Pentax Full Frame - An official statement from Pentax (they listened!)

Kryscendo · 01-09-2012, 11:10 PM

I just want Pentax to just make a badass camera. The X10 is a badass camera. It has old school aesthetics, and a feature set that just says, "Yes, this is a what a real camera is."

To be honest, the Samsung NX100 didn't sell all that well, but at least it sold. The X10 in my Best Buy has still been sitting there, though we sold one on day 1 to someone who preordered it.

pinholecam · 01-09-2012, 11:17 PM

Originally posted by jsherman999

Good luck in this tier, Ricoh. You're going to need it.

Unfortunately, the window of opportunity of an APS-C mirrorless is closing (or closed) real fast with NX, NEX, Fuji and even Canon offerings.

Kryscendo · 01-09-2012, 11:22 PM

I think Ricoh will have to get into the EVIL market in a big and bold way to really make an impact in 2013.

Zygonyx · 01-10-2012, 12:08 AM

Originally posted by Kryscendo

I just want Pentax to just make a badass camera. The X10 is a badass camera. It has old school aesthetics, and a feature set that just says, "Yes, this is a what a real camera is."

To be honest, the Samsung NX100 didn't sell all that well, but at least it sold. The X10 in my Best Buy has still been sitting there, though we sold one on day 1 to someone who preordered it.

So what do you mean, Pentax to issue badass camera that is commercial succes ?

Clavius · 01-10-2012, 12:18 AM

Originally posted by Kryscendo

I just want Pentax to just make a badass camera. The X10 is a badass camera. It has old school aesthetics, and a feature set that just says, "Yes, this is a what a real camera is."

That is a matter of personal taste and opinion. When I look at the x10, I see a tiny point-and-shoot with the added gimmick of interchangeble lenses. Maybe a bridgecamera towards real SLR's.

gazonk · 01-10-2012, 01:32 AM

Originally posted by Clavius

When I look at the x10, I see a tiny point-and-shoot with the added gimmick of interchangeble lenses.

Well, you have to look a little harder next time, that lens isn't interchangeable

Clavius · 01-10-2012, 01:33 AM

Originally posted by gazonk

Well, you have to look a little harder next time, that lens isn't interchangeable

Ah, in that case, it's nothing more then a point and shoot for grandma's purse.

Kryscendo · 01-10-2012, 03:49 AM

Well, it obviously works for Leica.

You don't see Leica ever fretting about marketshare or any of that non-sense. They just work up overpriced status symbols in the form of cameras.

That and I still want an M9.

Kryscendo · 01-10-2012, 04:00 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Zygonyx

So what do you mean, Pentax to issue badass camera that is commercial succes ?

In my opinion, Pentax should just be Pentax. It will never be Nikon or Canon or Sony and will probably lose its identity if it tried to.

The Pentax of old made reliable cameras, was the benchmark for student photographers (this has since faded), and was a strong contender in Medium format.

Personally, I would love it if Pentax just obsessed over making the finest camera it can in more classes. The K-5 was a big win for Pentax, but it is only in the high quality APS-C bracket. The K-r and K-x were good for the entry level buyers. The 645D brought support for the old 645 glass into the modern era and speaks well for Pentax.

Where Pentax could do better is entering a few new arenas. Namely, Full-frame and maybe even adding a rangefinder. The Q might have been ambitious but it just is the wrong mix of unimpressive sensor and high price compared to the Sony Nex and other cameras in the compact mirrorless arena.

Really, Pentax could offer a wide variety of quality cameras easily. Good, better, best SLR offerings. Medium format for a flagship. A new digital rangefinder would be sexy too. Oh, and why not make a revival of the K1000 for current photography students?

My former community college bought a round of Vivitar film cameras only to have half the fleet survive the semester. They then bought used K1000s and most of them are still in use.

eddie1960 · 01-10-2012, 06:10 AM

Originally posted by Kryscendo

In my opinion, Pentax should just be Pentax. It will never be Nikon or Canon or Sony and will probably lose its identity if it tried to.

The Pentax of old made reliable cameras, was the benchmark for student photographers (this has since faded), and was a strong contender in Medium format.

