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05-19-2016, 10:57 AM   #1
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Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 688
GRII New Firmware Version 2.01

I have had the GRII for about three months. The form factor is a perfect fit for a compact APS-C camera. It really is a constant carry type of camera. My GRII came installed with firmware V. 1.14. I noticed there was a new V. 2.01 so I installed it. After installation the +/- pad when using it to change ISO one press causes the ISO to skip randomly 4 or 5 stops. If you press to go back it lands on a completely different ISO setting from where you originally started. I have to use the Aperture dial to change ISO in 1 stop increments. It was more convenient using the +/- pad. I see no way of being able to control how the +/- pad functions. After the update I also notice the date was off. When I corrected the date it was a day behind I noticed the time setting can only be displayed in military time.

I have really enjoyed using the GRII. Picture quality is excellent. The images are crisp and real looking. I wish Ricoh had given the GRII the 24mp sensor that is in the K3II or even the 20mp sensor in the K-S2. But that is another story. I passed on the Fuji X70 because it had the same basic sensor as the GRII. The GRII is a better pocketable camera too. Just enough. X70 is nice also though. The tilt screen is a definite plus. Though I don't think the GRII needs a tilt screen especially if it has to make the camera any larger.

There is one major flaw with the GR that some people may disagree with which is the ADJ lever. Every time I have used the GRII over the last three months I will have a sequence of images that are useless because the shutter speed has been changed without me realizing it because the ADJ lever is to easily moved accidentally changing the setting. What also compounds this is the way the ADJ lever is made to keep changing the setting the longer it is held left or right. This causes the settings to jump multiple increments. When I am consciously changing the shutter speed I have to be careful because it always moves three increments when all I want is one. Last time out I had a sequence of 70 images rendered useless because the ADJ lever had accidentally been moved to cause it to be 5 stops to slow. I can not imagine I am the only one this happens to as the ADJ lever is the only way to change the shutter speed.

Why not just use two dials front and back? Or in M mode let the user set the four way key pad as the shutter/aperture control. Life would be so simple that way. Even before I purchased the GRII I could tell the ADJ lever was going to give me problems. It is just to sensitive for such a small camera. It is to easily moved without the user being aware. I was so hoping that I could set the +/- pad for shutter control. I don't think you can change the functions of the +/- pad at all. At least from what I have found so far in the manual.

Even the push nature of the ADJ lever button is useless to me. It is set to ISO. Press the ADJ lever it brings up the ISO setting. Then you have to use another dial/pad to change the setting. Why not have the ADJ lever change the ISO setting by toggling left or right In the end you have to press the ADJ lever button again to get out of the ISO setting any way. It is just to much fiddling around when it would be so easy to press the ADJ lever toggle left or right then press the ADJ lever to get out.

Don't get me wrong the GR/GRII really are home runs. They can be improved. Right now the camera gets in my way to often do to the design.

05-24-2016, 06:13 AM   #2
webstertomkins
Guest




Hi,

I'm not sure, if I understood your problems the right way. Hope the following helps a little bit.

QuoteOriginally posted by Rico Quote
There is one major flaw with the GR that some people may disagree with which is the ADJ lever. Every time I have used the GRII over the last three months I will have a sequence of images that are useless because the shutter speed has been changed without me realizing it because the ADJ lever is to easily moved accidentally changing the setting. What also compounds this is the way the ADJ lever is made to keep changing the setting the longer it is held left or right. This causes the settings to jump multiple increments. When I am consciously changing the shutter speed I have to be careful because it always moves three increments when all I want is one. Last time out I had a sequence of 70 images rendered useless because the ADJ lever had accidentally been moved to cause it to be 5 stops to slow. I can not imagine I am the only one this happens to as the ADJ lever is the only way to change the shutter speed.
Are you talking about M-Mode? I use mostly Aperture-Priority and there you can change the aperture with the front-wheel. So I never had this problem.


QuoteOriginally posted by Rico Quote
Even the push nature of the ADJ lever button is useless to me. It is set to ISO. Press the ADJ lever it brings up the ISO setting. Then you have to use another dial/pad to change the setting. Why not have the ADJ lever change the ISO setting by toggling left or right In the end you have to press the ADJ lever button again to get out of the ISO setting any way. It is just to much fiddling around when it would be so easy to press the ADJ lever toggle left or right then press the ADJ lever to get out.
You can set it in the menu, that you are able to switch the ISO directly with the ADJ lever (right/left) without pressing it before.
05-25-2016, 11:19 AM   #3
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Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 688
Original Poster
QuoteOriginally posted by webstertomkins Quote
Hi,

I'm not sure, if I understood your problems the right way. Hope the following helps a little bit.



