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07-31-2013, 08:14 AM   #1381
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QuoteOriginally posted by Anvh Quote
Like you say there is a lot more to improve, the camera is only 10% of the work.

Tracking was never pentax strong point so they should not focus on the sport photograph to be honest.
For the rest the new AF seems to work fine and the flash system can be improved of course but when you look at the gains. Surely they are nice but for studio photography hardly anyone use it and i've also heard complains about the creative system so it's not much green.

But to go back down to earth, do you think you can spot the difference in the images made with low tier FF compared to high tier APS-C?
AF tracking is a feature that needs work to compete with Canikon and to complement AF-C. I agree that between my K-x and K-30 the AF has gotten light years better and now matches a Nikon for AF-S shooting in all light conditions. More crosspoints etc. would be welcome.

The AF200 flash should be reworked into a WR model with tilt/swivel and an adepter so that 2 could be paired into side macro lights to go with the 100 WR lens. The other 2 flashes (360/540) should be combined into a single, tilt/swivel model. Why there are 3 levels of off--board flash for a 2-body camera system is a puzzle. Third party flashes are eating OEM stuff recently.

If Pentax was smart and made a tiny APS-C sensor DSLR (*ist size) they could also make a small tilt/swivel flash that draws battery power from the camera itself and uses only 2 AA batteries. The Ricoh GR could share this flash. Other brands are tweaking flash systems as strobism has a nice little following but Pentax and Ricoh are stranded here. None of this is a major engineering feat. Lots can be borrowed ideas.

Rarely can I spot FF vs. APS-C on a normal monitor without the original file, I agree. But that's not what sells cameras. People's wants sell cameras up to a price point cap.

07-31-2013, 10:35 AM   #1382
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9 out of 11 is not bad right Canon has less with their lower tier...
There needs to be changed a lot with AF-C not just the camera, but i can't even remeber the last time i used that mode.

They should change the P-TTL completely, it never worked well and indeed an upgrade for the flashes might be nice.
For strobist many seem to favor manual modes for the flash so that shouldn't be that importing.

Mhmm a small ASP-C would be nice, maybe even a special mount to make it even smaller and the lenses faster. Many don't like that idea though. I'm all for smaller, have been playing with the idea to get m4/3 for on the road/personal work and 645 for in the studio.

Even with original it's hard, my partner use a 5D mkII and i a K5. There isn't much between them, the colours are the best indication to see which is which.
10-30-2013, 06:10 AM   #1383
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QuoteOriginally posted by Winder Quote
I don't care as much about a 135mm body as I want to see some serious glass. To me sensor size is not as important as having a DA* 135mm f/1.8 or a D-FA* 85mm f/1.4 with something better than SDM.
It seems to me that unlike Sony, Pentax already has some pretty nice glass on the shelves that would do an FF body proud. eh?
12-14-2013, 12:24 AM   #1384
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QuoteOriginally posted by Adam Quote
I have been told by our friends over at Pentaxeros (the Spanish Pentax community) that "it is believed" that a full-frame is on its way . . .


All I want for Christmas...

12-14-2013, 01:26 AM   #1385
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Hey all, Pentax needs a two prong attack, one FF D-LX, FF, it could be a simple digital back with focus peaking, or somthing on those lines, bring back the metal, for a FF stillls camera, and the apature! and DOF preview. Mabey offer an Updated FF On LX lines, no video, add shake reduction, and for vidiographers, a upscale K-01. with all that is has with more, like sturdier build, whether sealing, and headphone jack. FF, not nessisary, but full manual control is, as well as, full High Def, in 60p, and 24p, and 25p. Cannon sells half their cameras to videoographers, that never use auto focus, as a machine doed not know how to rack focus. Cannon video-ographers use all 3rd party lenses manual lenses, but Pentax! The best manual focus lenses. This is an openining to pentax to make a pro level L-X2, for use as a manual focus,video supremo camera, to complement the stills oriented D-LX. JMOP
12-14-2013, 05:33 AM   #1386
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QuoteOriginally posted by all thumbs Quote
All I want for Christmas...
It won't be for Christmas, but we may all begin to wonder why it should take much longer than CP+ for Ricoh to bring the first ever digital Pentax 35mm to the table. Sony seems to have little trouble releasing two mirror less FF camera's with just one available dedicated lens, and rumors are that more Sony FF cameras are coming next spring. How difficult can it be for Pentax to release just one normal K3 style FF camera? Does that really have to take years and years? Being an attractive brand is not just about eventually releasing a good product, it's also about doing that timely.
If CP+ goes by in february without the announcement of a Pentax FF camera, the Sony A7 it will be, with a novoflex adapter...

