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11-06-2014, 11:10 AM   #1
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New Lens or upgrade to FF?

Hello all.
My K30 is now 2 years old, works perfectly, just cosmetic wear&tear. However, I want to step up in my photography as I'm doing more family shoots, portraits and paid work. Whilst I'm proud of my photos from the K30, I can't help but feel I need to upgrade to a camera with more *cough* 'professional' features (quieter, less noise, Full Frame).


Or, my second option is to upgrade lenses. I currently shoot with 50 1.8 and 35mm 2.4 (ie cheap but cheerful) and best photos come from the 50mm) but need something a little wider... I REALLY want the 35mm 1.4. Since that lens would put me back about 650.... I'm not sure whether to just be patient, wait and put the money towards a full frame camera - maybe next year if I can afford.


What would you do or what are you doing if in a similar situation?


Many thanks,
Julie

11-06-2014, 11:23 AM - 1 Like   #2
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Which FF are you considering? FF by Pentax is not out yet (and... will it ever be?), so you must be looking at another brand, possibly using adapters..?
If you are thinking about switching systems, how much money do you have in lenses? how do you think you can recoup & what will it cost you to buy the lenses for a new system?

If you're talking about a Pentax FF, I suggest that you give yourself a time limit (eg. the end of february): if you haven't seen an announcement by then then go on and buy the 35.

BTW... the 35 f/2.4 isn't wider than the 35 f/2.4 (it's still a 35mm)... did you mean the 15mm f/4 or something with a larger max aperture?
11-06-2014, 11:47 AM - 1 Like   #3
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Julie,

I'm no expert, but will just mention my experience. My daughter is getting deeper into professional photography and needed more versatility in lenses, so she recently bought the Sigma 18-35mm F1.8 DC HSM (Art). It is AMAZING! She uses a K-50, and is VERY happy with the results. I even tried it on my K100D Super, and it's amazing there too! She uses it to achieve nice out-of-focus effects (bokeh), and to shoot in low light.

You might get more benefit per money spent in getting good glass than you might get by buying a new camera body. Based on what I have seen both on-line and from my daughter's K-50 (same as your K-30), the body can deliver as good a quality in practical terms as is available on the market (even compared to FF systems).

Another thing to consider is improving your post-processing tools and skills. I am MUCH better at post-processing than I was several years ago, and I still have a lot of room for growth in that area.

-Joe-
11-06-2014, 11:55 AM - 1 Like   #4
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It depends of your photography. For some uses, aps-c is fine or preferable to full frame. F
or others, full frame is the way to go.

11-06-2014, 12:18 PM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by k0og Quote
Julie,

I'm no expert, but will just mention my experience. My daughter is getting deeper into professional photography and needed more versatility in lenses, so she recently bought the Sigma 18-35mm F1.8 DC HSM (Art). It is AMAZING! She uses a K-50, and is VERY happy with the results. I even tried it on my K100D Super, and it's amazing there too! She uses it to achieve nice out-of-focus effects (bokeh), and to shoot in low light.

You might get more benefit per money spent in getting good glass than you might get by buying a new camera body. Based on what I have seen both on-line and from my daughter's K-50 (same as your K-30), the body can deliver as good a quality in practical terms as is available on the market (even compared to FF systems).

Another thing to consider is improving your post-processing tools and skills. I am MUCH better at post-processing than I was several years ago, and I still have a lot of room for growth in that area.

-Joe-
Hi Lensbeginner, thanks for the reply. I did mean a larger max aperture for the wider (ie 35mm) lens. At the moment I shoot mainly with the 50mm as I'm comfortable and like the results of shooting with F1.8. I think the 35mm F1.4 would give me more flexibility and better quality (than my current 35mm 2.4) for family shoots outside. I've got 4 'good value' lenses, the 2 I've mentioned, then the kit lens (I never use now) and a Sigma 70-300 f5 something (again I rarely use).


It's not a bad idea to wait for Ricoh/Pentax for Feb and take action thereafter.


Many thanks again.
11-06-2014, 12:36 PM - 1 Like   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by Julie Whelan Quote
Hi Lensbeginner, thanks for the reply. I did mean a larger max aperture for the wider (ie 35mm) lens. At the moment I shoot mainly with the 50mm as I'm comfortable and like the results of shooting with F1.8. I think the 35mm F1.4 would give me more flexibility and better quality (than my current 35mm 2.4) for family shoots outside. I've got 4 'good value' lenses, the 2 I've mentioned, then the kit lens (I never use now) and a Sigma 70-300 f5 something (again I rarely use).


It's not a bad idea to wait for Ricoh/Pentax for Feb and take action thereafter.