Are you talking about M-Mode? I use mostly Aperture-Priority and there you can change the aperture with the front-wheel. So I never had this problem.




You can set it in the menu, that you are able to switch the ISO directly with the ADJ lever (right/left) without pressing it before.
Thanks for responding webstertomkins. Do you have the GRII and did you update the firmware to 2.01?

Yes, I am working only in M mode. You don't find the ADJ lever easily moved while shooting? You go to take an image and the settings are changed because the ADJ Lever was inadvertently moved? Sadly every time I have used my GRII this happens. I had a feeling this would be the case with the placement and function of the ADJ lever before I purchased. I was able to try it out before hand and could tell right away this was going to be a problem for me how easily the thumb pushes up against the ADJ Lever. One easy solution would to make it function like a lever by moving it in a vertical position. It would still function the same but now the thumb when pressed against it would not as easily move it by accident.

Setting the ADJ Lever to directly control ISO has no affect of allowing me to change the ISO settings. All it does is bring up the ISO settings. I then have to use the aperture dial but I have now realized that the up/down four-way control pad will move ISO one stop at a time also. I don't think this was the case before the firmware update. The +/- pad since the v. 2.01 firmware update will only change ISO in 6 stop increments. I see no way of fixing that. There isn't even a menu item to control the +/- pad that I can tell.

Further for my GRII the ADJ lever when pressed only functions to bring up camera settings. When I move it left/right it changes to what every else you have it controlling i.e. picture size etc. I even turned the rest of the 4 settings to off to only display ISO at which point moving the ADJ lever left/right does nothing.

The GR is a great compact APS-C camera. The ADJ lever is poorly designed and placed. I should be able to in M-mode set the aperture and shutter speed without them changing. It is as basic as it gets for photography. The way that ADJ lever is on the GRII unless I can disabled it I will always be accidentally moving settings every time I use the GRII.
05-25-2016, 07:38 PM - 1 Like   #4
r8n
New Member




Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 9
I thought I would jump in and give some feedback as well.....

QuoteOriginally posted by Rico Quote
Thanks for responding webstertomkins. Do you have the GRII and did you update the firmware to 2.01?

Yes, I am working only in M mode. You don't find the ADJ lever easily moved while shooting?
I don't find the ADJ lever easily moved at all. The spring that centres lever is sufficiently stiff so that a casual rub does not move it. I can rub my thumb over the lever (hearing the scrape of the finger print) without it moving at all. Same goes for the press, it needs to be deliberate. I wonder if there is some variance in the type (quality) of switch used?

QuoteOriginally posted by Rico Quote
Setting the ADJ Lever to directly control ISO has no affect of allowing me to change the ISO settings. All it does is bring up the ISO settings. I then have to use the aperture dial but I have now realized that the up/down four-way control pad will move ISO one stop at a time also
Directly ISO control is only applicable in Av Tv & P. No need to "press" the ADJ lever. R-L swipes of the ADJ change the ISO. ISO values are shown on the bottom right of the display. In the Manual modes one has to assign ISO to one of the positions in the ADJ lever settings, use the front up-down wheel to change incrementally and the +/- to take bigger jumps.


QuoteOriginally posted by Rico Quote
The +/- pad since the v. 2.01 firmware update will only change ISO in 6 stop increments. I see no way of fixing that. There isn't even a menu item to control the +/- pad that I can tell
This was a change in 2.0. The front up-down for incremental changes and the +/- for bigger jumps. That is just the way it is.
I think this was done to remove some redundancy since the Up-down did the incremental changes.
One thing to note is that using the +/- while in the menu allows you to jump from different sections within a menu section (eg. in the shooting menu pressing +/- you can jump from focus/picture format/continuous mode etc. - (easier tried than explained))