Chris
12-14-2013, 03:25 PM   #1387
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QuoteOriginally posted by Chris Mak Quote
.. Being an attractive brand is not just about eventually releasing a good product, it's also about doing that timely.
If CP+ goes by in february without the announcement of a Pentax FF camera, the Sony A7 it will be, with a novoflex adapter...
Chris
It is most likely that the FF will a fresh start in many ways. So it won't come before the FY 2014, which starts April 2014. I don't doubt for a second that there will be FF next year, but I doubt that any of current Pentax users have any good idea how seriously Pentax engineers are to take and deliver an FF camera.

It will, for sure, be no 'just another FF'. There is a matter of personal pride, so to say, and concern, because Pentax was the company that has defined the 35 mm SLR. And in times of digital SLR, they will undoubtedly try to redefine — or at least refine — the experience of a 35mm DSLR as well. If others have stretched the FF concept in different directions that border to total user-unfriedliness, they will undoubtedly come to resolve many incongruences others are happy to live with.

Thus I would not say "Why it takes them so long?", but I'd rather say, "Why others take so little time to seriously think about their products, and therefore release model after model without any serious thought or concern for their users?"
12-14-2013, 05:47 PM   #1388
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QuoteOriginally posted by Uluru Quote
It is most likely that the FF will a fresh start in many ways. So it won't come before the FY 2014, which starts April 2014. I don't doubt for a second that there will be FF next year, but I doubt that any of current Pentax users have any good idea how seriously Pentax engineers are to take and deliver an FF camera.

It will, for sure, be no 'just another FF'. There is a matter of personal pride, so to say, and concern, because Pentax was the company that has defined the 35 mm SLR. And in times of digital SLR, they will undoubtedly try to redefine — or at least refine — the experience of a 35mm DSLR as well. If others have stretched the FF concept in different directions that border to total user-unfriedliness, they will undoubtedly come to resolve many incongruences others are happy to live with.

Thus I would not say "Why it takes them so long?", but I'd rather say, "Why others take so little time to seriously think about their products, and therefore release model after model without any serious thought or concern for their users?"
You know, I sympathize with your view, and in a way I like Pentax for wanting to get it right now, after the way they were left on a dead end with Hoya's ownership. I like the K3 release, it is not for me (I have the K5IIs), but the camera is inspiring as a crop sensor body.
But in another way I sympathize with Sony's approach: bring FF to the people. I have always felt an affinity with 35mm, but the portability and pricing of Apsc was attractive. In the film days a 35mm camera was portable ánd affordable. With digital photography, FF has become a luxury, a niche almost due to the high price of FF sensors. This may be attractive to some who maybe see it as a "pro" feature, but to me it is completely against my instincts. 35mm shoúld be mainstream, like it always was in the film days. Crop sensor just doesn't have the way of rendering 35mm has with the lenses, it feels (stíll feels) unnatural to me. It may be wonderful for others as a system, but I greatly prefer FF. Sony has the approach to sell móre FF sensors to bring the price down, and some may view this as cheap, but just consider the price of an Olympus OM film camera body and compare that with the price of a Canon 5DIII. I know with digital you don't have to spend on film and developing anymore, and it is a lame comparison, but I still feel FF should become mainstream: reasonably portable, and affordable in the coming years. I hope Sony succeeds in this, even when it puts an apparent strain on other camera makers.
In other words: I'm not in the market for a future high end special FF camera that costs a lot, I just want affordable FF IQ that's within reach and in the foreseeable future. So I hope that before Pentax starts thinking about conquering the FF market with a long term project that tries to redefine the FF shooting experience, they will first just grab the K3 body, stuff a 24mp Sony FF sensor in it and bring it to market at a competitive price. I can understand the reasons why, if that will not happen, but then I will just rather go with Sony...

