[robjmitchell]

In addition to the two long lenses we have seen mock ups for, it would make sense for pentax to have a 24-70/2.8 and a 28-105/4 on release, with an ultra wide zoom and fast wide angle to follow. After all they will be targeting people who understand the value of good glass, not the me too crowd that buy names! Cheap FF lenses are not needed until FF cameras become cheap!

[GateCityRadio]

I'm going to vote both the lenses at photokina, a 24-70 (or 28-80) kit, and refreshed FA limited line up.
I also think they should re-release the DA primes that cover the 35mm frame with the D-FA name. (like the DA35/2.4, DA50, DA*55, etc etc)

[rawr]

I also think they should re-release the DA primes that cover the 35mm frame with the D-FA name.

That would be sensible. They could then launch their FF product with 2 or 3 brand new designs, plus a decent suite of other FF lenses with very little extra effort or delay.

So you'd have a FF lens range of the current FA primes (31/35/43/50/77), the current D-FA's (50/100), and then the 'new' FF compatible D-FA's (35 2.4/50 1.8/ 40 2.8/ 55 1.4/ 70 2.4). The long (but still FF compatible) lenses like the DA* 200/300/560 lenses could stay as they are. There would be a gap in the line-up however at the wide end below 31mm, and between 100 and 200mm, but Pentax could say they were working on that...

Overall a very respectable lineup to launch with.

[ElJamoquio]

How many lenses did Fuji launch with?
Sony E?
Sony FE?

[mrNewt]

Other: Let's first make it reality...

[rawr]

How many lenses did Fuji launch with?
Sony E?
Sony FE?

Only 1 or 2 native lenses each. Pentax is in a much better position.

[eddie1960]

I think it's most reasonable to say an update on all the existing FA lenses still in production to make them WR and add an upgraded Coating (like the DA ltd refresh) so 31/43/501.4/77 for this
a 24-1005 kit I think (though I ticked a 24-75) the sataandar for FF kit lenses is fast becoming an f 4 24 or 28 - 105 range

last and least likely at first IMO are the 2.8 24-70/70-200 pair though both would sell well i think they will be announced with a long release date. Production limitations still exist (unless they pair up with a tokina or tamron again)
if they paired with Sigma they could go to market really quickly with 12-24/24-70/70-200/150-400 etc all top glass that could be produced with Pentax coatings and WR specs with say a 1 year exclusive under the Pentax brand then sigma can compete without using Pentax coating. All the lenses exist in Sigma even if they aren't all produced in K mount (and since there should be no need for in lense OIS perhaps they could be a reasonable price (ha not bloody likely)

[ElJamoquio]

But aren't those Sigma lenses are already made in Pentax mount (or at least the old version of the 70-200 is, I'm not sure what current status)?...

I think they're better off making a couple of superior normal zooms (F/2.8 and either F/3.5-4.5 or F/4). They already have the telephoto coming, and a longer lens as well (135-400)? Add in a, say, 12-24 F/4 and it's a great system.

[eddie1960]

How many lenses did Fuji launch with?
Sony E?
Sony FE?

Fuji launch with the 18/35/60 march 2012
they quickly followed with the 14 2.8 and the really good 18-55 kit at the same time as the XE1 (Sept/October 2012)
at this point there are 15 with 4 more due by mid 2015.
The amazing thing with the fuji is even when they release entry level they use top optics (the bodies become plastic and aperture ring disappears but the glass is really good always)
Fuji I think of anyone has done the best job with building a system and supporting it
Zeiss makes 3 lenses for Xmount
Bower/Rokinon etc make another 10 including the variant 8's and 12's (ie Cine models)
Handevison makes the insane 40 0.85 in Xmount
and mitagon makes a couple as well

not bad for a mount with zero share and brand new just 2.5 years back

If Pentax Ricoh could hit that hard with an attractive FF they would win a fair bit of FF share I think

otherwise they are just selling to the converted (us) and that doesn't grow the company

---------- Post added 29th Oct 2014 at 11:16 ----------

But aren't those Sigma lenses are already made in Pentax mount (or at least the old version of the 70-200 is, I'm not sure what current status)?...

