FF Under Development

bossa · 10-09-2012, 03:52 AM

My lenses are going down like nine pins in The Marketplace and once they're gone that will be it for me and Pentax unfortunately. At my age, I can't afford to wait any longer and I won't be able to afford to jump back once it's done. I hope to have a 2nd D800E body and a 300/2.8 VRII within a few weeks from the sale of my Pentax gear. It's been rather an emotional experience frankly...

noVICE · 10-09-2012, 04:06 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by bossa

My lenses are going down like nine pins in The Marketplace and once they're gone that will be it for me and Pentax unfortunately. At my age, I can't afford to wait any longer and I won't be able to afford to jump back once it's done. I hope to have a 2nd D800E body and a 300/2.8 VRII within a few weeks from the sale of my Pentax gear. It's been rather an emotional experience frankly...

It's a shame Bossa, you do good work on your Pentax. Best of luck with your new kit.

usmcxm35 · 10-09-2012, 04:12 AM

Originally posted by noVICE

What happens when the FF does come out.... will Pentaxians everywhere have the thousands of dollars needed to buy this body? How many are going to say "oh I already have an amazing APS-C I will stick with that", how many will say "yes! I will choose the Pentax FF system over CaNikon's offerings" and how many are just going to wait for the next Pentax FF until they iron out the bugs with the first one? If I were Pentoh I would be having a long hard think about this move as it could represent a massive financial risk for the company.

Considering how many Pentax users are jumping ship to Canikon for D800/600, I would say a good amount.
If I follow those who go FF and jump into a D800E $3300, then I would certainly have thousands to spend on a Pentax FF.

How many are waiting for the K-3 ii because the first one needs to be ironed out? Are you serious? The 10,000 thread is complaining that there isn't even to iron out. Let there be the first before you start worrying about number two. Car makers are coming out with hybrids, is every single person buying hybrids? no, but you need to be in game and not let the world pass you by.

wed7 · 10-09-2012, 04:19 AM

FF will not be released, get real.

noVICE · 10-09-2012, 04:31 AM

Originally posted by usmcxm35

but you need to be in game and not let the world pass you by.

I totally agree, personally I am waiting for this Pentax FF as well. I feel Pentoh has a long, hard road ahead to come out with a FF that will compete with other manufacturers that have been producing FF for a long time.

ElJamoquio · 10-09-2012, 04:37 AM

Originally posted by frank

Hmm, another FF thread. How many more such threads are we gonna have before Pentax really releases a FF dSLR/EVIL camera?

We can discuss that in the prediction thread about the full frame prediction threads.

ElJamoquio · 10-09-2012, 04:39 AM

Originally posted by illdefined

Pentax currently has 4 FA primes in production (I think the FA 50mm still gets made for Japan), and designs, molds and patents for dozens more. Pentax would not be starting from zero.

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-slr-lens-discussion/183420-current...me-lenses.html

Pentax has, at some point or another, called 10 of their current lenses 'full frame'.

Winder · 10-09-2012, 05:08 AM

Originally posted by illdefined

And you insist the investment was only a result of the scandal. Do you have proof of that? The decision to go with Sony sensors preceded the scandal as you know, who's to say what talks started when? even Woodford couldn't break through Japanese corporate dealings, how can you be so sure? Olympus likely couldn't pay off its debts to Sony and they had to step in but unless you were there who really knows? my point is, they are and have been tied to each other for a while now - they have a unique relationship, more intimate than just contractor/contractee of the other camera manufacturers.

Have you even read about the scandal? Olympus stock lost 75% of its value in a month. Almost all the major share holders dumped stock. Their stock was de-listed from the Tokyo Stock Exchange. Read up on the story. At one point Olympus projected that they would be able to survive without seeking investment from an outside source.

Everything you have said has been pure speculation with NOTHING to support it.

What do you mean "they are and have been tied to each other for a while now"? Pentax has bought more from Sony than Olympus. Olympus has used 1 Sony sensor for a ILC in history of the company. Kodak provided all sensors up to the E-3 and Panasonic provided all of the 12MP sensors that Olympus has been recycling for the last 4 years. Why did Olympus elect to use Epson EVF technology and not Sony if they are so intertwined?

There is nothing to support the claim that Sony had a double top secret agreement with Olympus prior to the scandal. The sensor used in the OM-D is the newset Sony sensor technology used in any crop frame camera.

There is nothing to support the idea that Sony wont sell the latest sensors to Pentax or anyone else. Sony is a product whore. They sell anything to anyone who can pay and there is nothing wrong with that.

Clavius · 10-09-2012, 05:25 AM

Maybe a weird concept: But can't people just be happy that the FF is finally "confirmed" to be under developement. I've never been interested in FF, but I'm still happy for Pentax that they are advancing and developing new products. I'm very interested in what they come up with.

starbase218 · 10-09-2012, 05:37 AM

Originally posted by frank

Hmm, another FF thread. How many more such threads are we gonna have before Pentax really releases a FF dSLR/EVIL camera?

