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10-18-2013, 05:36 AM   #16
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QuoteOriginally posted by RobA_Oz Quote
The idea that the FF camera market is small and saturated is clearly nonsense when there are so many people joining the high disposable income groups in Asian countries alone, not to mention Russia. Failing to see the opportunities provided by that growth means you'll never benefit from it, which probably explains some of the economic problems in the US and Europe right now.

It isn't about disposable income but about the willingness to spend if you can get the performance you need or want in a smaller and cheaper package. There is no gravitational pull towards larger formats where the only thing that stop you are lack of funds. This simply a wrong assumption; big size and longer lenses is not a bonus. It is hard to argue that the growth is going to be in the sub 5% of the market. The K-3 have a vastly larger potential for growth for Pentax than any FF body.
In the film days the only way to increase quality was to increase format. Still there was no mass move towards larger formats.

10-18-2013, 05:53 AM   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by x-country Quote
Well I don't think I'm the only one who just placed an order of a Sony A7r with k2e-adapter? It will be exciting to use my FA-limiteds, the A50/f1.2 and the A28/f2.8 without crop factor and at 36 megapixels.
Fine, you can use an adapter for your FA llimited lenses, but would it auto-focus on the Sony A7r?
10-18-2013, 05:57 AM   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by jon404 Quote
Looking at the PR for the new Sony, the first thing that jumps out is the lens costs. Insane. Tell me -- if you were running Pentax, would you actually risk a lot of money making a camera that only a few people would buy? Does anybody actually want 24MP, let alone 36MP? Whatever for? There are very few professionals left... and, of those, VERY few who would ditch their existing Canikon gear collections. Forget that one.

What's left? Retiring baby boomers, who finally have time for photography hobby, share their images on the internet, and never print larger than 11 x 14. That's 16MP territory with cropping room to spare. But -- this group is price sensitive, and is NOT going to drop $1,000 on a lens. Not very often, anyway... the very rich 1% of this group is probably off in Leica-land anyway.

No. The K-3 is the perfect high-end camera for this demographic... and with the 16MP price range going down to the K-500, it's a complete lineup. All that's needed is to SELL it. Next time I get an AARP magazine, AAA's Westways, or National Geographic, I want to see a full page Pentax ad inside that front cover!
How about the 645D for $8,000 and wide angle for $5,000 ? How many Pentax users could afford that ? Could you use full frame PK mount lenses on the 645D using low cost adapters like you could with the 36MP A7r ?
Nikon D800E vs. Pentax 645D - Conclusion - PentaxForums.com
SMC Pentax-DA 645 25mm F4 AL [IF] SDM AW Reviews - 645 Wide-Angle Primes - Pentax Lens Reviews & Lens Database
10-18-2013, 06:00 AM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by PBandJ Quote
IF they have already made the investment in Sony/nikon/canon lenses, it will be very hard to draw them out of that system. The early bird gets the worm, they say. If Pentax is to have any chance to capture that market, they need to act fast, at the early phase of the APS-c to FF transition.
Don't think that it will work the same for technology items... the ones that comes in later will be more refined. However, I think after the K-3, the new Pentax FF to be released (if indeed) will be good.

10-18-2013, 06:13 AM   #20
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QuoteOriginally posted by PBandJ Quote
IF they have already made the investment in Sony/nikon/canon lenses, it will be very hard to draw them out of that system. The early bird gets the worm, they say. If Pentax is to have any chance to capture that market, they need to act fast, at the early phase of the APS-c to FF transition.
True... If Pentax/Ricoh will produce an FF system, it should be damn good, at least in some aspects like the all-mighty Pentax's weather sealing and ruggedness... I know a lot of photographers (pros and enthusiasts from CaNikon) who are really envy at me when I'm shooting out in the rain with total confidence. They want the Pentax's ruggedness but they also want a FF format, good AF, and lots of choices of fast glasses. What I think, in order for Pentax/Ricoh to turn people's heads toward them, is to produce a rugged (and at least compact for a DSLR) FF system...
10-18-2013, 06:34 AM   #21
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QuoteOriginally posted by aleonx3 Quote
Fine, you can use an adapter for your FA llimited lenses, but would it auto-focus on the Sony A7r?
Nope, but I don't need AF for my purpose.
10-18-2013, 06:36 AM   #22
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QuoteOriginally posted by PBandJ Quote
IF they have already made the investment in Sony/nikon/canon lenses, it will be very hard to draw them out of that system. The early bird gets the worm, they say. If Pentax is to have any chance to capture that market, they need to act fast, at the early phase of the APS-c to FF transition.
Kodak was the early bird.
10-18-2013, 07:00 AM   #23
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
Kodak was the early bird.
you know what I'm sayin
if I put $$$$$$ in lenses, I'm not going to jump to another brand just cuz.

