“I will not buy the FF, if _____"

asp1880 · 02-06-2015, 01:22 PM

I won't buy the Pentax FF if it has all the AF points lumped together in the middle of the frame. I fear that will be the case because the tentative specs list the same AF system as in the K-3.

Oh well. I wasn't going to buy it regardless.

Regards,
--Anders.

**jac** · 02-06-2015, 01:27 PM

Originally posted by Bruce Clark

I will not buy a Pentax FF if........It does not support a new focus mode that I will call AF.T. (Auto Focus. Telepathy) This is a thought controlled auto focus system. This camera must be able to read my mind and focus exactly on what I am thinking and disregard it's sensors.

And self-propelled, Bruce. My old legs get tired crawling around on the ground for the perfect macro or climbing the nearest mountain to get that perfect perspective. Maybe one of them cute little four-prop helo's fitted out AS-T (Auto Scene, Telepathy) Heck, with that I won't even have to leave the couch.

Pioneer · 02-06-2015, 01:28 PM

It is hard to say what I will be buying in the future.

Right now I am saving for a digital 645, probably the D as I like the image quality I get with that great big CCD sensor. Yes I know Tuco, it isn't full 645, but it still remains larger than 35mm, just like the film 645 was. And bigger is still better.

But I am glad that Ricoh seems to have decided to go ahead with a full frame Pentax camera. I just hope the current, terrible, camera market doesn't kill it before it makes it from prototype to the store shelf.

Joel B · 02-06-2015, 04:02 PM

No LED lights? No go! It needs to be sexy!
Everybody sing along: I'm too sexy for full frame, too sexy for full frame, so sexy it's insane!
Sexy meaning broke!!

Anthen · 02-06-2015, 07:29 PM

I will not buy FF if... it still hasn't come out at the end of this year. Why do I have a bad feeling about this?

jake14mw · 02-09-2015, 06:28 AM

Simple answer that I thought more people would have:

I will not buy the full frame if it is not a good value for me. If it costs $2500 and is a K-3 with mildly updated specs, I will instantly forget about it. If it has an updated AF system, that will make it interesting. If the flash system is updated, that will make it interesting to me. I would expect wifi and other advancements. A camera is a tool. The size of the sensor is just one factor. i guess the real question is, how much of a premium is a FF sensor itself worth to you? How much would you pay to have a K3 updated with a FF sensor? For me, it's not that much, maybe $400.

Clavius · 02-09-2015, 06:32 AM

I will not buy the Pentax FF camera, if it doesn't enter the market at all.

Cynog Ap Brychan · 02-09-2015, 07:04 AM

Originally posted by jake14mw

I will not buy the full frame if it is not a good value for me. If it costs $2500 and is a K-3 with mildly updated specs, I will instantly forget about it. If it has an updated AF system, that will make it interesting. If the flash system is updated, that will make it interesting to me. I would expect wifi and other advancements. A camera is a tool. The size of the sensor is just one factor. i guess the real question is, how much of a premium is a FF sensor itself worth to you? How much would you pay to have a K3 updated with a FF sensor? For me, it's not that much, maybe $400.

I would be happy with a K-3 with a full-frame sensor, but it's a good point about value for money. 36 Mpx would be great, but I'd manage with 24 (or 54, or anything in between). If I was looking for improvements to the K-3, I'd put a really good tracking AF capability with a wide spread of points at the top of my list. I know many people would like to see a flash sync speed of 1/250 rather than 1/180, but that's never been a problem for me, and I'm not too fussed about articulating screens, WiFi, movie mode or GPS (but if those help to sell cameras, that's fine by me). I'd be interested in a set of good primes, however: that would be more of a selling point for me. A 24 f2 or faster would be a good start, and something in the range of 85-105 f1.8-ish.

Blue · 02-09-2015, 09:44 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by wibbly

Its just a prototype announcement and the place explodes. Hard to navigate through it all right now.

Where have you been the past 14 years? This is the first official ff announcement since the MZ-D.

