Forgot Password
Pentax Camera Forums Home
 

Reply
Show Printable Version Search this Thread
03-03-2015, 06:13 PM   #121
Junior Member




Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 37
Original Poster
QuoteOriginally posted by Caribe Quote
As a result of a previous thread, another member gave an estimation of around $1900.00, for the U.S., give or take a couple of hundreds for some adjustments.
I am quoting myself here to make it short. If you want to read the complete post go to the original post of this thread.
I still would like to read some discussion regarding the possible price difference from the euro and the $$$$. Some suggest near $3000.00, that would make it around $1000.00 dollars more expensive than in Europe. Please refer to the above discussion and remember that pentaxforum.com was reassured of the euro price, (not that pentaxforums.com is confirming the price). I understand that even if the price is low it will be a quality pentax machine, my concern could be leaving features out for some reason. But judging from the video of pentax executives, something surprisingly good will happen.
So, again, why $1000.00 more expensive? And hey, I am not betting my money on any price!

---------- Post added 03-03-15 at 09:37 PM ----------

If a newly developed pentax ff is announced for october this year, they should at least be testing for quality issues on pre production models and the production engineers might be busy with production lines and assembly issues. Dates for arriving at BandH are already set. Everybody in the Pentax FF proyect is having a little less sleep these days. IMO, if those that think there's no camera built yet are correct, it means that this one is for next year!


Last edited by Caribe; 03-03-2015 at 07:42 PM.
03-03-2015, 08:00 PM   #122
New Member
SimplyCreativePhotography's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Drayton, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 21
Just over 30 years ago, I purchased my first SLR with a small gift of money I had received. I bought a fully manual Cosina. One of the "features" pointed out by the sales guy was that it had a Pentax K mount. I'd never heard of Cosina, but I was familiar with Pentax. (although I always wanted one of the Canon's that looked so great in the Sears Wishbook) And while I said I wanted a fully manual camera, what I really wanted was to save some money and not pay for automatic features. My second SLR was actually a Pentax MZ7 because I'm also all about loyalty and very rarely buy what everyone else is buying. So all that to say I'm one of those "cheap" Pentax users.

When I purchased my K10D in 2007, (after doing all the research to see what I could get with my limited dollars) there were a couple of major deciding factors: I could use my existing lens, (sadly a kit lens) Pentax had in-body image stabilization so that just made sense, and native DNG. It didn't take long for the kit lens to go the way of the DoDo bird and be replaced by an FA31. Since then, I've added an FA77, DA*16-50, DA*50-135, and a Sigma fisheye. I've also migrated from my original K10D to K20D, K7, and K5. The K3 was not worth the upgrade for me but I know I will find a way to justify the new FF.

I've spent some money on glass and suspect that I may represent part of the market that Pentax/Ricoh is interested in. People who want value, a secondary brand with a certain niche "snob appeal" (admit it, you like to look down on Canikon users because they obviously just read marketing propaganda and don't really understand the concept of quality) I don't like to waste money, but I have enough disposable income to spend it when I decide something is worth spending on.

I have nothing to base this on other than what I'm willing to spend. For me, that price point will need to drop below $2K fairly shortly after release, or I will likely just keep carrying my K5 and knapsack full of prime and * lenses around until it does. This is not scientific, but it's my reality, and I suspect I represent a segment of the market they want to make sure they retain.
03-03-2015, 08:21 PM   #123
Veteran Member




Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,893
QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
Why are you so stuck on market share? We've explained, they don't have the resources to compete for market share. No matter what they release it will be a low-volume product. They're not going to have a 100,000 unit a year camera - they're just not. They've improved a lot of the technology Hoya ignored, but they have a long way to go. In the USA Denver has done a good job fixing the worst of the Hoya damage, but they have a long way to go. We're not really a market for Pentax yet.

No one really wants a $2,000 K-3 with a bigger sensor - we already have a $800 K-3.
No one really wants a $2,000 D750 - the Pentax FF could have been a D750, but . . . . too late.
People will pay for a D810 at a slightly lower price - that's how they'll make money on a low-volume product.. D810 is $2,999 street right now. $2,699 - $2,799 feels about right to me.

I HOPE there's going to be weeping and wailing and gnashing of teeth, beating of breasts and rending of garments when the actual price is revealed.

