Pentax Full Frame Dream Crushed Today

TOUGEFC · 04-25-2012, 11:10 PM

I have to say, Im very pumped about the D600!!

the swede · 04-25-2012, 11:18 PM

Originally posted by TOUGEFC

I have to say, Im very pumped about the D600!!

+1

Already made my move a month ago, im excited!!!

Just cant let go of this Forum

I love PF

mecrox · 04-25-2012, 11:37 PM

Originally posted by bossa

Yes but lenses are only 1/2 the story.

As are bodies, as is APS-C itself. Besides, road maps are a dodgy business, often more honoured in the breach.

mecrox · 04-26-2012, 12:27 AM

Originally posted by Kunzite

Pentax was quite clear about the direction they're going. 8 new K-mount lenses in 2 years, remember?

Show me the advertising and marketing campaign which makes that clear to an end-user and which means they are laying down the money. I'm not singling out Pentax, but doing stuff is what counts not talking about it. In the case of Pentax, in the recent interview with their marketing guy he said Pentax was about exploiting niches and opportunities not occupied by others. A downside of that is avoiding committing yourself to anything. Niche A this time, niche B next time is not a strategy and I don't think it gives folks much idea of where an outfit is really coming from.

v5planet · 04-26-2012, 12:30 AM

Originally posted by TOUGEFC

I have to say, Im very pumped about the D600!!

+1 on that one. I consider FF Nikon an inevitability for me unless Pentax pulls a very shiny rabbit out of their hat before I scrounge together the funds. I will be very keen to see just what the D600 ends up being (or D400, or D500 or whatever they end up calling it).

Kunzite · 04-26-2012, 12:46 AM

Originally posted by mecrox

Show me the advertising and marketing campaign which makes that clear to an end-user and which means they are laying down the money. I'm not singling out Pentax, but doing stuff is what counts not talking about it. In the case of Pentax, in the recent interview with their marketing guy he said Pentax was about exploiting niches and opportunities not occupied by others. A downside of that is avoiding committing yourself to anything. Niche A this time, niche B next time is not a strategy and I don't think it gives folks much idea of where an outfit is really coming from.

It's not my job to do it, and besides what is important is to know they're laying down the money in real products, not in advertising and marketing campaigns.
A roadmap is a promise of real products. A marketing campaign, empty words (unless it's the "Just hold a Pentax" old slogan

)
I don't know where you're getting that "avoiding committing yourself to anything" - which is the opposite of what they're doing.

bossa · 04-26-2012, 12:47 AM

Originally posted by mecrox

Show me the advertising and marketing campaign which makes that clear to an end-user and which means they are laying down the money. I'm not singling out Pentax, but doing stuff is what counts not talking about it. In the case of Pentax, in the recent interview with their marketing guy he said Pentax was about exploiting niches and opportunities not occupied by others. A downside of that is avoiding committing yourself to anything. Niche A this time, niche B next time is not a strategy and I don't think it gives folks much idea of where an outfit is really coming from.

Well said.

Caat · 04-26-2012, 12:55 AM

Originally posted by mecrox

Show me the advertising and marketing campaign which makes that clear to an end-user and which means they are laying down the money. I'm not singling out Pentax, but doing stuff is what counts not talking about it. In the case of Pentax, in the recent interview with their marketing guy he said Pentax was about exploiting niches and opportunities not occupied by others. A downside of that is avoiding committing yourself to anything. Niche A this time, niche B next time is not a strategy and I don't think it gives folks much idea of where an outfit is really coming from.

Indeed.

And Pentax has a habit of not following through it's roadmaps even close to on time. We've been waiting for the telephoto for years, ditto the teleconvertor. The 30mm lens *eventually* turned into the 35mm 2.4. The 60-250mm was months late etc etc.

Quite frankly lens road maps mean pretty much nothing and at best are misleading or confusing to the consumer, which is precisely why Hoya stopped doing them. Although actually they stopped doing them because it looked bad when they inevitably failed to deliver something 'promised' on the roadmap.

Kunzite · 04-26-2012, 01:10 AM

Yes, Pentax, in the midst of cost cutting, R&D personnel forced into retirement but still being asked to increase the profit margins, being prepared to be sold - they weren't able to deliver everything on the roadmap, and in time.

bossa · 04-26-2012, 01:33 AM

It'd be nice they included camera bodies on their road maps though.. may not be smart business practice but at least the punters would have more than a clue to go by.

