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06-10-2015, 03:30 AM   #751
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Too late, they already know - they had some decades to figure it out
By the way, the last Pentax camera - the K-3II - was announced without any connection to a photo industry fair. The K-3 was announced in autumn 2013, a non-Photokina year. And we can find other examples.
But I guess they'll make an exception and wait for an entire year because they forgot how to announce things unless they're at Photokina?

06-10-2015, 03:41 AM   #752
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
This launch however is just another K-mount DSLR but with an FF sensor. Saying it the way I did here is overly simplifying things, but regarding it as an entire new platform is the exact opposite.

Anyway, if you consider this: https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/76-non-pentax-cameras-canon-nikon-etc/296...ra-market.html we could argue that an FF DSLR at this stage would already be foobarred from the start.
My feeling is that in time this will come to be seen as a distinct platform. I'd guess that the lens catalogues will start to diverge, with the really good, high-end stuff being aimed firmly at FF and the consumer zoom type stuff being clearly for crop format. That might well feed into other things, such as flash, lighting (as we've just seen) and other accessories. As smartphones continue their relentless march, the really distinctive, professional photographer's platforms will become FF and of course MF. So this is a very important platform for Pentax to have looking to the future. They are not a volume outfit and the "bargain end" of the smaller formats so to speak is not really for them in the longer term, I'd guess. I'd be surprised if the FF didn't offer a trick or two not available on a crop-format camera costing half as much.

If Canon and Nikon drop everything for mirrorless, then yes the landscape would change pretty dramatically. But at present there is no sign of that.
06-10-2015, 03:47 AM   #753
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That Sony marketing material mentioned in the post you're quoting - if you do a brief investigation - is merely saying that a certain market heavily dominated by DSLRs is now just slightly less heavily dominated by DSLRs
06-10-2015, 04:06 AM   #754
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
The next major photo industry event is CP+, which will take place in February, in Tokyo. Next Photokina is scheduled for September 2016.
My mistake. You shouldn't believe everything you read on the Internet.

Regardless, September this year would be as late as they'd want to leave the showing of the production model.

06-10-2015, 04:45 AM   #755
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Hmm... I think November is the latest.
06-10-2015, 10:47 AM   #756
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After seeing this

http://resourcemagonline.com/2015/06/sony-has-announced-the-a7r-ii-impressiv...capture/53885/

Pentax should really think about what they gonna make the FF be like to stand out against competition. It looks like we are now on even higher end competition stairs.
06-10-2015, 06:00 PM   #757
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QuoteOriginally posted by Danas_Anis Quote
It looks like we are now on even higher end competition stairs.
It's a non-stop process. Pentax, like Canon/Fuji/Nikon/Olympus etc - can never rest. Especially with Sony (and Apple/Samsung ...) in the market.
06-11-2015, 11:36 AM   #758
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There are plenty of professional photographers content with APS-C or mFT... or that may even prefer those over FF.

Pentax will have a harder fight with FF than with APS-C. Canon and Nikon are pulling their punches for APS-C, those cameras are relatively limited. But for FF they throw in all they have. And then there is Samsung and Sony, the ones who are really fast. They produce their own sensors, and processors too (at least Samsung). More software focused too. I don't think Pentax can make a camera competitive to the NX1 or A7R II in the next few years. And by then those brands are even further ahead. It doesn't help that it doesn't look like Pentax is even trying.

06-11-2015, 11:38 AM   #759
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No one has anything like Pentax's pixel shifting.... even if they put it on a 36 MP sensor it still has the potential to blow every other FF out of the water.
06-11-2015, 11:45 AM   #760
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
No one has anything like Pentax's pixel shifting.... even if they put it on a 36 MP sensor it still has the potential to blow every other FF out of the water.
Olympus. And the Sony SR system comes from Olympus?

And pixel shifting is something that AFAIK is useful in very few use cases. You need a seriously solid tripod. and a motive that doesn't move (IMHO that excludes landscapes... a bit of wind is enough to be an issue). Some product photography in studios may profit, but apart from that?

Also is it just me or does it seem like the main reason why Sony now offers SR is video? Video users are more likely to use unstablized lenses, and they profit more from SR.
06-11-2015, 12:04 PM   #761
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QuoteOriginally posted by kadajawi Quote
Olympus. And the Sony SR system comes from Olympus?

