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10-11-2012, 02:58 PM   #211
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What this is going to turn into a discussion of what fits in my camera bag? It's that I hate carrying the camera bag. But if that's what you want to talk about here's what fits in my camera bag, wait, I have 4 camera bags... which one? OK then the biggest one. The DA 60*-250 the 10-17 fisheye, the DA 18-135, the 21 ltd, 35 2.4 and 50 primes, my teleconverter, batteries a right angle viewfinder adapter my tripod mount for the 60-250. Is this in any way relevant to the conversation. I still hate carrying a camera bag. Yesterday's hike was 13km. I carried a camera case for the 60-250 with auxiliary pouches for the 18-135 and 35 one the side. I left a lot of stuff at home and I still didn't like carrying it.There is just no easy way to carry a DA*6-250 13 km and be happy about it.

Or as someone put it before I bought this lens. "Those long lenses, they suck the life out of you." I didn't listen.

Now about that FF Pentax that's coming.... what great news. Now I'll have to carry another 650 grams.

10-11-2012, 03:11 PM   #212
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
Now about that FF Pentax that's coming.... what great news. Now I'll have to carry another 650 grams.
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10-11-2012, 04:10 PM   #213
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
What this is going to turn into a discussion of what fits in my camera bag? It's that I hate carrying the camera bag. But if that's what you want to talk about here's what fits in my camera bag, wait, I have 4 camera bags... which one? OK then the biggest one. The DA 60*-250 the 10-17 fisheye, the DA 18-135, the 21 ltd, 35 2.4 and 50 primes, my teleconverter, batteries a right angle viewfinder adapter my tripod mount for the 60-250. Is this in any way relevant to the conversation. I still hate carrying a camera bag. Yesterday's hike was 13km. I carried a camera case for the 60-250 with auxiliary pouches for the 18-135 and 35 one the side. I left a lot of stuff at home and I still didn't like carrying it.There is just no easy way to carry a DA*6-250 13 km and be happy about it.

Or as someone put it before I bought this lens. "Those long lenses, they suck the life out of you." I didn't listen.

Now about that FF Pentax that's coming.... what great news. Now I'll have to carry another 650 grams.
You need to bring along some young able bodied photography students or boy/girl scouts as your beasts of burden.
10-11-2012, 07:55 PM   #214
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QuoteOriginally posted by illdefined Quote
I think Sony heard the criticism (and the m4/3rds competition) and is starting to do a better job
It's not enough just to make the lenses smaller; they also have to make them better. I don't hold out any high hopes for the Sony 16-50. It's going to be hard for Sony to make small lenses as good as Olympus does, not only because Olympus is better at it, but Olympus is working with a smaller sensor that works better for mirrorless in terms of building a complete system.

QuoteOriginally posted by illdefined Quote
agree with you here, but if intentionally choosing a bigger camera, wouldn't it generally be preferable to carry the biggest sensor the mount allows?
That depends if you can afford it and/or if you want to bear the extra weight. What if you want a mid-sized camera? What if you find the mirrorless cams too small and the FF DSLRs too big? What if you want a Goldilocks camera, a camera that is just the right size? In a large market you're going to see lots of choices: products to fit everyone's needs. There's no need to herd everyone into mirrorless and/or FF ghettoes.

QuoteOriginally posted by Winder Quote
You don't need more than 3-4 lenses to do a wedding, and none of the big monsters. A Full Frame Evil with 5 lenses in the system would meet the needs of this entire industry.
Don't most wedding photographers use zooms? A few years back I heard a wedding photography say that the 70-200/2.8 is the favorite lens for wedding photogs. That would pretty much would take the mirrorless FF out of the equation for many, if not most, wedding photogs.

10-11-2012, 08:15 PM   #215
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QuoteOriginally posted by northcoastgreg Quote
It's not enough just to make the lenses smaller; they also have to make them better. I don't hold out any high hopes for the Sony 16-50. It's going to be hard for Sony to make small lenses as good as Olympus does, not only because Olympus is better at it, but Olympus is working with a smaller sensor that works better for mirrorless in terms of building a complete system.
I was responding to your note about Sony NEX lens sizes, but in regards to your quality concern, the Panasonic 16-35mm 2.8 also looks to be excellent.