Many thanks again.
You're welcome...
35mm is a pretty nice focal length, roughly equal to what a 50mm was on film cameras...
To be able to use larger apertures is certainly a welcome advantage, though I believe it will be most apparent by night or in interiors (not outside... unless there's little light and then the main benefit would be shallow DoF rather than fast shutter speeds)

Sigma is known for producing very good lenses and very bad cheapo stuff like - probably - your f/4-5.6 or something and my UC 70-210mm, which I'm soon dumping in favor of something better...
11-06-2014, 12:42 PM - 1 Like   #7
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About the shutter noise.

Be advised that so far, no shutter is really silent. The K5/K3 shutters are more silent than the one in the K30.

So far, i know no FF body with a quieter shutter. The sound is not the same (the canon one is less "bass" / more squeaky (i'm not sure i'm clear here) compared to the K5)
.

When it come to other "feature" : what "feature" do you think a "pro body" would give you that your current body doesn't offer ?
(let's put appart the sensor size here.)

About the lenses : in the 35mm you can get the new Sigma "Art" 35/1,4, but it's pricey.
You can get the older 35/1.4 DG (the version before the Art one. DG indicates it can be user on FF).
You can get the 30/1.4 DC (Yes 30mm - DC mean for APS-C only). It vignette a tad wide open, but it's quite sharp. And it is even cheaper.
You can find the 2 latter second hand, and find some bargain.

All this is just a list of what you can found.
11-06-2014, 12:48 PM - 1 Like   #8
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Better to buy a good lens than a camera. Camera bodies get replaces often, a lens will work for a decade, maybe even more; and it will keep its value quite well, too. If you want to improve your photos, lenses first.
If the Sigma 35mm f1.4 art is too expensive, you can look at the Sigma 30mm f1.4, which is a little more affordable. Just look up reviews.

11-06-2014, 01:01 PM - 1 Like   #9
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Even if Pentax came out with a FF soon, your primary lenses won't work with a FF, since they are DA lenses. Wide primes for the asp-c camera are expensive and they usually aren't fast. A used FA or F28mm 2.8 makes a nice standard lens on asp-c and isn't to expensive. It would give you a 46.4 degree horizontal field of view, compared to 27 degrees with a 50mm on asp-c. I really like my F28/2.8 on my K5.
11-06-2014, 01:14 PM   #10
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Original Poster
QuoteOriginally posted by k0og Quote
Julie,

I'm no expert, but will just mention my experience. My daughter is getting deeper into professional photography and needed more versatility in lenses, so she recently bought the Sigma 18-35mm F1.8 DC HSM (Art). It is AMAZING! She uses a K-50, and is VERY happy with the results. I even tried it on my K100D Super, and it's amazing there too! She uses it to achieve nice out-of-focus effects (bokeh), and to shoot in low light.

You might get more benefit per money spent in getting good glass than you might get by buying a new camera body. Based on what I have seen both on-line and from my daughter's K-50 (same as your K-30), the body can deliver as good a quality in practical terms as is available on the market (even compared to FF systems).

Another thing to consider is improving your post-processing tools and skills. I am MUCH better at post-processing than I was several years ago, and I still have a lot of room for growth in that area.

-Joe-
To: K0og - Thank you Joe! This sounds just like me. I will look into that sigma lens, especially if you think it is amazing! I like the sound of that. About benefit per money spent, that's what I was wondering what you all would think.


I'm happy with the results of my K30 but (sadly) jealous when I see peers upgrading to FF or much more expensive cameras than mine. But, as they say... it's not the camera, it's the person behind it, right? Using the 50mm 1.8, I do get a lot out of my K30 and excellent results, maybe I should just trust it (and myself) a bit more and just get a new lens.


And yes to post processing improvements. I, too, have learned a lot in the past couple of years. I mainly work in Lightroom but am going to try my hand at photoshop. I'm not a big photoshopper but there are things some customers want that I need to adhere to (eg airbrushing if they request).


Thanks for the advice.
Best wishes,
Julie

---------- Post added 11-06-14 at 08:20 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by aurele Quote
About the shutter noise.

Be advised that so far, no shutter is really silent. The K5/K3 shutters are more silent than the one in the K30.

So far, i know no FF body with a quieter shutter. The sound is not the same (the canon one is less "bass" / more squeaky (i'm not sure i'm clear here) compared to the K5)
.

When it come to other "feature" : what "feature" do you think a "pro body" would give you that your current body doesn't offer ?
(let's put appart the sensor size here.)

About the lenses : in the 35mm you can get the new Sigma "Art" 35/1,4, but it's pricey.
You can get the older 35/1.4 DG (the version before the Art one. DG indicates it can be user on FF).
You can get the 30/1.4 DC (Yes 30mm - DC mean for APS-C only). It vignette a tad wide open, but it's quite sharp. And it is even cheaper.
You can find the 2 latter second hand, and find some bargain.