Personally, I would love it if Pentax just obsessed over making the finest camera it can in more classes. The K-5 was a big win for Pentax, but it is only in the high quality APS-C bracket. The K-r and K-x were good for the entry level buyers. The 645D brought support for the old 645 glass into the modern era and speaks well for Pentax.

Where Pentax could do better is entering a few new arenas. Namely, Full-frame and maybe even adding a rangefinder. The Q might have been ambitious but it just is the wrong mix of unimpressive sensor and high price compared to the Sony Nex and other cameras in the compact mirrorless arena.

Really, Pentax could offer a wide variety of quality cameras easily. Good, better, best SLR offerings. Medium format for a flagship. A new digital rangefinder would be sexy too. Oh, and why not make a revival of the K1000 for current photography students?

My former community college bought a round of Vivitar film cameras only to have half the fleet survive the semester. They then bought used K1000s and most of them are still in use.

While i can see good better best dslr MF as flagship I don't see an RF. it's never been a Pentax thing (and I am a huge RF fan so it's not like I would hate the idea) RF is more expensive to make due to the cost of the focus mechanism. the Fuji was an innovative way of giving some of the RF feel and look without the complex mechanism. Leica makes the only true RF and they don't make for mass market so they price as they wish. Film RF Voigtlander (cosina) makes affordable and well designed ones but stated they have no interest in a digital (after the epson they co-developed) Zeiss has not said no interest but they have said not at this time. Maybe taking Pentax Tech knowledge Ricoh could partner with Cosina or Zeiss on the RF tech to release a Ricoh where therre is a history of RF models - but with the m mountor why would they.

I can see a FF Milc entry along with a FF dslr that they spread the costs across 2 bodies and enter the MILC market with a model no-one else has at the higher end - and giving the 3rd DSLR to the good better best strategy.

Eriol · 01-10-2012, 06:14 AM

Originally posted by Kryscendo

In my opinion, Pentax should just be Pentax. It will never be Nikon or Canon or Sony and will probably lose its identity if it tried to.

The Pentax of old made reliable cameras, was the benchmark for student photographers (this has since faded), and was a strong contender in Medium format.

Personally, I would love it if Pentax just obsessed over making the finest camera it can in more classes. The K-5 was a big win for Pentax, but it is only in the high quality APS-C bracket. The K-r and K-x were good for the entry level buyers. The 645D brought support for the old 645 glass into the modern era and speaks well for Pentax.

Where Pentax could do better is entering a few new arenas. Namely, Full-frame and maybe even adding a rangefinder. The Q might have been ambitious but it just is the wrong mix of unimpressive sensor and high price compared to the Sony Nex and other cameras in the compact mirrorless arena.

Really, Pentax could offer a wide variety of quality cameras easily. Good, better, best SLR offerings. Medium format for a flagship. A new digital rangefinder would be sexy too. Oh, and why not make a revival of the K1000 for current photography students?

My former community college bought a round of Vivitar film cameras only to have half the fleet survive the semester. They then bought used K1000s and most of them are still in use.

I think the Q - despite I personally do not want one - is a logical step. Actually there are three market segments at least:

Compact cameras with fixed lenses, ranging from small, incl. smartphone cams, to bridge cams. Pentax-Ricoh is active in all of them.

Fully electric/mirrorless exchangeable lens cameras, ranging from Q system to APS-C like the NEX-7. Pentax will offer something for the high end here as well, wait and see. I think noone should be concerned as this segment is still at an early stage with much to come. I bet that some others will offer a competitve product to the Q in the future ...

DSLR, ranging from entry to high end level. I do not miss a FF cam from Pentax. The K-5 was compared and rated with the FF competition and turned out to be more than competitive. FF size was good for film SLR cameras. For DSLR, I do not see the big advantage of the FF sensor as the APS-C sensors are so good. E.g., Sony has better APS-C sensors than FF sensors in their own cameras.

If I would need more resolution, dynamic and details and high end optics, I would go for a 645D.

Eriol

Clavius · 01-10-2012, 07:27 AM - **1 Like**

I really don't understand why people who love the idea of a mirrorless camera, can still dislike the Q. It's a neat little camera that has the same big disadvantages any other EVIL will have: it doesn't have a OVF, drains power, and is to small to be handled by any normal sized male. The Q has settled itself in the same niche any other mirrorless camera will find itself in.