If we really get a $2,000 camera that's bad news. It means they don't have the technology to compete with a D810. That's my fear (and it might be closer to the truth than I want to accept)
$1900 is a good deal more expensive than a D610. It's a good deal less expensive than a D810. I'm with you, I think it should compete with the D810, but we'll see.
03-03-2015, 09:10 PM   #124
Senior Member




Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Far North Qld, Australia
Posts: 179
QuoteOriginally posted by SimplyCreativePhotography Quote
I've spent some money on glass and suspect that I may represent part of the market that Pentax/Ricoh is interested in. People who want value, a secondary brand with a certain niche "snob appeal" (admit it, you like to look down on Canikon users because they obviously just read marketing propaganda and don't really understand the concept of quality) I don't like to waste money, but I have enough disposable income to spend it when I decide something is worth spending on.
I have nothing to base this on other than what I'm willing to spend. For me, that price point will need to drop below $2K fairly shortly after release, or I will likely just keep carrying my K5 and knapsack full of prime and * lenses around until it does. This is not scientific, but it's my reality, and I suspect I represent a segment of the market they want to make sure they retain.

I agree with this. Pentax is known for its value for money. I see its main competition being the Nikon D610 and the like.

03-03-2015, 09:45 PM   #125
Ash
Community Manager
Loyal Site Supporter
Ash's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Toowoomba, Queensland
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 22,687
QuoteOriginally posted by curlednoodles Quote
I agree with this. Pentax is known for its value for money. I see its main competition being the Nikon D610 and the like.
Value for money does not equate to being cheap.
The FF body should be a rival to competitor flagship prosumer models rather than their base model, so I don't see it being a D600/610 contender, but a higher end 5DS/D800/810 contender.
It has got to be a camera non-Pentaxians would want to consider for an investment in the Pentax/K-mount system.
03-04-2015, 06:21 AM - 2 Likes   #126
Emperor and Senpai
VoiceOfReason's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Nashville, IN
Posts: 5,368
Okay, I will say it for any marketing people that might read this thread. I will not buy it no matter the features at 3,000 dollars. If it has a 36mp sensor with good dynamic range and ISO range I will buy it in the 1900-2200 price range depending on features. 4k video would be nice, but not necessary for my needs. Wifi, ehh, sure, but not really needed. Dual card slots, yes. Selectable AA filter and WR, yes. Basically, give me the feature set of the K3 with a FF sensor of 36mp improved dynamic range, with the improved ISO range, lower noise, and and I'm good to go as long as it is in the price range I specified with a price point somewhere around the 2k level.
03-04-2015, 06:41 AM   #127
Site Supporter
GeneV's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Albuquerque NM
Photos: Albums
Posts: 9,772
QuoteOriginally posted by SimplyCreativePhotography Quote
Just over 30 years ago, I purchased my first SLR with a small gift of money I had received. I bought a fully manual Cosina. One of the "features" pointed out by the sales guy was that it had a Pentax K mount. I'd never heard of Cosina, but I was familiar with Pentax. (although I always wanted one of the Canon's that looked so great in the Sears Wishbook) And while I said I wanted a fully manual camera, what I really wanted was to save some money and not pay for automatic features. My second SLR was actually a Pentax MZ7 because I'm also all about loyalty and very rarely buy what everyone else is buying. So all that to say I'm one of those "cheap" Pentax users.

When I purchased my K10D in 2007, (after doing all the research to see what I could get with my limited dollars) there were a couple of major deciding factors: I could use my existing lens, (sadly a kit lens) Pentax had in-body image stabilization so that just made sense, and native DNG. It didn't take long for the kit lens to go the way of the DoDo bird and be replaced by an FA31. Since then, I've added an FA77, DA*16-50, DA*50-135, and a Sigma fisheye. I've also migrated from my original K10D to K20D, K7, and K5. The K3 was not worth the upgrade for me but I know I will find a way to justify the new FF.

I've spent some money on glass and suspect that I may represent part of the market that Pentax/Ricoh is interested in. People who want value, a secondary brand with a certain niche "snob appeal" (admit it, you like to look down on Canikon users because they obviously just read marketing propaganda and don't really understand the concept of quality) I don't like to waste money, but I have enough disposable income to spend it when I decide something is worth spending on.