Blue · 02-09-2015, 09:45 AM

I won't bye it if it doesn't have screw drive for the FA LTD's etc.

Parallax · 02-09-2015, 09:57 AM

Originally posted by Blue

I won't bye it if it doesn't have screw drive for the FA LTD's etc.

So if it does you'll bye? Get two; bye-bye.

Joel B · 02-09-2015, 10:27 AM

Originally posted by Parallax

So if does you'll bye? Get two; bye-bye.

zzeitg · 02-09-2015, 10:27 AM

Originally posted by Cynog Ap Brychan

but I'd manage with 24

would there be any benefit compared to K-3? Am I wrong supposing that first 36Mpx+ you'll get more from FF than from APS-C (K-3 resolution)?

Originally posted by Blue

I won't bye it if it doesn't have screw drive for the FA LTD's etc.

I really really hope that any Pentax camera (FF or APS-C) at least in the nearest 10 years (or rather 20 years...) will have screw drive. Or I'll buy 5 pcs K-3 and use them until I'll retire (and hope that there's not any controlled operating life time encoded in the firmware...).

LFLee · 02-09-2015, 10:39 AM

Personally I won't buy it if the AF has not improve significantly.... granted I didn't 'upgrade' to K3 (no longer wanted APSC camera), and not sure how much AF have improved in K3.
Please don't take the short cut and use the K3 AF in the new FF.

My K5IIs and K5 both prefer focus on the background than on the subject in the foreground... (just like digitalrev review found out about SONY A7R camera), very annoying.
Autofocus, or a screen that helps manual focus is important factor for me.

noser · 02-09-2015, 10:49 AM - **1 Like**

I can't think of a single thing that would stop me from buying the FF, except maybe if it doesn't actually take photos.

So here are 20 things I could care less about:

1. Name on the body; I'd prefer Pentax, but whatevs.

2. Flippy screen - I used to be against it; so long as it stays put and I don't rip it off by accident, I'm ok.

3. Cost relative to 750/810/etc - don't care. Replacing all that glass? Way more $.

4. Has/doesn't have NFC, WiFi or GPS. Whatevs.

5. Stupid crop mode implementation without a lot of user-override options (square! nocrop! bring it on!) But I'd live with whatever they decide to do with DA's. I'd probably dump the few I have anyway.

6. EVF - I used to be dead-set against these, but I could see some sort of hybrid VF being a surprise item. I generally dislike EVF's for long duration tripod shooting (ie hours/days) because of battery drain, but for focus peaking at f/1.4 I could see a use. The massive prism housing screams OVF, so at worst it's hybrid.

7. Actual resolution. 36MP seems to be the best guess. I'd be ok with anything in the 20's. 36 seems to be pushing it a bit; I'd rather have an excellent ISO 12800 shot at 24MP than a 'meh' shot at 36 (or 51... cough... 5ds... cough).

8. Flash sync. I can get by with 1/180. I'd love 1/250, but I doubt it's going to happen.

9. Lens mount; I'd love them to bring back the feedback lever instead of the green button thing on older A lenses. But whatever. I still shoot m42 from time to time, and no one complains about missing that coupler, do they?

10. Video mode; it can't possibly get any worse, can it?

11. AA simulation via SR vs no AA / with AA filter models. Whatev.

12. SR with only 3 stops instead of 5 or 10 or whatever. Whatever.

13. Framerate; 2 fps? 5 fps? 7 fps? 12 fps(lol). Ya, whatever; it'll be fast enough.

14. SD vs Anything Else memory; and at least two slots. 2 slots is kinda a given, and I'll just buy more of whatever I need; flash memory doesn't work forever, and mine is due for a replacement

15. AF module. It's gonna be some silly thing with 27 points clustered in the center 5% of the screen area, right? Which is just fine with me; I shoot pretty much everything with center point focus anyway.

16. Ports for Audio level monitoring; assuming I start shooting pro-level video (and assuming it could even do that), then I'd probably do offboard audio on dedicated hardware and only use internal audio as a sync.