RonHendriks1966 · 04-26-2012, 01:52 AM

Originally posted by ElJamoquio

Of course. And of course Nikon just announced their entry-ish level camera has the Pentax 'flagship' sensor! Eek!

Well this is nothing new for the camera business. Look at Canon and their 18mp sensor, it goes into very different camera's. Some of the specs of a camera make also a difference. At this time there are no "bad" sensors for aps-c or FF in production. One can not expect that the number of different sensors will grow enourmos since the technology is to expensive. Differences in bit-rate, fps and AA filters make them apart. The camera's are making a difference in speed of image building, AF and some other futures like moviemode.

I think that a 24 mp sensor would be great for a first Pentax FF. If it is the sensor from D3x or a further development from that sensor then I couldn't think of a reason why that wouldn't make a great camera.

I hope it does 6 fps and has a new and very good AF-system.

TOUGEFC · 04-26-2012, 02:38 AM

Originally posted by RonHendriks1966

and very good AF-system.

If Pentax does bring out a FF , its AF system will be very poor at tracking.

the swede · 04-26-2012, 03:21 AM

Originally posted by TOUGEFC

If Pentax does bring out a FF , its AF system will be very poor at tracking.

The hard core Pentaxians will forgive that, after all the moaning and complaining.
But its not the best for Pentax imho... They'd better concentrate on flash system and AF. Practice that on the lower segment and then unleash it on the top segment.

gtxtom · 04-26-2012, 04:58 AM

I think AF is a good part of the reason I just switched to Nikon (D800 on the way ... sometime soon ...). I was getting pretty frustrated with the K-5. I would hate to see a FF Pentax with the same problems.

Na Horuk · 04-26-2012, 05:03 AM

The AF would be more forgivable if at least the MF would be great, but the DA lenses really aren't very great at that, either, and the focus confirm is sometimes off. So yes, AF should be fixed. I just hope Pentax didn't solely concentrate on FF (due to all the whinging about it) and drop the ball on all the other aspects.

04-25-2012, 11:37 PM	#783
mecrox Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Oxford, UK Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,375	Originally posted by bossa Yes but lenses are only 1/2 the story. As are bodies, as is APS-C itself. Besides, road maps are a dodgy business, often more honoured in the breach. Last edited by mecrox; 04-26-2012 at 12:27 AM.

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04-25-2012, 11:10 PM	#781
TOUGEFC Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Brisbane Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,561	I have to say, Im very pumped about the D600!!

04-25-2012, 11:18 PM	#782
the swede Inactive Account Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 2,310	Originally posted by TOUGEFC I have to say, Im very pumped about the D600!! +1 Already made my move a month ago, im excited!!! Just cant let go of this Forum I love PF

04-26-2012, 12:27 AM	#784
mecrox Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Oxford, UK Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,375	Originally posted by Kunzite Pentax was quite clear about the direction they're going. 8 new K-mount lenses in 2 years, remember? Show me the advertising and marketing campaign which makes that clear to an end-user and which means they are laying down the money. I'm not singling out Pentax, but doing stuff is what counts not talking about it. In the case of Pentax, in the recent interview with their marketing guy he said Pentax was about exploiting niches and opportunities not occupied by others. A downside of that is avoiding committing yourself to anything. Niche A this time, niche B next time is not a strategy and I don't think it gives folks much idea of where an outfit is really coming from.

04-26-2012, 12:30 AM	#785
v5planet Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Seattle Photos: Albums Posts: 1,915	Originally posted by TOUGEFC I have to say, Im very pumped about the D600!! +1 on that one. I consider FF Nikon an inevitability for me unless Pentax pulls a very shiny rabbit out of their hat before I scrounge together the funds. I will be very keen to see just what the D600 ends up being (or D400, or D500 or whatever they end up calling it).

04-26-2012, 12:46 AM	#786
Kunzite Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Romania Posts: 15,132	Originally posted by mecrox Show me the advertising and marketing campaign which makes that clear to an end-user and which means they are laying down the money. I'm not singling out Pentax, but doing stuff is what counts not talking about it. In the case of Pentax, in the recent interview with their marketing guy he said Pentax was about exploiting niches and opportunities not occupied by others. A downside of that is avoiding committing yourself to anything. Niche A this time, niche B next time is not a strategy and I don't think it gives folks much idea of where an outfit is really coming from. It's not my job to do it, and besides what is important is to know they're laying down the money in real products, not in advertising and marketing campaigns. A roadmap is a promise of real products. A marketing campaign, empty words (unless it's the "Just hold a Pentax" old slogan ) I don't know where you're getting that "avoiding committing yourself to anything" - which is the opposite of what they're doing.

