Forgot Password
Pentax Camera Forums Home
 

View Poll Results: Would you buy a Pentax Full Frame DSLR?
Yes 15277.95%
No 4322.05%
Voters: 195. You may not vote on this poll

Closed Thread
Show Printable Version Search this Thread
04-09-2013, 08:02 AM   #61
Veteran Member
NickLarsson's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Paris, France
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 1,390
I would like a Pentax FF but I voted no because I don't want to spend $2000 on a camera.

Actually I would be on the market for a Pentax equivalent of a used 5D or D700 released a few years ago. Unfortunately there is none.

So I bought a Pentax ME last week for 10 bucks.

04-09-2013, 08:10 AM   #62
Pentaxian
normhead's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Near Algonquin Park
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 24,739
QuoteOriginally posted by NickLarsson Quote
I would like a Pentax FF but I voted no because I don't want to spend $2000 on a camera.

Actually I would be on the market for a Pentax equivalent of a used 5D or D700 released a few years ago. Unfortunately there is none.

So I bought a Pentax ME last week for 10 bucks.
I just looked at a used D700, influenced by a couple of pros I know who still use them, and I always want to know what my options are.... but they are listed used at $1600. That's new D600 price. As Jack Bauer would say... "something's not right here."
04-09-2013, 09:36 AM   #63
Site Supporter




Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,893
QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
Pentax Ricoh started in October 2011, there's a lot of work to do integrating two companies - we can be certain they couldn't start new products from day 1 - and no, nothing is "pretty obvious".
I am certain they didn't start new products on day 1. It should've been day 100-180. A 2 years development cycle means they'll have the FF out in early 2014.

Pentax/Ricoh wants to compete with Nikon/Canon. It's pretty obvious they have to have competitive products to compete. They don't need to have a product directly competing with everything, but they have nothing to compete with the fast AF stuff, nothing to compete with 5DII, 5DIII, 1Ds, etc.
04-09-2013, 09:50 AM   #64
Pentaxian
normhead's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Near Algonquin Park
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 24,739
QuoteOriginally posted by ElJamoquio Quote
I am certain they didn't start new products on day 1. It should've been day 100-180. A 2 years development cycle means they'll have the FF out in early 2014.

Pentax/Ricoh wants to compete with Nikon/Canon. It's pretty obvious they have to have competitive products to compete. They don't need to have a product directly competing with everything, but they have nothing to compete with the fast AF stuff, nothing to compete with 5DII, 5DIII, 1Ds, etc.
OK, so how many 5DIIs does canon sell, assuming Pentax at least initially would sell probably 10% of what Canon or Nikon sells is that a worthwhile market to go after?

I'm guessing keeping a K mount FF comparable price with so much smaller a production run... would be at best problematic. Due to AF design and Canons lead in things like ring motors etc. I'm not convinced Pentax will ever compete in speed of AF, with either Canon or Nikon. Speed of AF has never been a feature of any Pentax camera that I know of, to the point that I wonder why people anticipate it. All I want from a Pentax FF is Pentax IQ, on an FF body. Competing with Nikon and Canon on speed of AF.. that just wouldn't be Pentax. Having a better feature set with equivalent or better IQ, that would be the Pentax niche.

But then I'm a guy who selected Pentax because I like their philosophy. Not a guy who bought into Pentax for the price and lenses, and then expected them to fill all my camera needs in based on what everybody else does.

04-09-2013, 01:42 PM   #65
Ash
Community Manager
Loyal Site Supporter
Ash's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Toowoomba, Queensland
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 22,683
QuoteOriginally posted by kerrowdown Quote
Well looking at the poll today, Pentax are gonna sell at least 104 FF bodies, in fact it's 105 because I need two.
The poll I set up earlier asked specifically what camera would you want Pentax to make that you intend to buy. There were over 170 FF dSLR voters. Over 50% of the vote - that has to say something about the enthusiast/higher end user market demand. The 645D II wasn't highly sought after amongst this group (selection bias notwithstanding).
04-09-2013, 01:53 PM   #66
Veteran Member
NickLarsson's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Paris, France
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 1,390
QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
I just looked at a used D700, influenced by a couple of pros I know who still use them, and I always want to know what my options are.... but they are listed used at $1600. That's new D600 price. As Jack Bauer would say... "something's not right here."
Indeed. Here you can find used D700s for 800-900 (vs 1600 for a new D600).

QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
OK, so how many 5DIIs does canon sell, assuming Pentax at least initially would sell probably 10% of what Canon or Nikon sells is that a worthwhile market to go after?
According to Thom Hogan Nikon is producing 300,000 D800 per year.

So let's be optimistic and say that Pentax can sell 30,000 FF @ $2000, it would make $60M revenue per year. Sounds worthwhile to me
04-09-2013, 02:27 PM   #67
Site Supporter




Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,893
QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
OK, so how many 5DIIs does canon sell,
I don't know. To whom do those cameras sell is more important. I influence a few camera sales each year. I bet you influence dozens.

QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
assuming Pentax at least initially would sell probably 10% of what Canon or Nikon sells is that a worthwhile market to go after?
Absolutely.


QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
I'm guessing keeping a K mount FF comparable price with so much smaller a production run... would be at best problematic. Due to AF design and Canons lead in things like ring motors etc. I'm not convinced Pentax will ever compete in speed of AF, with either Canon or Nikon. Speed of AF has never been a feature of any Pentax camera that I know of, to the point that I wonder why people anticipate it. All I want from a Pentax FF is Pentax IQ, on an FF body. Competing with Nikon and Canon on speed of AF.. that just wouldn't be Pentax.
I don't need excellent AF. It'd be nice. I'd certainly still consider it a Pentax.


QuoteQuote:
But then I'm a guy who selected Pentax because I like their philosophy. Not a guy who bought into Pentax for the price and lenses, and then expected them to fill all my camera needs in based on what everybody else does.
I selected Pentax because I like their philosophy. Ricoh selected Pentax to grow it into a Canon/Nikon.
04-09-2013, 02:40 PM   #68
Pentaxian
normhead's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Near Algonquin Park
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 24,739
QuoteOriginally posted by NickLarsson Quote
Indeed. Here you can find used D700s for 800-900 (vs 1600 for a new D600).


According to Thom Hogan Nikon is producing 300,000 D800 per year.

So let's be optimistic and say that Pentax can sell 30,000 FF @ $2000, it would make $60M revenue per year. Sounds worthwhile to me
I have no idea if that would be worth it. How much does it cost Pentax in R&D to develop a camera? Has the D800 been out for a year? How does Thom know this?

04-09-2013, 03:05 PM   #69
Pentaxian




Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Seattle
Posts: 7,017
QuoteOriginally posted by NickLarsson Quote
...
So let's be optimistic and say that Pentax can sell 30,000 FF @ $2000, it would make $60M revenue per year. Sounds worthwhile to me
And if the net profit is 10% of those sales minus the investment in new lenses for FF, it doesn't sound like a cash cow to me.
04-09-2013, 04:56 PM   #70
Site Supporter




Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Aylesbury, Bucks
Photos: Albums
Posts: 492
If anyone fancies taking a punt on a Pentax FF, you could do worse than buying up cheap copies of the not-very-useful-on-digital FAJ 18-35mm. If / when a K-mount full frame comes out that will rocket in value. I reckon you'd get a 200-300% ROI.
04-09-2013, 05:09 PM   #71
Veteran Member
jsherman999's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2007
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 8,228
QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
I just looked at a used D700, influenced by a couple of pros I know who still use them, and I always want to know what my options are.... but they are listed used at $1600. That's new D600 price. As Jack Bauer would say... "something's not right here."
You can have mine for $1400, and I'll throw in a free AF Sigma 24 f/2.8 Super-Wide II !



The D600 has a very nice sensor, but if you shot both you'd see why the D700 holds it's value the way it does.

.
04-09-2013, 05:13 PM   #72
Veteran Member
jsherman999's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2007
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 8,228
QuoteOriginally posted by top-quark Quote
If anyone fancies taking a punt on a Pentax FF, you could do worse than buying up cheap copies of the not-very-useful-on-digital FAJ 18-35mm. If / when a K-mount full frame comes out that will rocket in value. I reckon you'd get a 200-300% ROI.
I think that FA 20-35 f4 would really be valuable as well. Super small for a zoom, very sharp with fantastic contrast. I almost bought one for my K20D when I thought I had lost my M 20 f4 (and before I had my DA 15ltd.)