SMC-man · 01-10-2012, 07:34 AM

So 2012 is something of a crunch year for Pentax/Ricoh as far as the infamously rumored "full frame" camera is concerned. If they produce one with a FF chip and a big bright OVF, and retaining the K-mount, I'll buy it tomorrow. But somehow I doubt that this is going to happen... So even though I'm a Pentax man through and through, and have been since 1975, I simply can not wait any longer for the upgrade from my K-x, and think that this may be the time to change to Nikon (D700) and sell all my Takumars & other Pentax lenses and to replace them with Nikkors instead !

RonHendriks1966 · 01-10-2012, 08:00 AM

Fuji and Samsung made the choice to stick with APS-C intheir MILC camera's. So for Pentax there is still FF or APS-H to stand out.

gazonk · 01-10-2012, 08:21 AM

Originally posted by RonHendriks1966

Fuji and Samsung made the choice to stick with APS-C intheir MILC camera's. So for Pentax there is still FF or APS-H to stand out.

I wonder how much point there is in MILC FF cameras at this point in time, there's not really that much to save on size and weight when a normal lens has a focal length of ~50 mm.

Maybe Pentax would be better off making the world's smallest and lightest FF DSLR...

01-10-2012, 06:14 AM	#2021
Eriol Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Rhine-Main area Photos: Gallery Posts: 37	Originally posted by Kryscendo In my opinion, Pentax should just be Pentax. It will never be Nikon or Canon or Sony and will probably lose its identity if it tried to. The Pentax of old made reliable cameras, was the benchmark for student photographers (this has since faded), and was a strong contender in Medium format. Personally, I would love it if Pentax just obsessed over making the finest camera it can in more classes. The K-5 was a big win for Pentax, but it is only in the high quality APS-C bracket. The K-r and K-x were good for the entry level buyers. The 645D brought support for the old 645 glass into the modern era and speaks well for Pentax. Where Pentax could do better is entering a few new arenas. Namely, Full-frame and maybe even adding a rangefinder. The Q might have been ambitious but it just is the wrong mix of unimpressive sensor and high price compared to the Sony Nex and other cameras in the compact mirrorless arena. Really, Pentax could offer a wide variety of quality cameras easily. Good, better, best SLR offerings. Medium format for a flagship. A new digital rangefinder would be sexy too. Oh, and why not make a revival of the K1000 for current photography students? My former community college bought a round of Vivitar film cameras only to have half the fleet survive the semester. They then bought used K1000s and most of them are still in use. I think the Q - despite I personally do not want one - is a logical step. Actually there are three market segments at least: Compact cameras with fixed lenses, ranging from small, incl. smartphone cams, to bridge cams. Pentax-Ricoh is active in all of them. Fully electric/mirrorless exchangeable lens cameras, ranging from Q system to APS-C like the NEX-7. Pentax will offer something for the high end here as well, wait and see. I think noone should be concerned as this segment is still at an early stage with much to come. I bet that some others will offer a competitve product to the Q in the future ... DSLR, ranging from entry to high end level. I do not miss a FF cam from Pentax. The K-5 was compared and rated with the FF competition and turned out to be more than competitive. FF size was good for film SLR cameras. For DSLR, I do not see the big advantage of the FF sensor as the APS-C sensors are so good. E.g., Sony has better APS-C sensors than FF sensors in their own cameras. If I would need more resolution, dynamic and details and high end optics, I would go for a 645D. Eriol Last edited by Eriol; 01-10-2012 at 06:34 AM.

01-10-2012, 07:27 AM - 1 Like	#2022
Clavius Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: De Klundert Photos: Gallery Posts: 4,150	I really don't understand why people who love the idea of a mirrorless camera, can still dislike the Q. It's a neat little camera that has the same big disadvantages any other EVIL will have: it doesn't have a OVF, drains power, and is to small to be handled by any normal sized male. The Q has settled itself in the same niche any other mirrorless camera will find itself in. Last edited by Clavius; 01-10-2012 at 12:26 PM.