04-26-2012, 12:47 AM	#787
bossa Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Adelaide Posts: 4,546	Originally posted by mecrox Show me the advertising and marketing campaign which makes that clear to an end-user and which means they are laying down the money. I'm not singling out Pentax, but doing stuff is what counts not talking about it. In the case of Pentax, in the recent interview with their marketing guy he said Pentax was about exploiting niches and opportunities not occupied by others. A downside of that is avoiding committing yourself to anything. Niche A this time, niche B next time is not a strategy and I don't think it gives folks much idea of where an outfit is really coming from. Well said.

04-26-2012, 12:55 AM	#788
Caat Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: United Kingdom Photos: Albums Posts: 927	Originally posted by mecrox Show me the advertising and marketing campaign which makes that clear to an end-user and which means they are laying down the money. I'm not singling out Pentax, but doing stuff is what counts not talking about it. In the case of Pentax, in the recent interview with their marketing guy he said Pentax was about exploiting niches and opportunities not occupied by others. A downside of that is avoiding committing yourself to anything. Niche A this time, niche B next time is not a strategy and I don't think it gives folks much idea of where an outfit is really coming from. Indeed. And Pentax has a habit of not following through it's roadmaps even close to on time. We've been waiting for the telephoto for years, ditto the teleconvertor. The 30mm lens eventually turned into the 35mm 2.4. The 60-250mm was months late etc etc. Quite frankly lens road maps mean pretty much nothing and at best are misleading or confusing to the consumer, which is precisely why Hoya stopped doing them. Although actually they stopped doing them because it looked bad when they inevitably failed to deliver something 'promised' on the roadmap.

04-26-2012, 01:10 AM	#789
Kunzite Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Romania Posts: 15,132	Yes, Pentax, in the midst of cost cutting, R&D personnel forced into retirement but still being asked to increase the profit margins, being prepared to be sold - they weren't able to deliver everything on the roadmap, and in time.

04-26-2012, 01:33 AM	#790
bossa Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Adelaide Posts: 4,546	It'd be nice they included camera bodies on their road maps though.. may not be smart business practice but at least the punters would have more than a clue to go by.

04-26-2012, 01:52 AM	#791
RonHendriks1966 Banned Join Date: Jan 2009 Photos: Gallery Posts: 9,675	Originally posted by ElJamoquio Of course. And of course Nikon just announced their entry-ish level camera has the Pentax 'flagship' sensor! Eek! Well this is nothing new for the camera business. Look at Canon and their 18mp sensor, it goes into very different camera's. Some of the specs of a camera make also a difference. At this time there are no "bad" sensors for aps-c or FF in production. One can not expect that the number of different sensors will grow enourmos since the technology is to expensive. Differences in bit-rate, fps and AA filters make them apart. The camera's are making a difference in speed of image building, AF and some other futures like moviemode. I think that a 24 mp sensor would be great for a first Pentax FF. If it is the sensor from D3x or a further development from that sensor then I couldn't think of a reason why that wouldn't make a great camera. I hope it does 6 fps and has a new and very good AF-system.

04-26-2012, 02:38 AM	#792
TOUGEFC Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Brisbane Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,561	Originally posted by RonHendriks1966 and very good AF-system. If Pentax does bring out a FF , its AF system will be very poor at tracking.

04-26-2012, 03:21 AM	#793
the swede Inactive Account Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 2,310	Originally posted by TOUGEFC If Pentax does bring out a FF , its AF system will be very poor at tracking. The hard core Pentaxians will forgive that, after all the moaning and complaining. But its not the best for Pentax imho... They'd better concentrate on flash system and AF. Practice that on the lower segment and then unleash it on the top segment.

04-26-2012, 04:58 AM	#794
gtxtom Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Philly Posts: 395	I think AF is a good part of the reason I just switched to Nikon (D800 on the way ... sometime soon ...). I was getting pretty frustrated with the K-5. I would hate to see a FF Pentax with the same problems.

04-26-2012, 05:03 AM	#795
Na Horuk Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Slovenia, probably Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 11,186	The AF would be more forgivable if at least the MF would be great, but the DA lenses really aren't very great at that, either, and the focus confirm is sometimes off. So yes, AF should be fixed. I just hope Pentax didn't solely concentrate on FF (due to all the whinging about it) and drop the ball on all the other aspects.