More than the number of FF cameras they will sell.

Winder · 10-09-2012, 05:37 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Clavius

Maybe a weird concept: But can't people just be happy that the FF is finally "confirmed" to be under developement. .

It seems to be confirmed every year on the internet.... sometimes twice a year....

starbase218 · 10-09-2012, 05:38 AM

Originally posted by Clavius

Maybe a weird concept: But can't people just be happy that the FF is finally "confirmed" to be under developement. I've never been interested in FF, but I'm still happy for Pentax that they are advancing and developing new products. I'm very interested in what they come up with.

FF has been "confirmed" before. Who says this time is any different?

Sandy Hancock · 10-09-2012, 05:50 AM

Clavius, stop making sense.
Maybe I'm too easily pleased, but I'm pumped about the prospect of the K-5IIs, and although I would love to eventually pair it to a Pentax FF, I won't be losing any sleep over it – too many photos to take in the meantime.
Let's just wait and see.

**maxfield_photo** · 10-09-2012, 06:45 AM

Originally posted by illdefined

don't people get tired of making excuses for Pentax?

I do.

**boriscleto** · 10-09-2012, 06:48 AM

Originally posted by TomTextura

Where are you getting this notion from? Again, what indication do you have that Sony doesn't have enough FF sensors? And what makes you think that if they don't currently have the supply they wouldn't remedy that situation so that they can make more money like any rational producer would? I can't imagine any reason that Sony wouldn't sell Pentax their FF sensors, if not immediately than in due time.

It's quite simple really. A 300mm wafer will produce ~60 FF sensors. That same wafer will produce ~160 APS-C sensors. There will be more defects on the FF sensors as well. The cost of production of a FF sensor is more than 2x that of an APS-C sensor. Now it may be in time Sony will have enough of the defective sensors to sell to Pentax, but then Pentax will have to work around having lesser quality sensors. But that's assuming Nikon and Sony don't expand their FF offerings.

10-09-2012, 06:48 AM	#105
boriscleto Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: North Syracuse, NY Photos: Gallery Posts: 16,473	Originally posted by TomTextura Where are you getting this notion from? Again, what indication do you have that Sony doesn't have enough FF sensors? And what makes you think that if they don't currently have the supply they wouldn't remedy that situation so that they can make more money like any rational producer would? I can't imagine any reason that Sony wouldn't sell Pentax their FF sensors, if not immediately than in due time. It's quite simple really. A 300mm wafer will produce ~60 FF sensors. That same wafer will produce ~160 APS-C sensors. There will be more defects on the FF sensors as well. The cost of production of a FF sensor is more than 2x that of an APS-C sensor. Now it may be in time Sony will have enough of the defective sensors to sell to Pentax, but then Pentax will have to work around having lesser quality sensors. But that's assuming Nikon and Sony don't expand their FF offerings. Last edited by boriscleto; 10-09-2012 at 06:55 AM.

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10-09-2012, 03:52 AM	#91
bossa Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Adelaide Posts: 4,546	My lenses are going down like nine pins in The Marketplace and once they're gone that will be it for me and Pentax unfortunately. At my age, I can't afford to wait any longer and I won't be able to afford to jump back once it's done. I hope to have a 2nd D800E body and a 300/2.8 VRII within a few weeks from the sale of my Pentax gear. It's been rather an emotional experience frankly...

10-09-2012, 04:06 AM - 1 Like	#92
noVICE Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Brisbane Photos: Gallery Posts: 164	Originally posted by bossa My lenses are going down like nine pins in The Marketplace and once they're gone that will be it for me and Pentax unfortunately. At my age, I can't afford to wait any longer and I won't be able to afford to jump back once it's done. I hope to have a 2nd D800E body and a 300/2.8 VRII within a few weeks from the sale of my Pentax gear. It's been rather an emotional experience frankly... It's a shame Bossa, you do good work on your Pentax. Best of luck with your new kit.

10-09-2012, 04:12 AM	#93
usmcxm35 Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: New York, USA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 215	Originally posted by noVICE What happens when the FF does come out.... will Pentaxians everywhere have the thousands of dollars needed to buy this body? How many are going to say "oh I already have an amazing APS-C I will stick with that", how many will say "yes! I will choose the Pentax FF system over CaNikon's offerings" and how many are just going to wait for the next Pentax FF until they iron out the bugs with the first one? If I were Pentoh I would be having a long hard think about this move as it could represent a massive financial risk for the company. Considering how many Pentax users are jumping ship to Canikon for D800/600, I would say a good amount. If I follow those who go FF and jump into a D800E $3300, then I would certainly have thousands to spend on a Pentax FF. How many are waiting for the K-3 ii because the first one needs to be ironed out? Are you serious? The 10,000 thread is complaining that there isn't even to iron out. Let there be the first before you start worrying about number two. Car makers are coming out with hybrids, is every single person buying hybrids? no, but you need to be in game and not let the world pass you by.