And pixel shifting is something that AFAIK is useful in very few use cases. You need a seriously solid tripod. and a motive that doesn't move (IMHO that excludes landscapes... a bit of wind is enough to be an issue). Some product photography in studios may profit, but apart from that?

Also is it just me or does it seem like the main reason why Sony now offers SR is video? Video users are more likely to use unstablized lenses, and they profit more from SR.
It's a different implementation, but you probably knew that.

No wind is a problem?

Really...









I have many , many images taken in no wind situations outdoors.... every one of which could have benefitted from the superior resolution and better low noise shadows provided by the K-3ii.

I'm always amazed at people who tell other people what their problems are, or how useful something might be to them.

QuoteQuote:
And pixel shifting is something that AFAIK is useful in very few use cases. You need a seriously solid tripod. and a motive that doesn't move (IMHO that excludes landscapes...
I don't know if it's you have no experience with landscapes or just don't spend a lot of time out doors. Something's going on.

Last edited by normhead; 06-11-2015 at 12:20 PM.
06-11-2015, 01:57 PM   #762
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QuoteOriginally posted by kadajawi Quote
There are plenty of professional photographers content with APS-C or mFT... or that may even prefer those over FF.
I am a professional photographer in NYC and have been so for about 7 years. I have a pretty big network within the wedding and portrait industry. I can tell you that I know NO ONE who even shoots with a MFT camera for personal work, let alone professional. I know maybe 3 photographers who've converted to the Fuji system for APS-C. I know a ton of photographers who tried to convert to Fuji, then after 6 months to a year, bought at least one Canon or Nikon FF to make up for what they were missing. There is absolutely, positively, no major adoption of smaller formats among professional photographers.
06-11-2015, 02:08 PM   #763
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
It's a different implementation, but you probably knew that.

No wind is a problem?

Really...









I have many , many images taken in no wind situations outdoors.... every one of which could have benefitted from the superior resolution and better low noise shadows provided by the K-3ii.

I'm always amazed at people who tell other people what their problems are, or how useful something might be to them.



I don't know if it's you have no experience with landscapes or just don't spend a lot of time out doors. Something's going on.
I'm in a coastal region, and there is almost always wind. If there is no wind it should work, yes.

The problem I see is that while a bit of movement normally leads to blur, in this system it may lead to artefacts. Just one pixel movement is enough.

But yes, I'm not much into landscapes. More into interiors, and even there there are situations where wind would make pixel shift impossible.

It's just a bit... overhyped IMHO.
06-11-2015, 02:49 PM   #764
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QuoteOriginally posted by kadajawi Quote
It's just a bit... overhyped IMHO.
I agree. It's a good feature to distinguish the K-3 II from the herd, but in it's current implementation, has some practical limitations that rule it out for daily use. It's like the K-3 HDR mode, or the AA Simulator on/off feature, or even (in my case) the video feature of the K-3. Good to have on-board if needed, but not often (if ever) used.

As it evolves though, I can see pixel-shift becoming more handy on a day-to-day basis, maybe to the point of just leaving the camera in that mode all the time. But at the moment it is only a v1.0 product, IMHO.
06-11-2015, 05:28 PM   #765
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QuoteOriginally posted by mecrox Quote
Imho, Ricoh have one shot to get this right. A foobarred introduction, because too hasty, could be a disaster for them. They're launching an entire new platform, not just one camera body. It's a big, big thing. Looking back in five years' time, a few months either way won't make any difference. Given the way the camera market is changing, FF is likely to be a very important plank for Ricoh going forward so I hope they will do what it takes to get things right and not just out in any old way.
But that is the issue I see. If you keep trying to make something perfect, in a market that is always changing, you will never release anything. Case in point, Pentax had THE first FF digital body announced and then never released any digital full frame body. ever.

It's a dedicated computer with optical sensor.. its outdated the day it is released. That is just the nature of the market these days.

---------- Post added 06-11-15 at 07:30 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by Sperdynamite Quote
I am a professional photographer in NYC and have been so for about 7 years. I have a pretty big network within the wedding and portrait industry. I can tell you that I know NO ONE who even shoots with a MFT camera for personal work, let alone professional. I know maybe 3 photographers who've converted to the Fuji system for APS-C. I know a ton of photographers who tried to convert to Fuji, then after 6 months to a year, bought at least one Canon or Nikon FF to make up for what they were missing. There is absolutely, positively, no major adoption of smaller formats among professional photographers.
Don't get that feeling from reading DPhipster
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