QuoteOriginally posted by northcoastgreg Quote
That depends if you can afford it and/or if you want to bear the extra weight. What if you want a mid-sized camera? What if you find the mirrorless cams too small and the FF DSLRs too big? What if you want a Goldilocks camera, a camera that is just the right size? In a large market you're going to see lots of choices: products to fit everyone's needs. There's no need to herd everyone into mirrorless and/or FF ghettoes.
an FF camera doesn't have to be any bigger/heavier than a K-5. keeping a built-in flash and FF SR plate, perhaps no bigger than a K20D, K-mount is intrinsically FF afterall. price and lens selection is an issue still, so APS-C should absolutely remain as an option.
10-11-2012, 08:20 PM   #216
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QuoteOriginally posted by northcoastgreg Quote
Don't most wedding photographers use zooms? A few years back I heard a wedding photography say that the 70-200/2.8 is the favorite lens for wedding photogs. That would pretty much would take the mirrorless FF out of the equation for many, if not most, wedding photogs.
The Canon 85L is probably the current holy grail for wedding togs. Canon has dominated this industry since the 5D. I know a couple of pretty strong wedding 'togs who are in the $3,000 and up range and I think one of them uses the Nikon 14-24 F/2.8, but I'm pretty sure they are pretty much prime shooters. I originally got my 24-70L for that purpose, but I don't do many weddings and my Contax 645 is pretty much all I use for that. There has been a big resurgence of Contax 645 shooters for weddings and film.

I know one wedding 'tog who bought a Fuji XP-1 when it first came out, and I asked her about it over the weekend. I wanted to know if the new firmware was a big improvement. She didn't even know there was a firmware update out, but she did say she was using the XP-1 for mot of here reception shots. Once the formals are done she puts away the Canon 5dII and goes with the Fuji with the 35mm.
10-11-2012, 10:07 PM   #217
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
What this is going to turn into a discussion of what fits in my camera bag? It's that I hate carrying the camera bag. But if that's what you want to talk about here's what fits in my camera bag, wait, I have 4 camera bags... which one? OK then the biggest one. The DA 60*-250 the 10-17 fisheye, the DA 18-135, the 21 ltd, 35 2.4 and 50 primes, my teleconverter, batteries a right angle viewfinder adapter my tripod mount for the 60-250. Is this in any way relevant to the conversation. I still hate carrying a camera bag. Yesterday's hike was 13km. I carried a camera case for the 60-250 with auxiliary pouches for the 18-135 and 35 one the side. I left a lot of stuff at home and I still didn't like carrying it.There is just no easy way to carry a DA*6-250 13 km and be happy about it.

Or as someone put it before I bought this lens. "Those long lenses, they suck the life out of you." I didn't listen.

Now about that FF Pentax that's coming.... what great news. Now I'll have to carry another 650 grams.
Only means extra workout.
10-11-2012, 11:26 PM   #218
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
What this is going to turn into a discussion of what fits in my camera bag? It's that I hate carrying the camera bag. But if that's what you want to talk about here's what fits in my camera bag, wait, I have 4 camera bags... which one? OK then the biggest one. The DA 60*-250 the 10-17 fisheye, the DA 18-135, the 21 ltd, 35 2.4 and 50 primes, my teleconverter, batteries a right angle viewfinder adapter my tripod mount for the 60-250. Is this in any way relevant to the conversation. I still hate carrying a camera bag. Yesterday's hike was 13km. I carried a camera case for the 60-250 with auxiliary pouches for the 18-135 and 35 one the side. I left a lot of stuff at home and I still didn't like carrying it.There is just no easy way to carry a DA*6-250 13 km and be happy about it.

Or as someone put it before I bought this lens. "Those long lenses, they suck the life out of you." I didn't listen.