10-09-2012, 04:19 AM	#94
wed7 Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Manila, Philippines Posts: 1,421	FF will not be released, get real.

10-09-2012, 04:31 AM	#95
noVICE Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Brisbane Photos: Gallery Posts: 164	Originally posted by usmcxm35 but you need to be in game and not let the world pass you by. I totally agree, personally I am waiting for this Pentax FF as well. I feel Pentoh has a long, hard road ahead to come out with a FF that will compete with other manufacturers that have been producing FF for a long time.

10-09-2012, 04:37 AM	#96
ElJamoquio Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Posts: 4,873	Originally posted by frank Hmm, another FF thread. How many more such threads are we gonna have before Pentax really releases a FF dSLR/EVIL camera? We can discuss that in the prediction thread about the full frame prediction threads.

10-09-2012, 04:39 AM	#97
ElJamoquio Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Posts: 4,873	Originally posted by illdefined Pentax currently has 4 FA primes in production (I think the FA 50mm still gets made for Japan), and designs, molds and patents for dozens more. Pentax would not be starting from zero. https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-slr-lens-discussion/183420-current...me-lenses.html Pentax has, at some point or another, called 10 of their current lenses 'full frame'.

10-09-2012, 05:08 AM	#98
Winder Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Tennessee Posts: 6,617	Originally posted by illdefined And you insist the investment was only a result of the scandal. Do you have proof of that? The decision to go with Sony sensors preceded the scandal as you know, who's to say what talks started when? even Woodford couldn't break through Japanese corporate dealings, how can you be so sure? Olympus likely couldn't pay off its debts to Sony and they had to step in but unless you were there who really knows? my point is, they are and have been tied to each other for a while now - they have a unique relationship, more intimate than just contractor/contractee of the other camera manufacturers. Have you even read about the scandal? Olympus stock lost 75% of its value in a month. Almost all the major share holders dumped stock. Their stock was de-listed from the Tokyo Stock Exchange. Read up on the story. At one point Olympus projected that they would be able to survive without seeking investment from an outside source. Everything you have said has been pure speculation with NOTHING to support it. What do you mean "they are and have been tied to each other for a while now"? Pentax has bought more from Sony than Olympus. Olympus has used 1 Sony sensor for a ILC in history of the company. Kodak provided all sensors up to the E-3 and Panasonic provided all of the 12MP sensors that Olympus has been recycling for the last 4 years. Why did Olympus elect to use Epson EVF technology and not Sony if they are so intertwined? There is nothing to support the claim that Sony had a double top secret agreement with Olympus prior to the scandal. The sensor used in the OM-D is the newset Sony sensor technology used in any crop frame camera. There is nothing to support the idea that Sony wont sell the latest sensors to Pentax or anyone else. Sony is a product whore. They sell anything to anyone who can pay and there is nothing wrong with that.

10-09-2012, 05:25 AM	#99
Clavius Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: De Klundert Photos: Gallery Posts: 4,150	Maybe a weird concept: But can't people just be happy that the FF is finally "confirmed" to be under developement. I've never been interested in FF, but I'm still happy for Pentax that they are advancing and developing new products. I'm very interested in what they come up with.

10-09-2012, 05:37 AM	#100
starbase218 Inactive Account Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Planet Earth, Sol system, Milky Way galaxy, Universe Posts: 1,119	Originally posted by frank Hmm, another FF thread. How many more such threads are we gonna have before Pentax really releases a FF dSLR/EVIL camera? More than the number of FF cameras they will sell.

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10-09-2012, 05:37 AM - 1 Like	#101
Winder Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Tennessee Posts: 6,617	Originally posted by Clavius Maybe a weird concept: But can't people just be happy that the FF is finally "confirmed" to be under developement. . It seems to be confirmed every year on the internet.... sometimes twice a year....

10-09-2012, 05:38 AM	#102
starbase218 Inactive Account Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Planet Earth, Sol system, Milky Way galaxy, Universe Posts: 1,119	Originally posted by Clavius Maybe a weird concept: But can't people just be happy that the FF is finally "confirmed" to be under developement. I've never been interested in FF, but I'm still happy for Pentax that they are advancing and developing new products. I'm very interested in what they come up with. FF has been "confirmed" before. Who says this time is any different?

10-09-2012, 05:50 AM	#103
Sandy Hancock Moderator Site Supporter Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Adelaide Hills, South Australia Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 11,267	Clavius, stop making sense. Maybe I'm too easily pleased, but I'm pumped about the prospect of the K-5IIs, and although I would love to eventually pair it to a Pentax FF, I won't be losing any sleep over it – too many photos to take in the meantime. Let's just wait and see.

10-09-2012, 06:45 AM	#104
maxfield_photo Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 1,216	Originally posted by illdefined don't people get tired of making excuses for Pentax? I do.