I have nothing to base this on other than what I'm willing to spend. For me, that price point will need to drop below $2K fairly shortly after release, or I will likely just keep carrying my K5 and knapsack full of prime and * lenses around until it does. This is not scientific, but it's my reality, and I suspect I represent a segment of the market they want to make sure they retain.
I have virtually the same history, except my first SLR was more than 40 years ago, and the Cosina body was a screw mount with the brand "Vivitar" on it. I also tend to wait for the price to drop, except for the K10d, which was a good deal when released.
03-04-2015, 07:26 AM   #128
Pentaxian
Wired's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Edmonton, AB
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 2,501
QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
Why are you so stuck on market share? We've explained, they don't have the resources to compete for market share. No matter what they release it will be a low-volume product. They're not going to have a 100,000 unit a year camera - they're just not. They've improved a lot of the technology Hoya ignored, but they have a long way to go. In the USA Denver has done a good job fixing the worst of the Hoya damage, but they have a long way to go. We're not really a market for Pentax yet.

No one really wants a $2,000 K-3 with a bigger sensor - we already have a $800 K-3.
No one really wants a $2,000 D750 - the Pentax FF could have been a D750, but . . . . too late.
People will pay for a D810 at a slightly lower price - that's how they'll make money on a low-volume product.. D810 is $2,999 street right now. $2,699 - $2,799 feels about right to me.

I HOPE there's going to be weeping and wailing and gnashing of teeth, beating of breasts and rending of garments when the actual price is revealed.

If we really get a $2,000€ camera that's bad news. It means they don't have the technology to compete with a D810. That's my fear (and it might be closer to the truth than I want to accept)
yup, we're on the same page here.


I don't know why anyone expects Pentax being able to release all this yummy tech they are promising us along with a 36mp sensor for $2000 USD? It's just not realistic. The argument that Sony's A7R is under $2000 is moot...

they don't need to buy the sensor from Sony because they ARE Sony

For sure Sony is charging a premium to other companies for using their sensors.


Pentax is promising SR and performance that meets/exceeds the weight class. if they are promising us 36mp and a professional grade body (implied by the lens, lack of in-body flash, control layout, etc) then they are going after the 5DMKIII and D810 series of cameras.

For a while I was thinking they would just take the K3 and throw a 35mm sensor in there and be done with it. But after thinking about it more, and them saying they want to hit it out of the park... I am assuming we will see an upgraded AF system, a deep buffer, as high FPS (7fps or so), and a long shot...but a higher flash sync speed.


That being said, the price that is being thrown around by Pentaxeuro I do believe i wishful thinking and not at all accurate.

03-06-2015, 12:42 AM   #129
Site Supporter




Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Western KS
Posts: 53
If the FF is more than $2500 and not as good as the Canon MKIII and others in that range then I'll be seriously considering switching. I've checked into the brands a whole lot, and though I don't like the feel of either Canon or Nikon and their menus confuse the heck out of me, it's either switch brands or spend even more going to medium format, which frankly isn't the wisest option given the file size or the cost. I don't want a 50 mp camera. It wouldn't be a wise business move.
If I the FF is what I'm hoping for (great in low light with low grain and better AF) then I still have to purchase a new 35 and I want an 85, at some point I'll also need a super wide too. My other lenses are FF so it's not like I'll be out a lot. I think they've announced the FF for people like me. Working pro photographers who love pentax but are seeing the limitations and are trying to decide what to do.

Add shitty service with Precision Camera and we've really got some thinking to do. I'm so frustrated with them
03-06-2015, 02:54 AM - 1 Like   #130
Veteran Member
Barry Pearson's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Stockport
Posts: 870
QuoteOriginally posted by VoiceOfReason Quote
Okay, I will say it for any marketing people that might read this thread. I will not buy it no matter the features at 3,000 dollars. If it has a 36mp sensor with good dynamic range and ISO range I will buy it in the 1900-2200 price range depending on features. 4k video would be nice, but not necessary for my needs. Wifi, ehh, sure, but not really needed. Dual card slots, yes. Selectable AA filter and WR, yes. Basically, give me the feature set of the K3 with a FF sensor of 36mp improved dynamic range, with the improved ISO range, lower noise, and and I'm good to go as long as it is in the price range I specified with a price point somewhere around the 2k level.
And I'll say this for any marketing people reading this.

I'll buy a high-specification FF camera at any plausible price. (I'm currently budgeting for up to 2500, more than $3500). I may not buy a more limited FF camera designed to be "affordable". For me, specification trumps price.

(Obviously, I don't want to pay lots of money for the sake of it! I would be happy to buy a high-specification FF cameras for 500! But I'm emphasising that for me, and I suspect a lot of other people, I want lots more from this camera than from my K-3).
03-06-2015, 03:46 AM   #131
Pentaxian
ZeljkoS's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Banja Luka
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 304
It would not be very smart to build anything less than direct competitor to D810 and 5dIII. Actually, they should build something that is even better and more expensive, but not to compromise their MF market.