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
Full frame pentax	cem.kumuk	Pentax DSLR Discussion	11	11-12-2010 03:13 PM
Pentax and Full Frame...	Shutter-bug	Photographic Technique	60	11-03-2010 10:03 AM
Pentax A 50/1.2 on Full Frame	aegisphan	Pentax SLR Lens Discussion	23	10-28-2010 04:16 PM
News Regarding Advertising on PentaxForums.com: An Official Statement	Adam	Site Suggestions and Help	5	03-24-2010 07:37 PM
Official: New DSLR Body is Coming; Full Frame Model is Under Planning!	RiceHigh	Pentax News and Rumors	78	08-04-2008 06:18 PM

01-09-2012, 11:10 PM	#2011
Kryscendo Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 222	I just want Pentax to just make a badass camera. The X10 is a badass camera. It has old school aesthetics, and a feature set that just says, "Yes, this is a what a real camera is." To be honest, the Samsung NX100 didn't sell all that well, but at least it sold. The X10 in my Best Buy has still been sitting there, though we sold one on day 1 to someone who preordered it.

01-09-2012, 11:17 PM	#2012
pinholecam Pentaxian Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: North Photos: Gallery Posts: 4,706	Originally posted by jsherman999 Good luck in this tier, Ricoh. You're going to need it. Unfortunately, the window of opportunity of an APS-C mirrorless is closing (or closed) real fast with NX, NEX, Fuji and even Canon offerings.

01-09-2012, 11:22 PM	#2013
Kryscendo Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 222	I think Ricoh will have to get into the EVIL market in a big and bold way to really make an impact in 2013.

01-10-2012, 12:08 AM	#2014
Zygonyx Pentaxian Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: Ile de France Posts: 4,033	Originally posted by Kryscendo I just want Pentax to just make a badass camera. The X10 is a badass camera. It has old school aesthetics, and a feature set that just says, "Yes, this is a what a real camera is." To be honest, the Samsung NX100 didn't sell all that well, but at least it sold. The X10 in my Best Buy has still been sitting there, though we sold one on day 1 to someone who preordered it. So what do you mean, Pentax to issue badass camera that is commercial succes ?

01-10-2012, 12:18 AM	#2015
Clavius Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: De Klundert Photos: Gallery Posts: 4,150	Originally posted by Kryscendo I just want Pentax to just make a badass camera. The X10 is a badass camera. It has old school aesthetics, and a feature set that just says, "Yes, this is a what a real camera is." That is a matter of personal taste and opinion. When I look at the x10, I see a tiny point-and-shoot with the added gimmick of interchangeble lenses. Maybe a bridgecamera towards real SLR's.

01-10-2012, 01:32 AM	#2016
gazonk Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Oslo area, Norway Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,746	Originally posted by Clavius When I look at the x10, I see a tiny point-and-shoot with the added gimmick of interchangeble lenses. Well, you have to look a little harder next time, that lens isn't interchangeable

01-10-2012, 01:33 AM	#2017
Clavius Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: De Klundert Photos: Gallery Posts: 4,150	Originally posted by gazonk Well, you have to look a little harder next time, that lens isn't interchangeable Ah, in that case, it's nothing more then a point and shoot for grandma's purse.

01-10-2012, 03:49 AM	#2018
Kryscendo Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 222	Well, it obviously works for Leica. You don't see Leica ever fretting about marketshare or any of that non-sense. They just work up overpriced status symbols in the form of cameras. That and I still want an M9.

01-10-2012, 04:00 AM - 1 Like	#2019
Kryscendo Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 222	Originally posted by Zygonyx So what do you mean, Pentax to issue badass camera that is commercial succes ? In my opinion, Pentax should just be Pentax. It will never be Nikon or Canon or Sony and will probably lose its identity if it tried to. The Pentax of old made reliable cameras, was the benchmark for student photographers (this has since faded), and was a strong contender in Medium format. Personally, I would love it if Pentax just obsessed over making the finest camera it can in more classes. The K-5 was a big win for Pentax, but it is only in the high quality APS-C bracket. The K-r and K-x were good for the entry level buyers. The 645D brought support for the old 645 glass into the modern era and speaks well for Pentax. Where Pentax could do better is entering a few new arenas. Namely, Full-frame and maybe even adding a rangefinder. The Q might have been ambitious but it just is the wrong mix of unimpressive sensor and high price compared to the Sony Nex and other cameras in the compact mirrorless arena. Really, Pentax could offer a wide variety of quality cameras easily. Good, better, best SLR offerings. Medium format for a flagship. A new digital rangefinder would be sexy too. Oh, and why not make a revival of the K1000 for current photography students? My former community college bought a round of Vivitar film cameras only to have half the fleet survive the semester. They then bought used K1000s and most of them are still in use.

