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12-11-2011, 09:57 PM   #1876
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QuoteOriginally posted by RonHendriks1966 Quote
A pro here in my village (not to pro, but she gives photocources, weddings, portraits and companypictures) just rescently bought a NEX system camera, because that was a lot more convenient to use then her D700 and gave her the same picture quality.

And we are talking about someone with photographic education!
oh, and I prefer the NEX-7 because it is a lot more convenient to use than the K-5, which is an APS-C sensor camera.


Last edited by Pentaxor; 12-11-2011 at 10:16 PM.
12-11-2011, 10:51 PM   #1877
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QuoteOriginally posted by bobmaxja Quote
You need a low cost line to attract peoples to the higner product line. Nikon and Canon do have P&S
Right, because people buy Pentax DSLRs because they came from a Pentax P&S.

Most people buy Pentax because of the value. On the low end, you can get a K-r with a 15-300mm lens in a bundle for $799 MSRP. On the high end, it becomes even more evident. The DA* lenses are half that of L series lenses and the 645 is about 6-8 grand less than a comparable Hasselblad.

If Pentax was just as or even more expensive than the other guys, it would be more like Leica- a respected brand, but not a true market powerhouse.
12-12-2011, 01:10 AM   #1878
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QuoteOriginally posted by bobmaxja Quote
You need a low cost line to attract peoples to the higner product line. Nikon and Canon do have P&S
I would like to agree but part of me tells it isn't so, or so I believe. I never used a Pentax P&S yet bought a Pentax SLR, and here in my place Pentax P&S cameras are relatively cheaper than Canon or Nikon ones, or at least vs. the ones with some degree of manual control. Nothing attracted me to get a Pentax P&S. It's also very rare (in fact I haven't yet seen) to see a Pentax P&S being used out there. Is eliminating that line too little a savings to use for R&D for the FF/645 line? As far as use goes, the Craigslist-equivalent in my country shows Pentax P&S cams being sold within a year or earlier of being bought - unlike most C/N P&S's that end up getting sold only after they've used it too much, like 2 years or so.

For some reason Pentax stayed as a niche-market manufacturer - the only time it competed alongside Canon and Nikon was during the early days of the K mount I think. Before I bought an SLR I never knew Pentax. As for today, what is Pentax's stand? Continue with the current image or brace for a level up and go head-to-head with the big guys? Or is it up to Ricoh to decide now?

and why did Pentax opt to make a cropped medium format instead of a FF camera?
12-12-2011, 02:47 AM   #1879
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QuoteOriginally posted by Alizarine Quote
and why did Pentax opt to make a cropped medium format instead of a FF camera?
Because it was much easier to compete on the DMF market.

12-12-2011, 04:37 AM   #1880
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And because Pentax is a much better known medium format producer than small format one, across the whole photographic community.
12-12-2011, 05:27 AM   #1881
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And because MF is even cooler then FF. I've played around with a 645D for an hour or so. It's amazing. If only I could pay for one... any the lenses...

Ohw, if they could build a more affordable version of the 645D, then they can forget about FF for all I care.
12-12-2011, 07:33 AM - 1 Like   #1882
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
Ohw, if they could build a more affordable version of the 645D, then they can forget about FF for all I care.
Digital FF SLRs are the new medium format cameras. For serious amateurs and professionals.

Digital APSC mirrorless are the new 35mm SLRs. For the average amateur and photo journalists.

And then there are the smart phone cameras which are the new pocket cameras. For the vacation photographer.

Everything else is a niche. IMHO.

So, it is three trains, not just one... And Pentax still has no product for any of the three. The leaders right now are Apple, Sony and Canikon.
12-12-2011, 08:21 AM   #1883
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QuoteOriginally posted by falconeye Quote
Digital FF SLRs
Has no long future as well. 3-4 years maximum.

12-12-2011, 08:46 AM   #1884
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QuoteOriginally posted by falconeye Quote
Digital FF SLRs are the new medium format cameras. For serious amateurs and professionals.

Digital APSC mirrorless are the new 35mm SLRs. For the average amateur and photo journalists.

And then there are the smart phone cameras which are the new pocket cameras. For the vacation photographer.

Everything else is a niche. IMHO.

So, it is three trains, not just one... And Pentax still has no product for any of the three. The leaders right now are Apple, Sony and Canikon.
I think very true for the future and it is good that Pentax steps into the two markets (APS-C mirrorless and FF dslr) in 2012.

For the niche there is some nice money to earn for Pentax with 645D (needs an upgrade) and for the rugget camera-section for vacation and scubadiving (they need to get better also).

I don't see much market for the rest (entry level aps-c dslr and P&S and Q) in de future.
12-12-2011, 09:07 AM   #1885
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QuoteOriginally posted by RonHendriks1966 Quote
I think very true for the future and it is good that Pentax steps into the two markets (APS-C mirrorless and FF dslr) in 2012.

For the niche there is some nice money to earn for Pentax with 645D (needs an upgrade) and for the rugget camera-section for vacation and scubadiving (they need to get better also).

I don't see much market for the rest (entry level aps-c dslr and P&S and Q) in de future.
I think 645D still has about 2 years left in it (with some price drops before then). It's a very different market not as driven by the constant change. But i do think they probably already have built some Ff 645 prototypes (heck all you'd have to do is change the sensor to prototype it)
12-12-2011, 09:07 AM   #1886
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QuoteOriginally posted by falconeye Quote
Digital FF SLRs are the new medium format cameras. For serious amateurs and professionals.
Only because they have been made MF into a niche. Why was the medium format a lot more common a few decades ago? It was quite common to use for the amateur and hobbiest too. But the 645D is reserved for the ultra-pro or rich hobbyist.

The only reason I'm still using the film 645 is because I cannot afford a 645D. It's a niche marketing devisions decided it should be so.

Sorry, this is offtopic. Just needed to get it off my chest.
12-12-2011, 09:11 AM   #1887
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Photo of a Pentax kiosk taken last night in one of the malls near my place. IMO, Pentax should have more of these - like public appearances - to get more dough in the box for production of FF stuff - or upgrades for the 645D line out and yes there's a 645D in there, in the glass box near the scope.
12-12-2011, 09:11 AM   #1888
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I wonder how many people have put their K-5 purchase on hold while hoping to get a FF instead because of this kind of thread.
12-12-2011, 09:14 AM   #1889
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QuoteOriginally posted by Emacs Quote
Has no long future as well. 3-4 years maximum.
He-he...The price is the main factor to be for APS-C cameras.
12-12-2011, 09:21 AM   #1890
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
Only because they have been made MF into a niche. Why was the medium format a lot more common a few decades ago? It was quite common to use for the amateur and hobbiest too. But the 645D is reserved for the ultra-pro or rich hobbyist.

The only reason I'm still using the film 645 is because I cannot afford a 645D. It's a niche marketing devisions decided it should be so.

Sorry, this is offtopic. Just needed to get it off my chest.
Realistically MF was always a pro format, the enthusiast used 645 but MF was also 6x6,6x7,6x9,6x12...

As for cost MF was always expensive. the 645D is actually still a good value IMO but you need to either have disposable income as an enthusiast or earn from it (really that is no different than Film days)
It's only the advent of widespread adoption of DSLR that made Film MF affordable (discounting of course the Kiev's form that equation)
If you want a fair comparison to film cost to develop and scan 120 locally (16 base still not as good as the 40mp sensor) is $27.45. even with a bulk discount (say $20 a roll) it doesn't take many rolls to pay for a 645d - 500 or 750 images (but it's easier to pay roll by roll of course). I imagine most 645 owners pass 750 images in the first month
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