17. Ports for external uncompressed HDMI; probably will never happen, and won't happen on the first gen body. I'd like to have the output stay on while recording, but since I don't expect much from video (ie the broken 645Z video exposure/preview workflow), whatevs; it's not why I'm buying it anyway.

18. Mode dial lock button. There is no going back on this, so I'd be surprised if it was absent. It's probably the only thing I like about the K-5 ergonomics, now that I think about it.

19. Decorative LED's - I poked fun at the K-S1, but that crowd has a very nice camera and they can disable the disco lights if desired. They don't appear in the 3D prototype, so I'm not worried - whatever.

20. Anyone elses opinion on whether I 'need' this camera or format or not. I held off on the K-3 to check out the 645Z, and decided to wait a bit more for the FF to compare the two. I'll probably end up with both in the end, but not right away. I do need a new body though; the K-5 is getting worn-in, and the K20D backup is getting worn out.

Bonus item 21. Yet another battery type, and $750 grip; probably won't happen, right? Right?

The only thing that would really cheese me off is if they didn't make enough, or if they have a really crappy pre-order process.

02-09-2015, 09:57 AM	#116
Parallax Senior Moderator Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: South Dakota Photos: Gallery Posts: 19,332	Originally posted by Blue I won't bye it if it doesn't have screw drive for the FA LTD's etc. So if it does you'll bye? Get two; bye-bye. Last edited by Parallax; 02-09-2015 at 10:46 AM.

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
what happen if i shoot with the "back" of the film instead of the "front" ?	aurele	Film Processing, Scanning, and Darkroom	20	07-03-2013 08:21 AM
When the FF is fixed, we will have the unmatched "SUPER CAMERA"	Eric Seavey	Pentax K-5 & K-5 II	58	10-08-2012 11:10 AM
Would you buy the first FF if it is a K-01 or wait for the FF DSLR?	slackercruster	Pentax DSLR Discussion	19	07-18-2012 10:09 PM
What FOV will i get if i attach DA limiteds to a FF	nirVaan	Pentax SLR Lens Discussion	9	03-18-2012 01:32 PM
Is Olympus now "dead" ... ?! If so, who will buy it out ... Pentax/Rioch, maybe?!	Jean Poitiers	Photographic Industry and Professionals	14	11-11-2011 01:05 PM

02-06-2015, 01:22 PM	#106
asp1880 Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Lyngby, Copenhagen Photos: Albums Posts: 742	I won't buy the Pentax FF if it has all the AF points lumped together in the middle of the frame. I fear that will be the case because the tentative specs list the same AF system as in the K-3. Oh well. I wasn't going to buy it regardless. Regards, --Anders.

02-06-2015, 01:27 PM	#107
jac Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Clyde River, Nunavut, Canada Posts: 2,364	Originally posted by Bruce Clark I will not buy a Pentax FF if........It does not support a new focus mode that I will call AF.T. (Auto Focus. Telepathy) This is a thought controlled auto focus system. This camera must be able to read my mind and focus exactly on what I am thinking and disregard it's sensors. And self-propelled, Bruce. My old legs get tired crawling around on the ground for the perfect macro or climbing the nearest mountain to get that perfect perspective. Maybe one of them cute little four-prop helo's fitted out AS-T (Auto Scene, Telepathy) Heck, with that I won't even have to leave the couch.

02-06-2015, 01:28 PM	#108
Pioneer Pentaxian Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Wandering the Streets Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,411	It is hard to say what I will be buying in the future. Right now I am saving for a digital 645, probably the D as I like the image quality I get with that great big CCD sensor. Yes I know Tuco, it isn't full 645, but it still remains larger than 35mm, just like the film 645 was. And bigger is still better. But I am glad that Ricoh seems to have decided to go ahead with a full frame Pentax camera. I just hope the current, terrible, camera market doesn't kill it before it makes it from prototype to the store shelf.

