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06-11-2013, 08:35 AM   #1
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Theory why FF taking so long

I have two ideas;
First, what if Pentax is creating a FF camera with a database witch will include information how to compensate moderated vignetting for APC lenses using for example higher iso in conners of sensor.
Second, what if Pentax creating special optical adapter witch transforms APC lens in FF lens. This adapter will come out same time as FF camera.

06-11-2013, 09:17 AM   #2
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friend, these two things doesn´t make much sense either taking FF into account or not.
1 Vignetting, if done in camera or on the pc, is done after the exposure via a "profile" depending on the lens used.
2 The APS lenses have a smaller image circle than FF lenses, so any kind of adapter will have an impact on IQ. Does not sound like a good idea for Pentax economy
06-11-2013, 09:23 AM   #3
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Your first idea does not work.
Maybe you can do it with the sensor but the problem is that either the lens work relativly well or it viginettes a lot, so much that it actually cut the image. So in the later case there it does not matter how much you throw the iso up.

As for the adaptor, TC might actually do the job just fine maybe?
I'm actually curious about that now...

Either way it's far easier for pentax to just put older lenses into production don't you think?
06-11-2013, 09:42 AM   #4
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First Pentax has not many models of APC lenses but enought to take that instal base to account. Second fillm lenses still will not work as the worked on fillm. Third for the transmission time any of this combination will have a "good enought" IQ

06-11-2013, 09:53 AM   #5
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I read somewhere that apsc lens with 1,4 converter cover FF, i think Rice tired something like that on his blog
06-11-2013, 10:13 AM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by i83N Quote
First Pentax has not many models of APC lenses but enought to take that instal base to account. Second fillm lenses still will not work as the worked on fillm. Third for the transmission time any of this combination will have a "good enought" IQ
1, well yes but like i said the ones where vignetting thing will work for already preform well for FF, those that don't simply don't cover FF size the image they make is simply too small. End of story.

2 film is a very different medium, digital lenses also work differently on film as on digital so i'm not sure where you are going with this. But if you mean the coating and such then sure they help against ghosting but it's not essential, certainly not for longer lenses.

3. read my first comment and as for the adapter, adding glass will degrade the image quality and not all lenses will like h added glass. Zoom lenses are most likely not happy with it since they already have so much glass in it for example and wide angle lenses neither.
Long focal length often works pretty well but those are the lenses that will work on FF without much problems to begin with so... i don't see the added value.

It's far simplere to put back the older lenses design into production. The DA*200 is for example FA*200 but then tweaked for digital. Sure enough they can easily do that for most FA lenses.
06-11-2013, 10:14 AM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by Barbarosa Quote
I read somewhere that apsc lens with 1,4 converter cover FF, i think Rice tired something like that on his blog
Thanks, that would make sense.
06-11-2013, 02:16 PM   #8
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The reason why it is taking so long is that they have tasked the original 645D development group with the task.


Steve

(...5+ years from product announcement to release...)

06-11-2013, 02:34 PM   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by i83N Quote
Theory why FF taking so long
The two real reasons are...

1) Build up the excitement to fever pitch.
2) Allow folk time to save up.

But I'm now good to go on both, so where's my FF.

Last edited by Kerrowdown; 06-11-2013 at 03:32 PM.
06-11-2013, 07:55 PM   #10
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....just guessing, but it won't have a battery, it will be powered by Cold Fusion? You know Pentax FF is just like Cold Fusion...it's always coming...Next Year!

Regards!
06-11-2013, 09:53 PM   #11
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Because they are busy working on the K-5 II replacement. It looks like Nikon have targeted the D7100 to compete directly with Pentax as it has more K-5 design cues than the D7000 and it sure looks impressive. They will focus on keeping their current market share before chasing more.
06-12-2013, 01:01 AM   #12
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As referenced in this thread, it took Pentax five years to get the 645D off the ground. That's got about three new lenses since it launched and no new body (in dire need of a refresh with bigger MP sensor and new tech, btw. It could probably use a few new lenses, and those things aren't simple or cheap to design)

It also I believe took them several years to get the Pentax Q from concept to design. It still feels like that system has a lot of room to grow especially if this Q7 rumor has legs. I'm pleased to see it has developed a cult following and with a few great lenses it could grow even more.

The Pentax K-7 project took a long time as well, and the work from that has spawned many worthy offspring, although as many on here have noted some of those off offspring maybe are starting to resemble each other a bit too much. Not to prejudge the K-50 or anything...

Now if you believe Pentax only came around to building full frame maybe about a year ago, then a release at the end of this year or more probably next year makes a lot of sense, including factors listed at the top of this thread, planning for how to incorporate the current APS-C lineup with a FF if it has a cropping feature. Even with combining the Ricoh and Pentax teams and more Ricoh resources I'm assuming they aren't quite at the level of Nikon or Sony which can pump out cameras like crazy, and by crazy I mean once a year (a lot of those based on tech already featured in their previous cameras, too, btw, so there is a momentum that is established)

I'm tired of waiting for Pentax FF, too, but since the beginning of the year I have guessed we'd see maybe a true K-5 APS-C successor in say the Canon 7D range (maybe with a 24mp sensor?) as Pentax's big release of the year in August, maybe finally some new lens updates at least to go with that? Then full frame probably next year, maybe as early as the early photo shows? (crosses fingers) I'm personally not getting my hopes up for it until they at least start showing mock up designs.
06-12-2013, 04:10 AM   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by Anvh Quote
It's far simplere to put back the older lenses design into production. The DA*200 is for example FA*200 but then tweaked for digital. Sure enough they can easily do that for most FA lenses.
Actually perhaps simpler. But not necessarily cost effective, and not likely in Japan since the materials used actually are no longer permitted in the manufacturing process in Japan. Look at the SMC-F 1.7X AF converter. They are now made somewhere else where workplace safety rules with respect to materials are less strict, if they are still made at all.

You are suggesting taking 20 year old lens designs with out of date materials and optical designs. Sure some were nice lenses but I think it would be better to start over. Many using the old optical designs. A starting point but not much else
06-12-2013, 07:48 AM   #14
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Pentax is a dedicated APS-C system. Compare the DA line to EF-S or Nikkor DX offerings -- DA is far more comprehensive; it's not even a contest. I just can't see how that's going to change anytime soon. It's like wondering when Olympus is going to make a "full frame" camera.
06-12-2013, 08:21 AM   #15
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I just think Pentax is waiting for the "right moment." Releasing a full frame camera that sells a few thousand copies is just not an option and in the end, Pentax needs a niche that they can fill and sell against the Canon/Nikon options.

Selling a smaller, poorly featured camera that prices higher than the D600 is just not an option for Pentax. They have to have something that will actually sell and obviously, other than a few Pentaxians, there is no guarantee that anyone would actually buy such a camera.
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