Now about that FF Pentax that's coming.... what great news. Now I'll have to carry another 650 grams.
That wasn't my intention; I only wanted to show the 60-250 is IMO not that big, and that you can carry it in a quite compact bag which won't hurt your shoulder. People are amazed every time I'm getting it out from the Nova 1... (mostly Canikonians carrying big backpacks)
Which doesn't mean I argue with your preferences

10-12-2012, 12:47 AM   #219
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ex Finn. Quote
You need to bring along some young able bodied photography students or boy/girl scouts as your beasts of burden.
Several years ago (can't remember the year, but at least 6-7 years ago), I observed a guy walking around in the Terme di Saturnia with a Hasselblad with a digital back. He had the digital back tethered directly to an Apple PowerBook, and had a bikini clad young woman carrying the PowerBook for him while they were wading through the warm water. I guess that digital back was so expensive that it came with a full time assistant for free
10-12-2012, 06:50 AM   #220
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I hope that Pentax leap frogs the 24MP FF sensor and goes for the 2nd generation version of the 36MP sensor that Sony will later use in an A99 replacement. This will be an enhanced version of the 36MP currently used by Nikon in the D800 with better noise figures.
10-12-2012, 07:02 AM   #221
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
What this is going to turn into a discussion of what fits in my camera bag? It's that I hate carrying the camera bag. But if that's what you want to talk about here's what fits in my camera bag, wait, I have 4 camera bags... which one? OK then the biggest one. The DA 60*-250 the 10-17 fisheye, the DA 18-135, the 21 ltd, 35 2.4 and 50 primes, my teleconverter, batteries a right angle viewfinder adapter my tripod mount for the 60-250. Is this in any way relevant to the conversation. I still hate carrying a camera bag. Yesterday's hike was 13km. I carried a camera case for the 60-250 with auxiliary pouches for the 18-135 and 35 one the side. I left a lot of stuff at home and I still didn't like carrying it.There is just no easy way to carry a DA*6-250 13 km and be happy about it.

Or as someone put it before I bought this lens. "Those long lenses, they suck the life out of you." I didn't listen.

Now about that FF Pentax that's coming.... what great news. Now I'll have to carry another 650 grams.
I have a Kata Backpack that can carry all of my lenses, but I certainly wouldn't take it on a hike. Generally to hike, I would decide on focal length (s) I was going to use and then carry those one or two lenses in a smaller bag.

Of course, most of Pentax's lenses are smaller than that. Choosing a pro-level telephoto zoom from any camera company is going to be a weighty proposition.
10-12-2012, 07:59 AM   #222
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
Choosing a pro-level telephoto zoom from any camera company is going to be a weighty proposition.
perhaps not for long. jury is still out on this new weathersealed f2.8 (70-200mm equivalent)
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10-12-2012, 08:12 AM   #223
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QuoteOriginally posted by illdefined Quote
perhaps not for long. jury is still out on this new weathersealed f2.8 (70-200mm equivalent)
Well, honestly, four thirds have been a lot better at exploiting the benefits of their smaller sensor. A good portion of Pentax's lenses cover a full frame image circle. If Pentax had shortened their registration distance and focused on having a smaller image circle, they probably could have had smaller lenses, but I think pre-Hoya, they really wanted to release a full frame camera and were just waiting for the right sensor.

The 60-250 is supposed to be full frame compatible. It still is fairly compact for what it is, but wonder if it could have been made smaller if some of those other factors were changed.
10-12-2012, 08:23 AM   #224
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
Well, honestly, four thirds have been a lot better at exploiting the benefits of their smaller sensor. A good portion of Pentax's lenses cover a full frame image circle. If Pentax had shortened their registration distance and focused on having a smaller image circle, they probably could have had smaller lenses, but I think pre-Hoya, they really wanted to release a full frame camera and were just waiting for the right sensor.

The 60-250 is supposed to be full frame compatible. It still is fairly compact for what it is, but wonder if it could have been made smaller if some of those other factors were changed.
indeed. more reasons Pentax should bring FF back to K-mount.
10-12-2012, 03:23 PM   #225
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I've checked my 60-250 on a Program Plus. Trust me it isn't FF. One focal length I beleive about 135 it was good.Every where else, if believe your image should be vignetted before PP, you'll like it.
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