01-10-2012, 06:10 AM	#2020
eddie1960 Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Toronto Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 13,666	Originally posted by Kryscendo In my opinion, Pentax should just be Pentax. It will never be Nikon or Canon or Sony and will probably lose its identity if it tried to. The Pentax of old made reliable cameras, was the benchmark for student photographers (this has since faded), and was a strong contender in Medium format. Personally, I would love it if Pentax just obsessed over making the finest camera it can in more classes. The K-5 was a big win for Pentax, but it is only in the high quality APS-C bracket. The K-r and K-x were good for the entry level buyers. The 645D brought support for the old 645 glass into the modern era and speaks well for Pentax. Where Pentax could do better is entering a few new arenas. Namely, Full-frame and maybe even adding a rangefinder. The Q might have been ambitious but it just is the wrong mix of unimpressive sensor and high price compared to the Sony Nex and other cameras in the compact mirrorless arena. Really, Pentax could offer a wide variety of quality cameras easily. Good, better, best SLR offerings. Medium format for a flagship. A new digital rangefinder would be sexy too. Oh, and why not make a revival of the K1000 for current photography students? My former community college bought a round of Vivitar film cameras only to have half the fleet survive the semester. They then bought used K1000s and most of them are still in use. While i can see good better best dslr MF as flagship I don't see an RF. it's never been a Pentax thing (and I am a huge RF fan so it's not like I would hate the idea) RF is more expensive to make due to the cost of the focus mechanism. the Fuji was an innovative way of giving some of the RF feel and look without the complex mechanism. Leica makes the only true RF and they don't make for mass market so they price as they wish. Film RF Voigtlander (cosina) makes affordable and well designed ones but stated they have no interest in a digital (after the epson they co-developed) Zeiss has not said no interest but they have said not at this time. Maybe taking Pentax Tech knowledge Ricoh could partner with Cosina or Zeiss on the RF tech to release a Ricoh where therre is a history of RF models - but with the m mountor why would they. I can see a FF Milc entry along with a FF dslr that they spread the costs across 2 bodies and enter the MILC market with a model no-one else has at the higher end - and giving the 3rd DSLR to the good better best strategy.

01-10-2012, 07:34 AM	#2023
SMC-man Inactive Account Join Date: May 2010 Location: London Photos: Gallery Posts: 10	So 2012 is something of a crunch year for Pentax/Ricoh as far as the infamously rumored "full frame" camera is concerned. If they produce one with a FF chip and a big bright OVF, and retaining the K-mount, I'll buy it tomorrow. But somehow I doubt that this is going to happen... So even though I'm a Pentax man through and through, and have been since 1975, I simply can not wait any longer for the upgrade from my K-x, and think that this may be the time to change to Nikon (D700) and sell all my Takumars & other Pentax lenses and to replace them with Nikkors instead !

01-10-2012, 08:00 AM	#2024
RonHendriks1966 Banned Join Date: Jan 2009 Photos: Gallery Posts: 9,675	Fuji and Samsung made the choice to stick with APS-C intheir MILC camera's. So for Pentax there is still FF or APS-H to stand out.

01-10-2012, 08:21 AM	#2025
gazonk Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Oslo area, Norway Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,746	Originally posted by RonHendriks1966 Fuji and Samsung made the choice to stick with APS-C intheir MILC camera's. So for Pentax there is still FF or APS-H to stand out. I wonder how much point there is in MILC FF cameras at this point in time, there's not really that much to save on size and weight when a normal lens has a focal length of ~50 mm. Maybe Pentax would be better off making the world's smallest and lightest FF DSLR...