Originally posted by jsherman999 If the $1100 K-5 is making a profit now
The $1,100 K-5 only makes a profit now if it sold for $1,500 for the better part of a year previous.
Seen any major price drops on Canikon or Sony FF?
Seen one on the 645D?
See a pattern here?
Why isn't Pentax dropping the price bottom on the 645D to really let MF take on the D3 and new Canon?
Originally posted by maxfield_photo Why couldn't a Pentax full frame camera appeal to an existing Nikon, or Canon APS-C OR flull frame shooter? As you are quick to point out, these two companies have huge user bases, many times the size of Pentax's. You think all of them are happy? Many photographers who I know would leave those brands in a heartbeat for a smaller, weather sealed camera with less expensive glass, and in-body SR.
The dream of "smaller" is just that. A dream. To get a DSLR smaller with equivalent features to the competition you need to lose core features that justify the high starting price which caused by the limited sensor supply. SR takes up space. More space than on an APS-C model. So the very feature people say will appeal to Canikon's reduces the smaller form factor concept.
These design concepts are mostly baked in, which is why the market shift to pellicle and mirorless.
Pentax glass is no less expensive than other brands. Are you willing to stay with all f/4 zooms as opposed to f/2.8 zooms from Canikon on a body the same size as a D700 and the same price body?
No.
You'll buy into the system with all the options if possible. That is exactly how Canikon get and keep customers.
Originally posted by Asahiflex A Pentax FF will never be like a D700. Forget it. It will not be a me-too camera but it will have all the goodies and bells and whistles (and then some) of the other contenders, but in a smaller and more user friendly package. Like a... Pentax.
This is by far the biggest myth flying around here. Pentax small SLR's were a relic of the 1970's when Olympus redesigned the SLR system with Pentax copying them. Canon, Nikon and Minolta did not (but they all had RF's) and still took the top 3 spots in sales by a country mile. Small form factor kept smaller players relevant in niches, but it in no way swung the market.
By the AF era and the later 1990's, except for pro cameras, all brands were pretty much putting out similar sized cameras. I own 3 Pentaxes from the 1970's, one from the 1980's, 1 from the 1990's and 1 from 2001 (MZ-S). I've owned Canon and Nikon SLR's then and still have some Minolta items, including a Maxxum 9 and a Maxxum 5.
Most of them (and an older Nikon F100) were pretty much the same size and weight. The more plastic they got to keep weight down, the more volume they required to maintain structural integrity with the increasing popularity of long zooms (a major reason why you may need a larger form factor for a FF DSLR; FF = big glass).
Size made pretty much zero difference to sales back then. The most popular Pentax of all time was the K1000 which is actually a fairly large beast. The Canon AE-1 came out the same year and was smaller by about 20%. The Pentax did well not because it was a Pentax and was "smaller" but because it was very inexpensive. Both sold gangbusters.
This whole "Pentax makes small cameras" is nonsense when you really look at the sales and models. Some of the P series are monsters, easily dwarfing my Maxxums and consumer F's of the same era.
These days, as back in the 1990's to the end of the film era, by the time you start throwing in all the features and you still need a system fitting the average human hand, you wind up with an FF DSLR about the size of a D700. Some speculation in Nikon-land is FF
may be able to fit into a D300 size body. Maybe. There's lens balance issues there for the 14-24, 24-70, and 70-200 glass, the mainstays of the FF fleet. Without that glass at 2.8, you likely will not have a viable FF market for your brand (maybe a 16-28). So the form factor starts to integrate design with expensive glass.
The MZ-D was huge and featured an integrated grip. If that had been released we could not have this "Pentax"—"smaller" discussion and keep a straight face. The 645D needs a horse to carry it around.