All this is just a list of what you can found.
thank you so much Aurele! You make me question the need to upgrade my camera and I think that is what I am wondering myself. thanks much for the list of lenses to check out. I like the sound of the older 35/1.4 DG and the 30/1.4 DC. I will go off now to compare prices!


best wishes.
11-06-2014, 01:27 PM - 1 Like   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by Julie Whelan Quote
To: K0og - Thank you Joe! This sounds just like me. I will look into that sigma lens, especially if you think it is amazing! I like the sound of that. About benefit per money spent, that's what I was wondering what you all would think.


I'm happy with the results of my K30 but (sadly) jealous when I see peers upgrading to FF or much more expensive cameras than mine. But, as they say... it's not the camera, it's the person behind it, right? Using the 50mm 1.8, I do get a lot out of my K30 and excellent results, maybe I should just trust it (and myself) a bit more and just get a new lens.


And yes to post processing improvements. I, too, have learned a lot in the past couple of years. I mainly work in Lightroom but am going to try my hand at photoshop. I'm not a big photoshopper but there are things some customers want that I need to adhere to (eg airbrushing if they request).


Thanks for the advice.
Best wishes,
Julie

---------- Post added 11-06-14 at 08:20 PM ----------


thank you so much Aurele! You make me question the need to upgrade my camera and I think that is what I am wondering myself. thanks much for the list of lenses to check out. I like the sound of the older 35/1.4 DG and the 30/1.4 DC. I will go off now to compare prices!


best wishes.
Don't be jealous...
FF is very good in low light situations, but not good for, e.g., birding, when you need reach (and a crop is welcome).
Moreover, all the lenses that look "good" or "passable" on APS-C (e.g. vintage lenses) could look very bad on FF (corner/edge sharpness, vignettting etc.)
So enjoy what you have!
11-06-2014, 01:30 PM   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by Big Dave Quote
Even if Pentax came out with a FF soon, your primary lenses won't work with a FF, since they are DA lenses. Wide primes for the asp-c camera are expensive and they usually aren't fast. A used FA or F28mm 2.8 makes a nice standard lens on asp-c and isn't to expensive. It would give you a 46.4 degree horizontal field of view, compared to 27 degrees with a 50mm on asp-c. I really like my F28/2.8 on my K5.
Hi Big Dave, about my current prime lenses not working with FF.... yes, that's what I'm worried about spending big money on a good lens, especially if I change/upgrade cameras. I would have to start anew which is what scares me. Thanks for the recommendation of the F28mm/2.8. Again, I will look into this lens as a possibility. Thanks so much!

---------- Post added 11-06-14 at 08:32 PM ----------

Gosh, you all are so helpful. I am leaning more to getting a new lens and have a good list (thanks to you) to go investigate. Really appreciated!

---------- Post added 11-06-14 at 08:33 PM ----------

Gosh, you all are so helpful. I am leaning more to getting a new lens and have a good list (thanks to you) to go investigate. Really appreciated!
11-06-2014, 01:35 PM - 1 Like   #13
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One more thing. Many DA lenses already work on FF. Thread here:
https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/10-pentax-slr-lens-discussion/31629-da-le...ts-thread.html
As do all legacy lenses (FA, F, A, M series) and DFA lenses. And even if FF comes out and you use crop lenses, you can still crop the photos and they will look good
11-06-2014, 01:42 PM - 1 Like   #14
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QuoteOriginally posted by Julie Whelan Quote
Hi Big Dave, about my current prime lenses not working with FF.... yes, that's what I'm worried about spending big money on a good lens, especially if I change/upgrade cameras. I would have to start anew which is what scares me. Thanks for the recommendation of the F28mm/2.8. Again, I will look into this lens as a possibility. Thanks so much![COLOR="Silver"]
Both your 35mm and your 50mm will work fine on FF: https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/10-pentax-slr-lens-discussion/31629-da-le...ts-thread.html

(the first post hasn't been updated in some time but there are tests inside of your 50mm https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/10-pentax-slr-lens-discussion/31629-da-le...ml#post2682671)
11-06-2014, 01:45 PM - 1 Like   #15
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I have 35mm 2.4 and 50mm 1.8 and I used as well Sigma 35mm 1.4 Art and I can vouch that you wont regret if you get the Sigma. Sharpness on the Sigma lens is just unbelievable and if you blow up the pics there will be clear difference. Color cast is very good and auto-focus is just fine on K-3 (also silent). Will take few micro-adjustments for AF to be locked on but then it is spot on. On my K-3 had a nice balance while I have battery grip installed but just on the K-3 it is nose heavy and slightly difficult to handle (my uncle experience, who on my suggestion got himself K-3 and this lens... switched from Canon and Zeiss lens and never regret it. He just raves about quality of the K-3 an Sigma combo). Hope this will help. :-)

Here is the lens I was talking about and review as well. IMHO this is the best combo for Pentax.
https://www.pentaxforums.com/reviews/sigma-35mm-f14-art/introduction.html

Last edited by RAART; 11-06-2014 at 01:50 PM. Reason: Added link for review
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