Chris


Last edited by Chris Mak; 12-14-2013 at 05:55 PM.
02-12-2014, 02:58 AM   #1389
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I can think of 25 excellent reasons for a Pentax FF camera:

Contax N Digital (2002)

Canon EOS-1Ds (2002)
Canon EOS-1Ds Mark II (2004)
Canon EOS 5D (2005)
Canon EOS-1Ds Mark III (2007)
Canon EOS 5D Mark II (2008)
Canon EOS-1D X (2012)
Canon EOS 5D Mark III (2012)
Canon EOS 6D (2012)

Kodak DCS Pro 14n (2003)
Kodak DCS Pro SLR/n (2004)

Nikon D3 (2007)
Nikon D700 (2008)
Nikon D3X (2008)
Nikon D3S (2009)
Nikon D4 (2012)
Nikon D800, Nikon D800E (2012)
Nikon D600 (2012)
Nikon D610 (013)
Nikon Df (2013)

Sony a DSLR-A900 (2008)
Sony a DSLR-A850 (2009)[14]
Sony a SLT-A99,_ Sony a SLT-A99V (2012)
02-12-2014, 03:37 AM   #1390
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QuoteOriginally posted by Beaugrand Quote
I can think of 25 excellent reasons for a Pentax FF camera:

Contax N Digital (2002)
That first one right there is actually a very good reason for Pentax NOT to do it. It's what killed Contax. And very nearly Pentax too, if they hadn't pulled the plug on that FF K-mount prototype.
02-12-2014, 10:59 PM   #1391
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Well both Kodak DCS Pro 14n (2003) and Kodak DCS Pro SLR/n (2004) weren't quite interesting either I believe.
I fear Nikon Df isn't either but that's no sensor reason obviously.

02-13-2014, 01:55 AM   #1392
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QuoteOriginally posted by thibs Quote
Well both Kodak DCS Pro 14n (2003) and Kodak DCS Pro SLR/n (2004) weren't quite interesting either I believe.
Those cameras seem to have some really devoted fans, though!

(there was also a DCS Pro SLR/c (Canon mount))
02-15-2014, 10:14 PM   #1393
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My next major purchase is going to be a FF camera, probably an EOS 6D. I have the T3 and the T3i, and appropriate lenses. I'd rather go with a FF Pentax because most of my lenses are PK variants, and I've stayed loyal to Pentax for that reason, but FF beckons.
02-16-2014, 09:29 AM   #1394
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Round and round we go.
Just because its proper in this thread to constantly restate the same things, my reasons for FF are that I want to get more in the frame with the same level of magnification, I don't like going to a wider lens and making everything smaller. I would happily trot around a 645D if I could afford the system.
Also now that another thread with the Sony and adapter has proven that old glass that was good before still looks great on digital FF I can definitely state that already having all FF lenses is another huge reason for me to want it.

Once the AF system (already much better) and the flash system (still sub par) among other things gets to pro levels in the Pentax systems then they will be ready to release the FF.
Why rush to put out a camera body type where a large part of the market is picky pro's (or wannabe pro's that just buy the "best"), if those people wouldn't accept it with Pentax's current level of technology.
There is also the minor backlog of other tech they wanted to get out first. Apparently things are far enough along for a FF to be released if they are on final prep for the 645D II since that camera wouldn't be acceptable with shoddy systems either. I would expect when they are done with the 645 release things will finally be ready, but I am not 100% sure on a 2014 date. I actually think they will run the 645/APSC duo for awhile longer. Both are markets they can do better in right now than FF and they can hold up a 645 as the brand flagship model with a lot more pride than the competitions FF bodies despite the massive price difference. Do remember that the Pentax 645 system undercuts the rest of the MF market by a massive price margin so its quite sellable to them.
02-17-2014, 07:40 AM   #1395
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QuoteOriginally posted by Chris Mak Quote
If CP+ goes by in february without the announcement of a Pentax FF camera, the Sony A7 it will be, with a novoflex adapter...
Where would the sensor for such a Pentax FF camera come from anyway?
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