If Pentax goes in the "budget FF" direction, it will be a mistake. It should be in the same price range as current top players, because of psychology.
People who know what they are buying will get what they know is the best camera for them, regardless of the price.

People who don't do research and have a lot of money are looking at price tags. They will just go and get the expensive one, because they think lower price = compromise/bad quality.

This behavior is seen in other markets, not just camera or consumer electronics etc.
03-06-2015, 04:59 AM   #132
Pentaxian




Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Sweden
Posts: 1,920
QuoteOriginally posted by ZeljkoS Quote
People who don't do research and have a lot of money are looking at price tags. They will just go and get the expensive one, because they think lower price = compromise/bad quality..
They will buy an expensive camera with a name they recognise, nothing else. That means Canikon.
03-06-2015, 05:16 AM   #133
Emperor and Senpai
VoiceOfReason's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Nashville, IN
Posts: 5,368
QuoteOriginally posted by Barry Pearson Quote
And I'll say this for any marketing people reading this.

I'll buy a high-specification FF camera at any plausible price. (I'm currently budgeting for up to 2500, more than $3500). I may not buy a more limited FF camera designed to be "affordable". For me, specification trumps price.

(Obviously, I don't want to pay lots of money for the sake of it! I would be happy to buy a high-specification FF cameras for 500! But I'm emphasising that for me, and I suspect a lot of other people, I want lots more from this camera than from my K-3).
At that price point they may have you and some others here, but they will lose the vast majority of potential buyers. Think about it. You are in 645D territory at that price.
03-06-2015, 05:33 AM   #134
Pentaxian




Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Romania
Posts: 9,104
Since that's Rip-Off Britain price and it's still below D810's MSRP, Barry is entirely reasonable.
I expect it to cost at least as much as the D750. We'll see.

The people looking for a cheap camera will buy something else anyway (or buy nothing, but endless complaining). There's no way Pentax could make a good product, cheaper than heavily discounted models already on the market. So it won't be a Pentax, but some even-more-discounted A7 (already replaced thus cheap), some refurbished D600, etc.

OTOH, Ricoh/Pentax should strive to keep those of us willing to spend real money on their products. You don't do that with cheap products, but with good products.
03-06-2015, 05:40 AM - 1 Like   #135
Pentaxian
ZeljkoS's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Banja Luka
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 304
QuoteOriginally posted by Gimbal Quote
They will buy an expensive camera with a name they recognise, nothing else. That means Canikon.
Sometimes people buy a camera with a name they don't recognize, but only if it's more expensive. Never if it's cheaper.

That said, I doubt the new Pentax FF will be more expensive than Canikons, only if it's much much better than both, and if they have some feature that is never seen before and extremely useful.
Reply

Bookmarks
  • Submit Thread to Facebook Facebook
  • Submit Thread to Twitter Twitter
  • Submit Thread to Digg Digg
Tags - Make this thread easier to find by adding keywords to it!
24x36mm, aps-c, body, cost, crop, da, factor, ff, format, full-frame, glass, images, kids, legacy, lens, lenses, market, mf, pentax, photography, pros, reason, ricoh, sensor, studio, switch, u.s.
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
What do you think the Pentax FF kit lens will be? Sagitta Pentax Full Frame 70 02-16-2015 10:47 AM
What do you think the K70 is going to have? Painter Pentax DSLR Discussion 49 07-10-2014 12:55 AM
So what do you think of the new Sony camera killer? FoTom Non-Pentax Cameras: Canon, Nikon, etc. 42 10-21-2013 02:03 PM
What do you think the replacement for the K-01 will be like? Glen_S Pentax Mirrorless Cameras 74 01-16-2013 09:47 AM
What do you think of Touchscreen for future Pentax DSLR's LeDave Pentax DSLR Discussion 34 03-25-2010 08:31 AM



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 03:24 PM. | See also: NikonForums.com, CanonForums.com part of our network of photo forums!
  • Red (Default)
  • Green
  • Gray
  • Dark
  • Dark Yellow
  • Dark Blue
  • Old Red
  • Old Green
  • Old Gray
  • Dial-Up Style
Hello! It's great to see you back on the forum! Have you considered joining the community?
register
Creating a FREE ACCOUNT takes under a minute, removes ads, and lets you post! [Dismiss]
Top