.
04-09-2013, 05:15 PM   #73
Pentaxian
twitch's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 4,571
QuoteOriginally posted by jsherman999 Quote
I think that FA 20-35 f4 would really be valuable as well. Super small for a zoom, very sharp with fantastic contrast. I almost bought one for my K20D when I thought I had lost my M 20 f4 (and before I had my DA 15ltd.)

.
The world has already caught onto that one, I've been searching for one for a while
04-09-2013, 05:46 PM   #74
Site Supporter




Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Aylesbury, Bucks
Photos: Albums
Posts: 492
QuoteOriginally posted by jsherman999 Quote
I think that FA 20-35 f4 would really be valuable as well. Super small for a zoom, very sharp with fantastic contrast. I almost bought one for my K20D when I thought I had lost my M 20 f4 (and before I had my DA 15ltd.)
Check out the average prices in the database. That 20-35 is close to $400. It's resale price isn't going to double - you'd be better off buying a Canon L 17-40mm for $800. That FAJ, on the other hand, has an average price of around $100. A future resale price of $250 is quite conceivable.

That FAJ also shows where future FF lenses might come from. It's not long since been discontinued - presumably Pentax still have all the necessary dies, moulds and tools to make it. Put it in a nicer barrel with a metal mount, slap, say, a $500 price on it and you've got a cheap ultrawide that's competitive with the big boys.

Others? Quite a few could be simple rebranding - DA* -> DFA*. There's also prior art in rebranding Tamron designs. That recent Tamron 24-70mm is supposed to be pretty decent.
04-09-2013, 06:58 PM   #75
Ash
Community Manager
Loyal Site Supporter
Ash's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Toowoomba, Queensland
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 22,683
QuoteOriginally posted by tuco Quote
And if the net profit is 10% of those sales minus the investment in new lenses for FF, it doesn't sound like a cash cow to me.
FF won't be where the crux of Pentax's income comes from. It will always be in the compacts and bridge cameras, perhaps even entry-level dSLRs, but the higher end products are catering for their niche. And I do think a FF entry will keep a lot of enthuiasts happy.

But I don't quite know why the talk of FAJs.
Sure, they're the old FF compatible wide-normal zooms, but the quality just aint there to team them up with a digital FF camera of 20+ Mps. The Tamron 28-75 is what's available now, but Pentax should come up with their own FF compatible wide-normal zoom. If it's an f/4 it's got to be a good one, not just FAJ quality. Enthusiasts are investing in a FF camera not to have kit lens quality in their images...
Closed Thread

Bookmarks
  • Submit Thread to Facebook Facebook
  • Submit Thread to Twitter Twitter
  • Submit Thread to Digg Digg
Tags - Make this thread easier to find by adding keywords to it!
frame, full-frame, pentax, pentax full frame
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Would you buy a Pentax phone? junyo Pentax News and Rumors 68 06-03-2013 10:46 AM
Pentax full frame fisheye for the 645D...would you buy one? slackercruster Pentax Medium Format 7 06-19-2012 07:01 AM
Would you buy a Pentax Fisheye P&S? andy_g Pentax Compact Cameras 18 11-30-2011 12:44 PM
What would you buy? A Full Frame Pentax or an EVIL Pentax? johnmflores Pentax DSLR Discussion 104 07-29-2010 07:55 PM
Would you buy a FF Pentax? bymy141 Pentax DSLR Discussion 52 04-14-2008 09:50 PM



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 08:59 AM. | See also: NikonForums.com, CanonForums.com part of our network of photo forums!
  • Red (Default)
  • Green
  • Gray
  • Dark
  • Dark Yellow
  • Dark Blue
  • Old Red
  • Old Green
  • Old Gray
  • Dial-Up Style
Hello! It's great to see you back on the forum! Have you considered joining the community?
register
Creating a FREE ACCOUNT takes under a minute, removes ads, and lets you post! [Dismiss]
Top