02-06-2015, 04:02 PM	#109
Joel B Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Barnett MO. Photos: Albums Posts: 2,336	No LED lights? No go! It needs to be sexy! Everybody sing along: I'm too sexy for full frame, too sexy for full frame, so sexy it's insane! Sexy meaning broke!!

02-06-2015, 07:29 PM	#110
Anthen Forum Member Join Date: Mar 2014 Posts: 79	I will not buy FF if... it still hasn't come out at the end of this year. Why do I have a bad feeling about this?

02-09-2015, 06:28 AM	#111
jake14mw Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Connecticut, USA Posts: 977	Simple answer that I thought more people would have: I will not buy the full frame if it is not a good value for me. If it costs $2500 and is a K-3 with mildly updated specs, I will instantly forget about it. If it has an updated AF system, that will make it interesting. If the flash system is updated, that will make it interesting to me. I would expect wifi and other advancements. A camera is a tool. The size of the sensor is just one factor. i guess the real question is, how much of a premium is a FF sensor itself worth to you? How much would you pay to have a K3 updated with a FF sensor? For me, it's not that much, maybe $400.

02-09-2015, 06:32 AM	#112
Clavius Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: De Klundert Photos: Gallery Posts: 4,150	I will not buy the Pentax FF camera, if it doesn't enter the market at all.

02-09-2015, 07:04 AM	#113
Cynog Ap Brychan Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: Gloucester Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,199	Originally posted by jake14mw I will not buy the full frame if it is not a good value for me. If it costs $2500 and is a K-3 with mildly updated specs, I will instantly forget about it. If it has an updated AF system, that will make it interesting. If the flash system is updated, that will make it interesting to me. I would expect wifi and other advancements. A camera is a tool. The size of the sensor is just one factor. i guess the real question is, how much of a premium is a FF sensor itself worth to you? How much would you pay to have a K3 updated with a FF sensor? For me, it's not that much, maybe $400. I would be happy with a K-3 with a full-frame sensor, but it's a good point about value for money. 36 Mpx would be great, but I'd manage with 24 (or 54, or anything in between). If I was looking for improvements to the K-3, I'd put a really good tracking AF capability with a wide spread of points at the top of my list. I know many people would like to see a flash sync speed of 1/250 rather than 1/180, but that's never been a problem for me, and I'm not too fussed about articulating screens, WiFi, movie mode or GPS (but if those help to sell cameras, that's fine by me). I'd be interested in a set of good primes, however: that would be more of a selling point for me. A 24 f2 or faster would be a good start, and something in the range of 85-105 f1.8-ish.

02-09-2015, 09:44 AM - 1 Like	#114
Blue Moderator Site Supporter Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Florida Hill Country Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 17,377	Originally posted by wibbly Its just a prototype announcement and the place explodes. Hard to navigate through it all right now. Where have you been the past 14 years? This is the first official ff announcement since the MZ-D.

02-09-2015, 09:45 AM	#115
Blue Moderator Site Supporter Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Florida Hill Country Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 17,377	I won't bye it if it doesn't have screw drive for the FA LTD's etc.

02-09-2015, 10:27 AM	#117
Joel B Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Barnett MO. Photos: Albums Posts: 2,336	Originally posted by Parallax So if does you'll bye? Get two; bye-bye.

02-09-2015, 10:27 AM	#118
zzeitg Pentaxian Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: South Bohemia Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 4,017	Originally posted by Cynog Ap Brychan but I'd manage with 24 would there be any benefit compared to K-3? Am I wrong supposing that first 36Mpx+ you'll get more from FF than from APS-C (K-3 resolution)? Originally posted by Blue I won't bye it if it doesn't have screw drive for the FA LTD's etc. I really really hope that any Pentax camera (FF or APS-C) at least in the nearest 10 years (or rather 20 years...) will have screw drive. Or I'll buy 5 pcs K-3 and use them until I'll retire (and hope that there's not any controlled operating life time encoded in the firmware...).

