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11-15-2011, 12:13 PM   #1216
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I agree, back to the topic of this thread!

Maybe (probably) it's old news, but Tokina - who is know to make Pentax lenses - is launching it's first full frame lens range since years. Coincidence?

11-15-2011, 01:04 PM   #1217
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
I agree, back to the topic of this thread!

Maybe (probably) it's old news, but Tokina - who is know to make Pentax lenses - is launching it's first full frame lens range since years. Coincidence?
It's the 16-28mm/f2.8 and a test: Tokina AF 16-28mm f/2.8 AT-X Pro FX (FX) - Review / Test Report Wich says to me that this lens would be better on an APS-H sized sensor, since the mentioned flaws of corner-softness wouldn't be that big of a problem.
11-15-2011, 01:26 PM   #1218
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Ron, you're obsessed with APS-H
It's unlikely Pentax will support APS-C, APS-H, and FF simultaneously. I'd much rather have FF. APS-H is all but dead. The Kodak APS-H has no video and is probably slated for a Leica. Looks like a marketing disaster.
11-15-2011, 01:32 PM   #1219
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QuoteOriginally posted by MrPetkus Quote
Ron, you're obsessed with APS-H
It's unlikely Pentax will support APS-C, APS-H, and FF simultaneously. I'd much rather have FF. APS-H is all but dead. The Kodak APS-H has no video and is probably slated for a Leica. Looks like a marketing disaster.
Yep, APS-H would be a marketing disaster. I fully agree with you... Sadly, that still doesn't have to keep 'them' from thinking it's a great idea. I mean, marketing disasters have been known to occur.

But I'm hoping for FF, just like the next person. Even though I wouldn't be able to pay for such a machine any time soon. It would be great to see my favourite brand make a move towards professionality.

11-15-2011, 06:54 PM   #1220
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I'd like to see an APS-H and APS-C crop option included on a full frame body. There are some DA lenses that don't quite fill a 35mm frame, but still go wider than APS-C with a reasonable level of corner sharpness, and even some old film lenses that aren't quite ready for digital prime time but would be just fine at an APS-H crop.
11-15-2011, 07:15 PM   #1221
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QuoteOriginally posted by maxfield_photo Quote
I'd like to see an APS-H and APS-C crop option included on a full frame body. There are some DA lenses that don't quite fill a 35mm frame, but still go wider than APS-C with a reasonable level of corner sharpness, and even some old film lenses that aren't quite ready for digital prime time but would be just fine at an APS-H crop.
I would think that these days, with the computers in cameras being what they are, you could have a "recommended crop" for each DA lens in the camera, based not only on the lens, but also on aperture. In addition, the camera would allow you to take the photo uncropped.
11-15-2011, 07:36 PM   #1222
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
I would think that these days, with the computers in cameras being what they are, you could have a "recommended crop" for each DA lens in the camera, based not only on the lens, but also on aperture. In addition, the camera would allow you to take the photo uncropped.
Yeah, the camera should have an automatic cropping behavior by default, but there should also be an override that would allow the user to choose which size to use. In particular I could see this being useful when you know the aspect ratio for your final image will differ from the standard 2:3 frame. Though a DA lens might not fill a 35mm frame at 2:3 it might work for 4:5.

I hate going into PP only to discover that I haven't quite left enough negative space for the aspect ratio I want to print and I have to choose between chopping off heads or torsos. What would be really helpful is if the viewfinder had cropping sliders that could adjust to show you exactly what the final frame will look like whether it's 8x10 or 5x7 or 2x3. Is there a camera out there that does that already?
11-15-2011, 11:20 PM   #1223
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QuoteOriginally posted by maxfield_photo Quote
What would be really helpful is if the viewfinder had cropping sliders that could adjust to show you exactly what the final frame will look like whether it's 8x10 or 5x7 or 2x3. Is there a camera out there that does that already?
In this case, just one cropping frame inside the viewfinder would suffice. To be activated when a DA or other APS-C lens is attached.

11-16-2011, 12:45 AM   #1224
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
Yep, APS-H would be a marketing disaster. I fully agree with you... Sadly, that still doesn't have to keep 'them' from thinking it's a great idea. I mean, marketing disasters have been known to occur.

But I'm hoping for FF, just like the next person. Even though I wouldn't be able to pay for such a machine any time soon. It would be great to see my favourite brand make a move towards professionality.
Really??

I just switched to APS-H and I like it.
11-16-2011, 01:29 AM   #1225
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QuoteOriginally posted by Fontan Quote
Really??

I just switched to APS-H and I like it.
There are much more people who switched to FF and like it too
As for me, I would prefer FF for larger sensor
11-16-2011, 04:58 AM   #1226
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I don't really understand the point of APS-H. It doesn't really give more "length" to your lenses, unless it has a higher pixel density than the 35mm sensor you are considering. There aren't really any APS-H specific lenses out there. It just doesn't seem like it gives any particular benefits over full frame (whereas APS-C generally does have higher pixel density than full frame sensors).
11-16-2011, 09:27 AM   #1227
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Here's what I envision:

Full frame lens attached (default)



APS-C lens attached (default)



Full frame or APS-C lens attached - APS-H crop selected

(You might see some black in the corners with certain DA lenses at certain focal lengths.)

Full frame lens attached - 4x5/8x10 output



Full frame lens attached - 9x16 output



Full frame lens attached - 5x7 output



APS-C lens attached 8x10 output



In the last image I've added a green ring just to illustrate the approximate size of the image circle. As you can see, even with a DA lens attached, users could take advantage of a larger area at the top and bottom of the image than is currently being utilized a standard 3:2 frame. I think this was one of the admirable goals of the 4/3rds system.
11-16-2011, 09:58 AM   #1228
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Cost of FF

Does a full frame sensor cost significantly more? Why should it cost 4K or more? Wouldn't Pentax be able to price one in the 2-3 K area and have the most affordable FF pro-body on the market? It would give Canikon a big headache.
I love all the crop selectivity discussed above. How much would all of that add to the final cost of the body? Pentax has a chance to build in some capabilities that no one else has and take advantage of of their current lens line up and the legacy lenses as well.
11-16-2011, 10:04 AM   #1229
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
I don't really understand the point of APS-H. It doesn't really give more "length" to your lenses, unless it has a higher pixel density than the 35mm sensor you are considering. There aren't really any APS-H specific lenses out there. It just doesn't seem like it gives any particular benefits over full frame (whereas APS-C generally does have higher pixel density than full frame sensors).
1.3x crop is for sports and wildlife, among other things where a balance of speed (shooting and processing), IQ and extra reach are needed. Fast shooting,nice viewfinder, big buffer and clean files are why I use mine. I have all 3 formats and if I had to choose one it would be the aps-H. I would be happy just with my FF too, but it's slower.
11-16-2011, 10:43 AM   #1230
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It looks like the forthcoming Mark ID X (FF, 18Mp, 14fps, huge buffer) will be take care of all those needs except for providing extra reach.
The ID X is *huge* but I would love to have one for stage work...

QuoteOriginally posted by borno Quote
1.3x crop is for sports and wildlife, among other things where a balance of speed (shooting and processing), IQ and extra reach are needed. Fast shooting,nice viewfinder, big buffer and clean files are why I use mine. I have all 3 formats and if I had to choose one it would be the aps-H. I would be happy just with my FF too, but it's slower.
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