Forgot Password
Pentax Camera Forums Home
 

Reply
Show Printable Version Search this Thread
05-23-2013, 03:39 AM   #1
Pentaxian
adwb's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Bristol UK
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 1,631
why is a full frame Pentax such a holy grail?

So here we sit with a bag full of assorted lenses from old manual ones right through to hsm models and our apsc bodies, and I keep seeing forum members crying because there is no full frame on the Pentax line up.
Why?
What do they think they are going to get with a ff and their existing glass that they can't do now?

For how many would the change in DOF actually be the deciding factor or is there something else that I am missing here?

05-23-2013, 03:41 AM   #2
New Member




Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 19
As a noob that hasn't really researched anything about FF but seeing a lot of people complain about Pentax not having FF. I am intrigued on the answer.
05-23-2013, 03:57 AM   #3
Pentaxian
RobA_Oz's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Tasmania, Australia
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 4,126
Well, you could spend a lot of time reading through all the threads and posts here and elsewhere, but, seeing you've asked, the answers are, in no particular order:
  1. Nostalgia for the 35mm film frame size (or era);
  2. Desire for better low light noise performance;
  3. Desire to keep up with the Big Two;
  4. Need for a bigger and brighter optical viewfinder; and
  5. Desire to use all the available image circle from their collection of FA and earlier Pentax-mount lenses.
There are probably others, but my principal reasons for wanting one are mainly 4 and 5.

PS: I don't complain about the lack of a "full frame" Pentax, but I'm content to wait for one to appear, as many of us think will be inevitable. In the meantime, I'll be quite happy to consider their next APS-C DSLR, post the K-5II/s.
05-23-2013, 04:01 AM   #4
Site Supporter
boriscleto's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Liverpool, NY
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 12,309
The only reason Pentax would release one: Make money by selling new lenses.

Since Pentax only has 5 FF lenses to sell a Pentax FF will remain, like the holy grail, an unobtainable myth.

05-23-2013, 04:02 AM   #5
New Member




Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 19
Seeing as we have just been spoon food I am going t o go further. How much better do the cameras before in low light? It sounds like nostalgia comes into play with people really wanting FF.
05-23-2013, 04:22 AM   #6
Pentaxian
RobA_Oz's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Tasmania, Australia
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 4,126
Nostalgia may play a part, but the technological advantage of a larger sensor with bigger photo sites is real enough. The larger the photo site the more light is captured per pixel, and the greater the signal to noise ratio.
05-23-2013, 04:31 AM   #7
Veteran Member
manntax's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2012
Photos: Albums
Posts: 1,972
QuoteOriginally posted by RobA_Oz Quote
Nostalgia may play a part, but the technological advantage of a larger sensor with bigger photo sites is real enough. The larger the photo site the more light is captured per pixel, and the greater the signal to noise ratio.
Spot on + full potential of wide angle lenses. I simple hate this constant reduction in FOV on cropped sensors - for me 24mm triggers a switch in head from film cameras. Same with 17mm or 15 - I really want these switches to work the same in digital. That's the main reason for me to be honest.
05-23-2013, 04:43 AM   #8
Veteran Member
tclausen's Avatar

Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 1,399
QuoteOriginally posted by adwb Quote
So here we sit with a bag full of assorted lenses from old manual ones right through to hsm models and our apsc bodies, and I keep seeing forum members crying because there is no full frame on the Pentax line up.
Why?
What do they think they are going to get with a ff and their existing glass that they can't do now?

For how many would the change in DOF actually be the deciding factor or is there something else that I am missing here?
Oh, how else would we be able to, on a weekly basis, objectify that "Pentax is doomed"?

No, personally I don't get it either, my current digital bodies (and I have neither of the K5-versions....) do me quite nicely.

I'd rather spend 1KEur on a nice lens, than I would on a FF camera body....actually, that's exactly what I've done.

Maybe I should start crying that Pentax hasn't made an 135/1.8 Limited yet, you think it'd help?

05-23-2013, 04:45 AM   #9
Veteran Member
tclausen's Avatar

Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 1,399
QuoteOriginally posted by RobA_Oz Quote
Nostalgia may play a part, but the technological advantage of a larger sensor with bigger photo sites is real enough. The larger the photo site the more light is captured per pixel, and the greater the signal to noise ratio.
Well, I would submit that if that's a real need, then Pentax does make a 645D that should be even better than a 35mm "FF", no?
05-23-2013, 04:55 AM   #10
Pentaxian
twitch's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 4,571
Wider field of view with existing quality lenses, currently there is no decent wide fast AF lens without FF.... none!
Thinner DOF with existing quality lenses
Brighter VF
05-23-2013, 05:00 AM   #11
Pentaxian
RobA_Oz's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Tasmania, Australia
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 4,126
QuoteOriginally posted by tclausen Quote
Well, I would submit that if that's a real need, then Pentax does make a 645D that should be even better than a 35mm "FF", no?
Obviously, if we're comparing like technologies. The 645D, as I'm sure you know, uses a CCD sensor rather than the CMOS sensors that most smaller format DSLRs use now, and its low-light performance isn't as good for that reason. If that aspect wasn't an issue, then it would become a simple matter of economics! There are rumours that the next Leica S2 will use a CMOS sensor, so it's possible Pentax will also employ one in the revised 645D, so then we would no doubt see a vast improvement in low-light performance.
05-23-2013, 05:04 AM   #12
Veteran Member
tclausen's Avatar

Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 1,399
QuoteOriginally posted by RobA_Oz Quote
Obviously, if we're comparing like technologies. The 645D, as I'm sure you know, uses a CCD sensor rather than the CMOS sensors that most smaller format DSLRs use now, and its low-light performance isn't as good for that reason. If that aspect wasn't an issue, then it would become a simple matter of economics! There are rumours that the next Leica S2 will use a CMOS sensor, so it's possible Pentax will also employ one in the revised 645D, so then we would no doubt see a vast improvement in low-light performance.
Well, I was being argumentative, in parts - but also wanted to strike home the point that it's not always that "size matters".

(And, yes, I am aware of the CCD-vs-CMOS differences, as you guessed....)
05-23-2013, 05:15 AM   #13
Pentaxian
RobA_Oz's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Tasmania, Australia
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 4,126
QuoteOriginally posted by tclausen Quote
Well, I was being argumentative, in parts - but also wanted to strike home the point that it's not always that "size matters".

(And, yes, I am aware of the CCD-vs-CMOS differences, as you guessed....)
Argumentative? On PF? Surely you jest!

I agree with you, BTW, up to a point. I'm quite happy with my K-5, but if Pentax can produce an equally well-built and specified "FF" body that's not much bigger than the K-5, I'm sure I'd be even happier. Not the least of my desires, though, is to have a return to the bigger, brighter type of OVF that my LX and K2DMD possess. Better low-light performance is probably a distant second to that, for me.
05-23-2013, 05:26 AM - 1 Like   #14
Banned




Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Millstone,NJ
Posts: 6,491
QuoteOriginally posted by tclausen Quote
Well, I would submit that if that's a real need, then Pentax does make a 645D that should be even better than a 35mm "FF", no?

The market for a $2,000 full frame that also shoots HD video and takes standard DSLR lenses is 1000x larger than a $7,000 645D that takes $5,000 wide angle lens . BTW the DxOMark for the D600 is 94 vs 82 for the 645D .
05-23-2013, 05:26 AM   #15
Veteran Member
tclausen's Avatar

Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 1,399
QuoteOriginally posted by RobA_Oz Quote
Argumentative? On PF? Surely you jest!
Thought that we should try something new, for a change

QuoteQuote:
I agree with you, BTW, up to a point. I'm quite happy with my K-5, but if Pentax can produce an equally well-built and specified "FF" body that's not much bigger than the K-5, I'm sure I'd be even happier. Not the least of my desires, though, is to have a return to the bigger, brighter type of OVF that my LX and K2DMD possess. Better low-light performance is probably a distant second to that, for me.
I'd rather put it this way....would I buy a FF camera? Probably not.

Would I buy a camera with a larger, brighter viewfinder? I probably would. If Pentax can figure out to build a satisfying EVF, or an APS-C, doing that, or if they do it by building a compact FF, I wouldn't care one iota. I might actually if they could find a way without going FF, as I am quite fond of some of my DA Limited's that wouldn't work on a FF.

But FF-for-the-sake-of-FF....doesn't make sense to me. It may to some, though...
Reply

Bookmarks
  • Submit Thread to Facebook Facebook
  • Submit Thread to Twitter Twitter
  • Submit Thread to Digg Digg
Tags - Make this thread easier to find by adding keywords to it!
24x36mm, aps-c, benefit, depth, ff, field, filter, frame, frame pentax, fuji, full-frame, goldilocks, iq, iso, noise, pentax, picture, resolution, sensor, terms
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
So.... Pentax Full Frame is a sure thing? LFLee Photographic Industry and Professionals 25 11-02-2012 12:55 PM
Why is the K7 so terrible? or rather why am i having such a problem with it? runslikeapenguin Pentax DSLR Discussion 60 05-01-2012 01:16 PM
Why do people want a Full Frame sensor? RobG Pentax DSLR Discussion 98 02-15-2012 09:12 AM
Is there such a thing as a decent superzoom (for Pentax)? DanielT74 Pentax SLR Lens Discussion 22 06-21-2011 05:57 AM
Full-Frame Image Sensor Holy Grail - Why? stewart_photo Pentax DSLR Discussion 82 10-10-2007 03:00 AM



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 06:34 AM. | See also: NikonForums.com, part of our network of photo forums!
  • Red (Default)
  • Green
  • Gray
  • Dark
  • Dark Yellow
  • Dark Blue
  • Old Red
  • Old Green
  • Old Gray
  • Dial-Up Style
Hello! It's great to see you back on the forum! Have you considered joining the community?
register
Creating a FREE ACCOUNT takes under a minute, removes ads, and lets you post! [Dismiss]
Top