02-09-2015, 10:39 AM	#119
LFLee Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Southern California Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,292 Original Poster	Personally I won't buy it if the AF has not improve significantly.... granted I didn't 'upgrade' to K3 (no longer wanted APSC camera), and not sure how much AF have improved in K3. Please don't take the short cut and use the K3 AF in the new FF. My K5IIs and K5 both prefer focus on the background than on the subject in the foreground... (just like digitalrev review found out about SONY A7R camera), very annoying. Autofocus, or a screen that helps manual focus is important factor for me.

02-09-2015, 10:49 AM - 1 Like	#120
noser Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Calgary, AB CA Photos: Gallery Posts: 292	I can't think of a single thing that would stop me from buying the FF, except maybe if it doesn't actually take photos. So here are 20 things I could care less about: 1. Name on the body; I'd prefer Pentax, but whatevs. 2. Flippy screen - I used to be against it; so long as it stays put and I don't rip it off by accident, I'm ok. 3. Cost relative to 750/810/etc - don't care. Replacing all that glass? Way more $. 4. Has/doesn't have NFC, WiFi or GPS. Whatevs. 5. Stupid crop mode implementation without a lot of user-override options (square! nocrop! bring it on!) But I'd live with whatever they decide to do with DA's. I'd probably dump the few I have anyway. 6. EVF - I used to be dead-set against these, but I could see some sort of hybrid VF being a surprise item. I generally dislike EVF's for long duration tripod shooting (ie hours/days) because of battery drain, but for focus peaking at f/1.4 I could see a use. The massive prism housing screams OVF, so at worst it's hybrid. 7. Actual resolution. 36MP seems to be the best guess. I'd be ok with anything in the 20's. 36 seems to be pushing it a bit; I'd rather have an excellent ISO 12800 shot at 24MP than a 'meh' shot at 36 (or 51... cough... 5ds... cough). 8. Flash sync. I can get by with 1/180. I'd love 1/250, but I doubt it's going to happen. 9. Lens mount; I'd love them to bring back the feedback lever instead of the green button thing on older A lenses. But whatever. I still shoot m42 from time to time, and no one complains about missing that coupler, do they? 10. Video mode; it can't possibly get any worse, can it? 11. AA simulation via SR vs no AA / with AA filter models. Whatev. 12. SR with only 3 stops instead of 5 or 10 or whatever. Whatever. 13. Framerate; 2 fps? 5 fps? 7 fps? 12 fps(lol). Ya, whatever; it'll be fast enough. 14. SD vs Anything Else memory; and at least two slots. 2 slots is kinda a given, and I'll just buy more of whatever I need; flash memory doesn't work forever, and mine is due for a replacement 15. AF module. It's gonna be some silly thing with 27 points clustered in the center 5% of the screen area, right? Which is just fine with me; I shoot pretty much everything with center point focus anyway. 16. Ports for Audio level monitoring; assuming I start shooting pro-level video (and assuming it could even do that), then I'd probably do offboard audio on dedicated hardware and only use internal audio as a sync. 17. Ports for external uncompressed HDMI; probably will never happen, and won't happen on the first gen body. I'd like to have the output stay on while recording, but since I don't expect much from video (ie the broken 645Z video exposure/preview workflow), whatevs; it's not why I'm buying it anyway. 18. Mode dial lock button. There is no going back on this, so I'd be surprised if it was absent. It's probably the only thing I like about the K-5 ergonomics, now that I think about it. 19. Decorative LED's - I poked fun at the K-S1, but that crowd has a very nice camera and they can disable the disco lights if desired. They don't appear in the 3D prototype, so I'm not worried - whatever. 20. Anyone elses opinion on whether I 'need' this camera or format or not. I held off on the K-3 to check out the 645Z, and decided to wait a bit more for the FF to compare the two. I'll probably end up with both in the end, but not right away. I do need a new body though; the K-5 is getting worn-in, and the K20D backup is getting worn out. Bonus item 21. Yet another battery type, and $750 grip; probably won't happen, right? Right? The only thing that would really cheese me off is if they didn't make enough, or if they have a really crappy pre-order process.