2010, 07:53 PM   #734
Veteran Member




Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: CT, USA
Posts: 499
QuoteOriginally posted by rparmar Quote
Nope, wrong again. The 645D is competing with the other MF crop cameras. And in that market it has a faster frame rate, just as good (or better) ISO and is half the price at worst. Oh, and it is weather-sealed. Oh, and it has tons of automation features other MF cameras only wish they had.

May not be for you, may not be for me, but it certainly is a darned good deal for someone.

And yes, I own 645 glass. I guess that qualifies me to make an opinion? Sheesh!
I'm just commenting on the posts that assert that the 645D is D3X competition. I fully realize that almost nobody is cross-shopping medium format and 35mm format. The idea (not commenting on your post, but the "theme" of many others) that the cropped 645D somehow "eliminates the need" for a 35mm FF format is ridiculous, and though the cropped 645D may look like a good deal for someone shopping other medium format systems, it certainly isn't going to look like a cheap camera to someone shopping FF 35mm format. Nor will it compete with a FF 35mm format camera on many other fronts, e.g., frame rates, auto focus speed, ISO range, available lenses, etc.
03-15-2010, 07:57 PM   #735
ogl
Pentaxian
ogl's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Siberia
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 7,254
QuoteOriginally posted by 24X36NOW Quote
I'm just commenting on the posts that assert that the 645D is D3X competition. I fully realize that almost nobody is cross-shopping medium format and 35mm format. The idea (not commenting on your post, but the "theme" of many others) that the cropped 645D somehow "eliminates the need" for a 35mm FF format is ridiculous, and though the cropped 645D may look like a good deal for someone shopping other medium format systems, it certainly isn't going to look like a cheap camera to someone shopping FF 35mm format. Nor will it compete with a FF 35mm format camera on many other fronts, e.g., frame rates, auto focus speed, ISO range, available lenses, etc.
It's absolutely different niches. Yes...
Reply

Bookmarks
  • Submit Thread to Facebook Facebook
  • Submit Thread to Twitter Twitter
  • Submit Thread to Digg Digg
Tags - Make this thread easier to find by adding keywords to it!
pentax news, pentax rumors
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
645d!!! insulinguy Pentax News and Rumors 1 10-12-2010 07:36 AM
645D now available in the UK robbiec Pentax News and Rumors 3 09-21-2010 03:01 AM
Using the 645D... HawaiianOnline Pentax Medium Format 13 03-23-2010 07:17 PM
645D or something else? GordonZA Pentax News and Rumors 7 03-09-2010 02:24 PM
Who would consider a 645D? Elton Pentax Medium Format 11 09-28-2007 07:39 PM



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 06:09 PM. | See also: NikonForums.com, CanonForums.com part of our network of photo forums!
  • Red (Default)
  • Green
  • Gray
  • Dark
  • Dark Yellow
  • Dark Blue
  • Old Red
  • Old Green
  • Old Gray
  • Dial-Up Style
Hello! It's great to see you back on the forum! Have you considered joining the community?
register
Creating a FREE ACCOUNT takes under a minute, removes ads, and lets you post! [Dismiss]
Top