10-18-2013, 07:13 AM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by jogiba Quote
How about the 645D for $8,000 and wide angle for $5,000 ? How many Pentax users could afford that ?
Plenty. Pentax have had a medium format user base for 45 years.
10-18-2013, 07:15 AM   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by richard balonglong Quote
True... If Pentax/Ricoh will produce an FF system, it should be damn good, at least in some aspects like the all-mighty Pentax's weather sealing and ruggedness... .
I'm pretty sure that an eventual FF camera from Pentax anytime soon would essentially be a K-3 with a larger sensor...
10-18-2013, 07:26 AM   #26
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QuoteOriginally posted by jon404 Quote
Looking at the PR for the new Sony, the first thing that jumps out is the lens costs. Insane. Tell me -- if you were running Pentax, would you actually risk a lot of money making a camera that only a few people would buy? Does anybody actually want 24MP, let alone 36MP? Whatever for? There are very few professionals left... and, of those, VERY few who would ditch their existing Canikon gear collections. Forget that one.

What's left? Retiring baby boomers, who finally have time for photography hobby, share their images on the internet, and never print larger than 11 x 14. That's 16MP territory with cropping room to spare. But -- this group is price sensitive, and is NOT going to drop $1,000 on a lens. Not very often, anyway... the very rich 1% of this group is probably off in Leica-land anyway.

No. The K-3 is the perfect high-end camera for this demographic... and with the 16MP price range going down to the K-500, it's a complete lineup. All that's needed is to SELL it. Next time I get an AARP magazine, AAA's Westways, or National Geographic, I want to see a full page Pentax ad inside that front cover!
I bet you have not buy PENTAX lenses recently. For a person who wants to invest in PENTAX from zero, look at the lens price. They are not that far off from FF glass.
10-18-2013, 07:29 AM   #27
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QuoteOriginally posted by aleonx3 Quote
Fine, you can use an adapter for your FA llimited lenses, but would it auto-focus on the Sony A7r?
I don't have a camera that do Focus Peaking, but the A7R has one, so manual focus is pretty doable. (but I can't imagine myself using manual focus all the time)
10-18-2013, 08:43 AM   #28
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QuoteOriginally posted by RonHendriks1966 Quote
I don't think so. My guess is that the K-3 outsells the A7 by 5-10 times in numbers (not talking about profit). I don't think we will see this camera in the top 20 next year, while the K-3 will be in the bottom off the groupe. Sony sells mostly cheaper camera's because people don't see it as a brand that gives you status and thus spending to much money on it isn't bringing you it. Other camera's can also deliver the IQ, futures and lenses.


Well Pentax can make a FF, but it won't be the big seller at this moment. I think it can be done with profit, and that is also very important.
If the amazon sales ranks are any indication, then that is not likely. The k-3 didn't even make the list. The A7 and assorted kits are at the top. This could be a different story in other markets, but, so far, there is no contest stateside. I think the k3 is worthy of more attention, but the only Pentax camera to crack the list is the K50. Perhaps you can check the EU rankings.
10-18-2013, 09:07 AM   #29
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QuoteOriginally posted by kenafein Quote
If the amazon sales ranks are any indication, then that is not likely. The k-3 didn't even make the list. The A7 and assorted kits are at the top. This could be a different story in other markets, but, so far, there is no contest stateside. I think the k3 is worthy of more attention, but the only Pentax camera to crack the list is the K50. Perhaps you can check the EU rankings.
Amazon lists are very United States-centric and tell nothing about sales in europe or japan. I understand that we, who live in the United States, believe that world revolves around us, but Pentax sells very few cameras in this country compared to the rest of the world. That doesn't mean that they don't sell a lot of cameras.
10-18-2013, 09:24 AM   #30
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QuoteOriginally posted by Pål Jensen Quote
Plenty. Pentax have had a medium format user base for 45 years.
So $13,000 was the price of a film 645N with wide angle lens ? I don't think so. People here say they can't afford the full frame A7 for $1,698.
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