I think they're better off making a couple of superior normal zooms (F/2.8 and either F/3.5-4.5 or F/4). They already have the telephoto coming, and a longer lens as well (135-400)? Add in a, say, 12-24 F/4 and it's a great system.

some are but they have dropped a number of them and a redesigned non ois WR variant with Pentax Coatings is of course another thing (though a pretty quick design I would think)

they actually mnake the WR 12-24 at signma in k mount last i looked . the 24-70 was canned for a while but looks as of today it's back (hmmmmm what does that say) the 70-200 is no longer listed thopugh (maybe some changes being made for a re-release

In any case this is still the same speculative thread in essence we have been running as long as I've been a member

[ElJamoquio]

Fuji launch with the 18/35/60 march 2012
they quickly followed with the 14 2.8 and the really good 18-55 kit at the same time as the XE1 (Sept/October 2012)
at this point there are 15 with 4 more due by mid 2015.
The amazing thing with the fuji is even when they release entry level they use top optics (the bodies become plastic and aperture ring disappears but the glass is really good always)
Fuji I think of anyone has done the best job with building a system and supporting it
Zeiss makes 3 lenses for Xmount
Bower/Rokinon etc make another 10 including the variant 8's and 12's (ie Cine models)
Handevison makes the insane 40 0.85 in Xmount
and mitagon makes a couple as well

In my mind that's still not as good as the Pentax FF *right now* which doesn't have a camera.

[eddie1960]

Pentax FF mount lenses out there amount to
The Sigmas and Tamrons made for FF the FA limiteds and the FA 50 1.4 and DFA105 Macro
for a mount that has existed since what 1974 for the K mount (or AF version in what 1987)
The biggest advantage for Pentax AF is that there are a ton of old FF lenses out there. Once again that works when you are preaching to the converted, it doesn't really bring in new users (or for that matter keep the old ones who are getting more demanding as they try other brands - how many people have left for an alternate brand (ff or not) because it offered something they wanted (needed is too strong a word I think, nobody "needs" FF particularly even a pro, but it does allow some creative options apsc doesn't (and vice versa to be honest)
In my case I will keep whatever Pentax kit I have that didn't get stolen, but I will probably whatch it gather dust while I shoot with the Fuji. It just does for me what my first MX did back in the 70s

Put another way Pentax has been in the DSLR Business for 11 years now and have developed a line of what 25 lenses for digital (that are current) so 2.5 years to launch 15 for a system that only saw it's first Tele friendly body this year (the others are all much better with primes)

Just playing devils advocate, I hope Pentax gets the FF out. That said I am now less likely to buy one. 2 years ago I would have jumped at it. For me the launch of a bunch of zooms means almost nothing now (aside from it meaning a healthy ecosystem to draw new users and sell more cameras.
There is still no other SLR that speaks to me like a Pentax does, But the Retro simple layout of the XE and Xpro fujis sure hit a sweet spot for me. the fact that they produce excellent images and there is just no bad glass in the line per se makes it even better,

[Poit]

In any case this is still the same speculative thread in essence we have been running as long as I've been a member

We are still being speculative, yes, but this time around I believe we're justified in being a bit more optimistic

[eddie1960]

We are still being speculative, yes, but this time around I believe we're justified in being a bit more optimistic

I hope so, the thing is as time goes on the apsc stuff get's so good (witness the K3 for a bayer array sensor) and the lenses out there get so close to a FF in performance (look at the 56 1.2 on a fuji vs a FF 85) or the alternative sensors like the Foveon and Xtrans just achieve things unheard of even a few years back. I'd love the Nikon 750 w/ the 24-105 kit (and I could have had one too instead of my Fuji and added another prime or 2 maybe) but it's huge it weighs a tone and I wouldn't take it out and use it daily like i am with the Fuji . It's got it's place and if you are a sports shooter or shoot in studio the big FF nikon (or Canon) really are a must have. OTOH if you shoot landscapes a medium format like the 645Z is really what you want.
what really is astonishing in hopw far sensors have come is a comparison I saw of 6x7 velvia versus the 16mp xtrans . what and eye opener on how good a sensor this is. I wish DXO would review the latest xtrans and rank it (they haven't they should)

[normhead]

I wish DXO would review the latest xtrans and rank it (they haven't they should)

They won't review the 645z either. I think it's pretty much a company policy. If it isn't a camera that pats the majority of their customers on the back for their terrific brand of choice they don't review it. Anything that kicks the sox off the current Nikon/Canon line up gets ignored.

It makes no sense for them to rate software for systems they don't have lens profiles for and won't help them sell their software.

[eddie1960]

They won't review the 645z either. I think it's pretty much a company policy. If it isn't a camera that pats the majority of their customers on the back for their terrific brand of choice they don't review it. Anything that kicks the sox off the current Nikon/Canon line up gets ignored.

It makes no sense for them to rate software for systems they don't have lens profiles for and won't help them sell their software.

the arguement against the Xtrans (and the Foveon) is the can't eliminate Demosaicing differences in the different array types. that doesn't wash for the 645Z since it is a bayer array still. Given the Phase one and the Hassleblad both use the exact same Sony sensor (at 3 to 4 x the price) and they can review them..... I just think they don't want to piss on Nikons shoes by testing the Pentax implementation of this sensor because an accurate test would [put it pretty damn neat6 the top of the pile (like the old one was for a while), it's a lot harder to sell your D4 or 1d variant when it's being stomped by a 50mp monster for not much more