QuoteOriginally posted by Rico Quote
Further for my GRII the ADJ lever when pressed only functions to bring up camera settings. When I move it left/right it changes to what every else you have it controlling i.e. picture size etc. I even turned the rest of the 4 settings to off to only display ISO at which point moving the ADJ lever left/right does nothing.
That is pretty much the purpose of the ADJ lever. Press it in and you get quick access to some menu items. ADJ side to side to choose and Front up-down to select and either OK, another press of the ADJ lever or a half press of the shutter to execute (shutter button confirmation needs to turned on)

QuoteOriginally posted by Rico Quote
The GR is a great compact APS-C camera. The ADJ lever is poorly designed and placed. I should be able to in M-mode set the aperture and shutter speed without them changing. It is as basic as it gets for photography. The way that ADJ lever is on the GRII unless I can disabled it I will always be accidentally moving settings every time I use the GRII.
Sorry you are having usability issues. For me it is intuitive and quick to operate without missed settings.
Hope my rambles helped a little bit.

Cheers

05-26-2016, 09:57 AM   #5
Veteran Member




Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 688
Original Poster
QuoteOriginally posted by r8n Quote
I thought I would jump in and give some feedback as well.....



I don't find the ADJ lever easily moved at all. The spring that centres lever is sufficiently stiff so that a casual rub does not move it. I can rub my thumb over the lever (hearing the scrape of the finger print) without it moving at all. Same goes for the press, it needs to be deliberate. I wonder if there is some variance in the type (quality) of switch used?



Directly ISO control is only applicable in Av Tv & P. No need to "press" the ADJ lever. R-L swipes of the ADJ change the ISO. ISO values are shown on the bottom right of the display. In the Manual modes one has to assign ISO to one of the positions in the ADJ lever settings, use the front up-down wheel to change incrementally and the +/- to take bigger jumps.




This was a change in 2.0. The front up-down for incremental changes and the +/- for bigger jumps. That is just the way it is.
I think this was done to remove some redundancy since the Up-down did the incremental changes.
One thing to note is that using the +/- while in the menu allows you to jump from different sections within a menu section (eg. in the shooting menu pressing +/- you can jump from focus/picture format/continuous mode etc. - (easier tried than explained))



That is pretty much the purpose of the ADJ lever. Press it in and you get quick access to some menu items. ADJ side to side to choose and Front up-down to select and either OK, another press of the ADJ lever or a half press of the shutter to execute (shutter button confirmation needs to turned on)



Sorry you are having usability issues. For me it is intuitive and quick to operate without missed settings.
Hope my rambles helped a little bit.

Cheers
r8n thanks for replying.

Unfortunately for me the ADJ lever is easily moved. As I said I was aware this was going to be a potential problem when I bought it. The GRII is a one hand type of shooting camera. Changing from vertical to horizontal position in a fast paced city street environment the ADJ lever gets knocked around on me. All I can be is more careful but that only goes so far. Ricoh can do a better job on the design. A. It should be a wheel instead of a lever if anything. Even as a wheel they could still have it press in like the lever to add additional functionality. I have no sense of control over the lever function. When I hold down the lever left or right it is like spinning a gaming wheel in hoping it lands on the shutter speed I want. Even moving in 1 stop increments for me is hard. It constantly moves 2 and 3 stops when all I want is 1 stop. This is compounded if I need 2 or 3 stops as now I have to move the lever more than once which could cause a 5 stop difference. If I am not looking directly at the camera to make sure where the shutter speed actually ends up after pressing the ADJ lever I can not be certain what the actual shutter speed setting is while using the GRII. Using a wheel I know 1 click means 1 stop whether I am looking at the camera or not.

Thanks for the feedback on the v.2.01 update. My GRII had the 1.14 version installed. Now I see this was not a bug about the +/- pad jumping in 5 stop increments. I can see the utility in this. My dream is for one day they allow in M-mode for the user to assign the four way key pad as the shutter and aperture control. This is the most intuitive layout for such control as one finger can quickly make these adjustments. Look how confusing it is just discussing the front wheel by saying it moves up and down when it really moves left and right.

When I first got the GRII when I set the ADJ lever for quick access to ISO I intuitively tried moving the lever left or right to change the ISO setting only to move to some other function. I wasn't sure what was happening at first. I just assumed the ADJ-lever was going to be a quick way to change ISO by pressing it then moving it left or right. It took me more than a week to stop doing that.

All that said the GR is the perfect carry anytime APS-C camera. The optics are excellent. I am looking forward to Ricoh's next generation and how they will improve it.
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